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      04-15-2016, 12:44 PM   #1
Pparana
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m4 tension struts to go with lcas

Fitted up a set of m4 tension struts to go with the lcas, will post more info and spacer sizes as I complete. I had to order some spacers, once I do final install and testing I will post the part #'s. Drove a bit, no conflicts.

So far,

moves wheel back 1/4 of an inch, correcting some of the lca forward movement.

does not seem to effect alignment, will check later when proper spacers are in.

much better bushing, much less movement. Also there are uniball kits for this joint, I will check that out after testing stock bushing on track. Steering feel is more communicative, esp. braking.
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      04-15-2016, 01:07 PM   #2
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This is very interesting. Does the wheel still get pushed out (toward the fender)? Can you label the tension struts? I don't know what that part looks like.
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      04-15-2016, 01:46 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidpaper View Post
This is very interesting. Does the wheel still get pushed out (toward the fender)? Can you label the tension struts? I don't know what that part looks like.
I believe it is the ///M piece front and center of first pic, you can see the M3/M4 LCA in the background.

Also curious about other affects besides positioning.
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      04-15-2016, 06:55 PM   #4
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When you do your post install alignment what had changed? Surely the caster and toe changed.
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      04-15-2016, 08:08 PM   #5
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Interesting....

I wasnt sure the bushing was going to fit properly.

Was this a direct fit?
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      04-15-2016, 11:44 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by i8ur911 View Post
Interesting....

I wasnt sure the bushing was going to fit properly.

Was this a direct fit?
No, you need spacers.
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      04-15-2016, 11:45 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by jaboyd View Post
When you do your post install alignment what had changed? Surely the caster and toe changed.
.


I would be surprised if they did not, castor for sure. Toe prob slightly.
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      04-16-2016, 12:16 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pparana
Quote:
Originally Posted by i8ur911 View Post
Interesting....

I wasnt sure the bushing was going to fit properly.

Was this a direct fit?
No, you need spacers.
How big (what are your front offsets)?
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      04-16-2016, 08:36 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liquidpaper View Post
How big (what are your front offsets)?
You have to offset the bushing, right now they are not metric spacers, I ordered up some metric spacers, it will prob be 3 mil outside, 20 mil inside. Will know more when they come in.
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      04-18-2016, 06:11 PM   #10
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ok, installed spacers today, To keep the tension arm in the same location as stock a 2mm spacer is needed on the outside, 15 mm spacer is needed on the inside. hole dia (id) is 12mm for the spacers.

If I am lucky I should be able to test drive later this week, maybe align early next if not too far out of spec.

If all is well and schedule clears, I will test on track on the 29th. I have a feeling this should make a huge difference in steering feel, as the bushing replaced was a massive hydro bushing.
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      04-19-2016, 11:03 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pparana View Post
ok, installed spacers today, To keep the tension arm in the same location as stock a 2mm spacer is needed on the outside, 15 mm spacer is needed on the inside. hole dia (id) is 12mm for the spacers.

If I am lucky I should be able to test drive later this week, maybe align early next if not too far out of spec.

If all is well and schedule clears, I will test on track on the 29th. I have a feeling this should make a huge difference in steering feel, as the bushing replaced was a massive hydro bushing.
awesome! whence did you source the spacers?
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      04-20-2016, 03:32 AM   #12
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Woaw Sounds very good! In fact, if I clearely understood, we will be able to modify the front suspension arms on the F2x series like we did on the E8x series!

Only problem I have is the spacer we will have to add on the arm ... Will the structure of the arm and the bushing be strong enough? I remember, when I did the job on my E82, I had to pull the LCA in the subframe with a mallet :P
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      04-20-2016, 02:01 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwalker View Post
awesome! whence did you source the spacers?
aluminumspacers.com, however I may look for a larger od. Material wise its no issue, just in my head.

Drove a few miles, def needs an alignment. Struts added .2 toe out each side, and I think some more neg. camber. I have camber plates and coil overs so your mileage may very.

So far so good, feel is much much improved. I actually know what and where the tires are. Prob. similar to the m2, since using same parts.

Have the car on the rack, doing a few other things, maybe get it out this weekend if I knock out my chores.
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      04-20-2016, 02:02 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fidiman View Post
Woaw Sounds very good! In fact, if I clearely understood, we will be able to modify the front suspension arms on the F2x series like we did on the E8x series!

Only problem I have is the spacer we will have to add on the arm ... Will the structure of the arm and the bushing be strong enough? I remember, when I did the job on my E82, I had to pull the LCA in the subframe with a mallet :P
yes it is very tight, and should be. You have to line it up just so. Stock bushing just extends, like a spacer, not all of stock bushing is hydro. So I see very little difference.
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      04-20-2016, 07:27 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pparana View Post
aluminumspacers.com, however I may look for a larger od. Material wise its no issue, just in my head.
Once you have it dialed in let us know. I'll be doing this next for sure. Also looking forward to at least a mini DIY
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      04-21-2016, 08:50 AM   #16
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This is amazing news. I was hoping someone would do this and key everyone else in on it.
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      04-21-2016, 08:52 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rwalker View Post
Once you have it dialed in let us know. I'll be doing this next for sure. Also looking forward to at least a mini DIY
Didn't know how to tag you rwalker. What I am wondering is if this is the missing link to running a mild drop, aggressive wheels, and m4 LCA.

From what I remember you had all these and rubbed because m4lca pushed you forward too much right? Maybe I'm thinking of cloudxi though.
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      04-21-2016, 08:55 AM   #18
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If it's completely working, that would be fine. We will have the solution for the front axle and the rear axle too thanks to aftermarket arms!
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      04-21-2016, 10:10 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmwilson125 View Post
Didn't know how to tag you rwalker. What I am wondering is if this is the missing link to running a mild drop, aggressive wheels, and m4 LCA.

From what I remember you had all these and rubbed because m4lca pushed you forward too much right? Maybe I'm thinking of cloudxi though.
I run camber plates. Before LCAs I had -2.5deg camber to fit my 255/35r18 fronts on 18x9et36. F8x LCAs introduced another 0.9deg, about 1" of forward movement, leading to rubbing in the front upper part of the fenders, requiring fender rolling.

These tension struts are a partial solution to the forward wheel movement from F8x LCAs, but 1/4" is only ~25% counter to the effect from the LCAs (citing Bee Pee).
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      04-21-2016, 10:38 PM   #20
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finished it up today, did an alignment and some other maintenance.

Honestly I had put coil overs on the car and taken it up to sebring and beat the hell out of it a month ago, so unfortunately it got knocked out of alignment up there and everything in the suspension settled. So my numbers may be off a bit on the drop ext,

I think you loose about 1/2 degree of castor gained by the lcas, gain .2 camber and toe out slightly.

The car feels better to me, more connected, some people, who like a plush ride would not want these. The ride is stiffer, but not as stiff as my 991 or f type, but the ride is also not as refined as either of those. There is better control of the brakes, as the feel is lost in the stock hydro bushing. I can feel the tire slipping now while threshold breaking, and you feel the road reflectors ext when driving.

All and all, if your car is for mixed track, or spirited driving I would say go for it. Not sure how the front would feel on the stock suspension with these, but worth a shot.
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      04-21-2016, 11:05 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pparana View Post
finished it up today, did an alignment and some other maintenance.

Honestly I had put coil overs on the car and taken it up to sebring and beat the hell out of it a month ago, so unfortunately it got knocked out of alignment up there and everything in the suspension settled. So my numbers may be off a bit on the drop ext,

I think you loose about 1/2 degree of castor gained by the lcas, gain .2 camber and toe out slightly.

The car feels better to me, more connected, some people, who like a plush ride would not want these. The ride is stiffer, but not as stiff as my 991 or f type, but the ride is also not as refined as either of those. There is better control of the brakes, as the feel is lost in the stock hydro bushing. I can feel the tire slipping now while threshold breaking, and you feel the road reflectors ext when driving.

All and all, if your car is for mixed track, or spirited driving I would say go for it. Not sure how the front would feel on the stock suspension with these, but worth a shot.
will you adjust OD of the spacers, or are you happy?
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      04-22-2016, 11:45 AM   #22
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Quote:
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will you adjust OD of the spacers, or are you happy?
Ill prob switch to steel, but I want to see if these mar, or get any marks, indicating movement or stress. Ill give it 300-500 miles and then a good dissection.
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