[M235ForNow]

Just took an extended test drive in a '14 base Boxster - manual. Took it flat out up a windy, bumpy, uphill I'm very very familiar with in my 235. I was pretty shocked at how it flowed up the hill instead of getting light and shifting about. And the turn-in around curves is smooth and flat.

Any Porschephiles who can either throw water or gasoline on my smoldering musings? We have my wife's new CRV for anything practical so that's a non-issue.

[paposalsa]

The 1st thing I would be asking is how much an Extended Warranty will cost me ...

[pikcachu]

Originally Posted by M235ForNow

Just took an extended test drive in a '14 base Boxster - manual. Took it flat out up a windy, bumpy, uphill I'm very very familiar with in my 235. I was pretty shocked at how it flowed up the hill instead of getting light and shifting about. And the turn-in around curves is smooth and flat.

Any Porschephiles who can either throw water or gasoline on my smoldering musings? We have my wife's new CRV for anything practical so that's a non-issue.

If you don't need the extra seats then the Porsche will always handle and brake better

[CP911]

In general, you won't regret a Porsche if...

a) you buy an extended warranty or b) you can do basic maintenance and some repairs on your own.

Otherwise, Porsche ownership can be a slippery slope.

I've only driven a 2014 Boxster PDK, and the experience was very uninspiring. It felt rather slow compared to my 2007 Carrera S 6-speed (the car I had at that time) and the PDK transmission made for a dull drive with zero engagement or fun factor. If I'm remembering correctly, it didn't even sound good. Newer Carreras (and possibly Boxsters) with PDK absolutely rip with crazy speed and lightning quick shifts. Perhaps the Boxster S from that generation is worthwhile, but I can say with certainty the base car left me puzzled as to why anyone would spend that kind of money on one. I got out and thought, "What's the point? Might as well drive a Honda Accord." I'm sure the 6-speed provides a better, more engaging experience than the PDK, but if it sounds the same and technically goes slower, I still think there are better cars to be had.

Also, I'm curious what you mean by the M235i "shifting about." The Boxster PDK I drove seemed to have a very soft ride with more body roll than I was expecting. I prefer the suspension setup and turn-in that my M240i provides over that particular Boxster. I'm wondering if you are talking about shifting around on hard throttle applications since the M235i/M240i does get very squirmy when accelerating hard given that it doesn't have a stock limited-slip differential. The Boxster, with no turbo boost and less power and torque, will no doubt feel more sure-footed under max acceleration even though it also doesn't have a LSD. Could this be what you are trying to describe?

[M235ForNow]

Originally Posted by CP911

In general, you won't regret a Porsche if...

a) you buy an extended warranty or b) you can do basic maintenance and some repairs on your own.

Otherwise, Porsche ownership can be a slippery slope.

I've only driven a 2014 Boxster PDK, and the experience was very uninspiring. It felt rather slow compared to my 2007 Carrera S 6-speed (the car I had at that time) and the PDK transmission made for a dull drive with zero engagement or fun factor. If I'm remembering correctly, it didn't even sound good. Newer Carreras (and possibly Boxsters) with PDK absolutely rip with crazy speed and lightning quick shifts. Perhaps the Boxster S from that generation is worthwhile, but I can say with certainty the base car left me puzzled as to why anyone would spend that kind of money on one. I got out and thought, "What's the point? Might as well drive a Honda Accord." I'm sure the 6-speed provides a better, more engaging experience than the PDK, but if it sounds the same and technically goes slower, I still think there are better cars to be had.

Also, I'm curious what you mean by the M235i "shifting about." The Boxster PDK I drove seemed to have a very soft ride with more body roll than I was expecting. I prefer the suspension setup and turn-in that my M240i provides over that particular Boxster. I'm wondering if you are talking about shifting around on hard throttle applications since the M235i/M240i does get very squirmy when accelerating hard given that it doesn't have a stock limited-slip differential. The Boxster, with no turbo boost and less power and torque, will no doubt feel more sure-footed under max acceleration even though it also doesn't have a LSD. Could this be what you are trying to describe?

Actually, I do have an LSD - installed at the port - along with MPE. What I'm describing is a fairly lumpy road surface, with camber changes and elevation changes (humps and dips) coming over a short distance (and more gradual right/lefts). My 235 handles it but doesn't feel confident. More suspension travel and body motion than makes one confident. The Porsche just flowed over it. This is a road I've traveled hundreds of times so I'm super attuned to how a car reacts to it. Porsche was absolutely, hands down, better. Surprised me.

Interesting that you didn't like the sound. To me it's better than my 235 but, then again, almost zero sound ever comes through, other than on the over-run. One of the things that ticks me off. Sounds awesome outside the car. Inside? Nuttin'.

[CP911]

That's interesting for sure. It's hard to argue with your 1st hand experience. I admit I did not drive the Boxster on twisting roads with elevation changes like you are describing, but what you are saying makes sense considering the mid-engine Porsche's claim to fame is its balance and cornering abilities. Perhaps you found the perfect road to exploit its capabilities. As for sound, I have not driven a M235i, so can't really comment on that from the driver's perspective, but I will say my M240i sounds sublime inside or outside, with or without ASD being active. I'd take it all day over the Boxster. I have a feeling the Boxster S 6-speed would have been a totally different story though. My Carrera S 6-speed sounded AMAZING.

[arhoads335i]

You should probably get a boxter s at least.
Also a manual
With that said the Porsche will break down less than any BMW

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by arhoads335i

With that said the Porsche will break down less than any BMW

Although the 911 rates highly, the 2-series is more reliable than the Boxster or Cayman, according to JD Powers 2019 ratings: https://www.jdpower.com/cars/ratings...s-convertibles

[arhoads335i]

Originally Posted by aerobod

Although the 911 rates highly, the 2-series is more reliable than the Boxster or Cayman, according to JD Powers 2019 ratings: https://www.jdpower.com/cars/ratings...s-convertibles

huh interesting! Thanks for pointing that out!

[p912guy]

The 981 has the wonderful normally aspirated flat six, so acceleration will be more linear, however to fully exploit it, you need to keep the revs up which makes for a more engaged driving experience, especially with a MT.

I was between a 981 Boxster and my M235i vert and chose the BMW over the P car for a few reasons, first being it was going to be a DD for me and I needed the trunk space and wanted the interior volume the 2er offered. As a DD, I also appreciated the tech in the 2er as it was generations ahead of the Boxster at the time. While BMW service and maintenance is expensive, Porsche service and maintenance is EXPENSIVE. I can and do a lot of my own vehicle maintenance and repair, especially outside of warranty, but there are times when I need to take it to the dealership or independent because it's just not practical or possible to do the work myself and the thought of the cost of P car maintenance and repair sent cold shivers down my spine. Finally, when it came time to purchase, I was able to get a great deal on my perfect M235i build, which made the decision even easier. I still lust for a 981 or 982 (718 S) so maybe someday I will take the plunge and scratch that itch, but for a DD, my M235i vert with the MT is tough to beat as the perfect overall package.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by p912guy

While BMW service and maintenance is expensive, Porsche service and maintenance is EXPENSIVE. ...the thought of the cost of P car maintenance and repair sent cold shivers down my spine.

I have a friend with a Cayman S, and his oil changes at the dealer are double what mine would cost at the dealer if I didn't still have maintenance.

That's just the P-car tax, though, and if you can handle that I think a Porsche would be pretty nice to have. I can't handle it, and I shudder to think what a major repair would cost.

[Sportstick]

Get in and out a few times in a row. If you haven't hit your head and your lower back still feels ok, that eliminates the reasons I stopped driving the Cayman in our family! You must still be young and flexible!

[p912guy]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Get in and out a few times in a row. If you haven't hit your head and your lower back still feels ok, that eliminates the reasons I stopped driving the Cayman in our family! You must still be young and flexible!

Yes, there's that too. Not only is the Boxster / Cayman lower, but the side sill is a bit wider too. I don't think it'd be an issue for me, but my wife already complains just a bit about how low the 2 is for getting in and out so I am doubtful she'd appreciated getting in and out of a Boxster. And we all know "happy wife = happy life".

[Masterongear]

I upgraded my 15 M235i wheels to 18x8 and 18x9 (19 pounds front 20 back) and went with wider Michelin PS4 tires on front/back (235/40 and 255/35) and the car feels way better all around. Braking, turn radius, acceleration, body roll is gone, and the understeer is night and day better over stock. I would stick with the bimmer or go with the Boxter S, which is a pretty nice car.

[Zwei]

Porsche is good but a 911 is the real deal. Nothing exits corners like a 911. Spoil yourself.

[RvR]

They are different animals. The BMW is an excellent sports coupe, a factory hot rod, if you will, with an outstanding engine, though it shares its platform with the 1 series active tourer and more quotidian BMWs. It has a higher center of gravity, brakes aren't as good if you're moderately pushing it, steering feel nowhere near as good, suspension not as good over rough pavement, etc. As a _car_, the BMW does a lot of things very well, just doesn't compare as well in the pure driving aspect, but then it's not designed or expensed to do that equally.

The 981 Boxster shares many parts with a 911. A bespoke platform that for driving will perform better than the BMW, at a higher cost of purchase and maintenance.

The 981s are reliable, keep in mind they do go through tires more quickly, figure 20K for the rears and 40K for the front, if you have a measured foot, some people go through rears around every 12K, and a set of 19" rears runs $800, 20" are a bit more. As for dealer maintenance, I've found that it ends up being proportional to the MSRP. Porsche makes a superb, if not peerless sports car, but you *will* pay more for it, especially for options if buying new.

It all boils down to how much do you want to pay and what do you want? You can go modest with the base Boxster, move up to S/GTS, go more nuts with a 981 Spyder, or really blow things out and get into the 911 GT3 world.

The advantage to the base 981, you can wring the engine out to get the wonderful howl (above 4200 RPM) without getting into arrest-me-now velocities as quickly as the other variants, plus it's less expensive. The S/GTS has quite a bit more torque that will be seductive, but on the street won't get as many opportunities to wind them out. If you don't want to spend more, don't test drive an S/GTS because you'll end up wanting one.

As for Boxster vs. a Cayman, the Cayman has a bit better front end grip, especially at higher speeds, but to make it as rewarding as a top-down Boxster, you have to do those extra velocities. The Boxster can dawdle much better, and be fun even near the PSL.

Hope this helps.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by RvR

As for dealer maintenance, I've found that it ends up being proportional to the MSRP.

^^^ This.

I call that the First Law of Motor Vehicle Ownership - learned it well and good for the first time back in the mid-70s with a 12-cylinder E-Type Series 3.

[CP911]

Saw the following thread in the M2 Competition section and immediately thought of our discussion here:

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1592562

Granted, OP from that thread is in a higher altitude region, it seems even the new 718 PDK base car with its turbocharger and all provided him a lackluster experience similar to the one I had in the base 981. Again, it sounds like finding the right road is the key to exploiting what these cars have to offer, but should one really have to go out of their way before enjoying a $60k+ car? I'm not convinced that Porsche is doing the right thing with their entry level sports car. Sure, they want to up-sell us to a more expensive model, but if they are driving people to a different brand, it doesn't seem to be working.

[baege]

I moved from a 2016 Cayman s to an m240i coupe xdrive
my 981 had the x73 sport suspension

handling no comparison
engine sound no comparison
normal aspiration throttle response is great

I think the only things you might miss are low end torque (base 981 has NO low end torque) and ride quality

I loved my z4 coupe 3.0si but the 981 definitely brought me to a new level of fun

[RvR]

Originally Posted by CP911

I'm not convinced that Porsche is doing the right thing with their entry level sports car. Sure, they want to up-sell us to a more expensive model, but if they are driving people to a different brand, it doesn't seem to be working.

Porsche chose to respond to the ever-tightening CAFE/CO2 rules by putting the F4T engines in the lowest volume, lowest margin models, the 718s. (Note Ferrari begrudgingly replaced the superb 458 Italia with the turbo 488.) You can see the Boxster/Cayman sales drop between 2016 (last of the 981s) and 2017 (start of the 718.)

The press noticed, too, Evo magazine moved the 718s to 4.5 stars, where the 981s were all 5 stars.

As a business case, because a lower displacement turbo will test better on the
treadmill and they had to make the average look better, some models had to be thrown under the 4 cylinder bus, so to speak, and from a money point of view, that's what happened.

The forthcoming 718 Spyder and GT4 are rumored to have NA 6es, and I expect those to be great cars that will sell like hotcakes.

[stein_325i]

I have a 718 Boxster and I love it, everytime I drive it, it puts a smile on my face. Plus the 2014 has the sweet flat six, and that mixed with the top down is pure heaven. If you've never had a Porsche and you can get the opportunity to buy one, I'd totally recommend it, just make sure you can get a good warranty, because of the placement of the engine, and the amount of labor for these cars, and the sheer number of parts, everything costs a pretty penny.

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by RvR

Porsche chose to respond to the ever-tightening CAFE/CO2 rules by putting the F4T engines in the lowest volume, lowest margin models, the 718s. (Note Ferrari begrudgingly replaced the superb 458 Italia with the turbo 488.) You can see the Boxster/Cayman sales drop between 2016 (last of the 981s) and 2017 (start of the 718.)

The press noticed, too, Evo magazine moved the 718s to 4.5 stars, where the 981s were all 5 stars.

As a business case, because a lower displacement turbo will test better on the
treadmill and they had to make the average look better, some models had to be thrown under the 4 cylinder bus, so to speak, and from a money point of view, that's what happened.

The forthcoming 718 Spyder and GT4 are rumored to have NA 6es, and I expect those to be great cars that will sell like hotcakes.

Worldwide, the single best selling Porsche these days is the in-line 4-cylinder Macan (about 40% of all Macan variants in the US and supposedly higher elsewhere). Macan sales account for more volume than the 911, Cayman and Boxster put together. Their top selling models now all have 4 doors and accounted for over 75% of sales in 2018. Their biggest single market is now China.

https://jalopnik.com/the-four-cylind...nce-1789639558

https://www.best-selling-cars.com/br...ide-car-sales/