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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum Technical Topics Tracking / Autocrossing Is anyone running 18X9 in front; if so, with which tires?

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      07-25-2018, 05:54 PM   #1
dradernh
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Is anyone running 18X9 in front; if so, with which tires?

My car is being readied for the track, and we're having what must be a common issue with wheels and tires: putting together a wheel & tire package where the tires are wide enough to take advantage of at least most of the car's power and where the wheel & tire sizes are the same at all four corners.

Before going into it further, I'd like to run either the Toyo R888R or the Nitto NT01. I won't run a street tire, and I don't want to run an R7, R1, or something like that. The combination of grip and heat cycle-life that those "in-betweener" tires offer is what I'm after.

We'd like to run an 18X9 with the Toyo R888R 255/35-18. The Apex ARC-8 comes in that size with ET 58, which will fit in the back. Whether it can be made to fit in the front is the question. We'll have to do a test fit to find out, but I'm wondering if anyone has fit a combination like this in the front of a 2-Series. If so, can you share your spacer size, spring diameter, and anything you had to do to make it fit: e.g., roll the fenders, delete the fender liners, or run negative camber greater than -2.5 (which I don't want to do, because I'm going to run the same camber on the street and the track).

Even if you haven't run a combo that large up front, can you share the largest combo that you found would fit, especially if you or your shop made every effort to mount the largest tire that could be put in the available space in front without compromising the intended function of the installation.

FWIW, this is not going to be a track car. It's a street car that will be used to instruct advanced students 4-6 days per year. It will be set up to run well at my 8/10ths, and lap times won't be a consideration.

Other options under consideration:

1) Run 17X9s with the Nitto NT01 255/40-17. We haven't found a 17X9 with an offset that will work in the rear, so we'd need to have something custom-made, which is a last resort as far as insisting upon a square setup goes.

2) Run staggered 18s rear and front. As simple as that sounds, we immediately run into issues with tire diameter. Logically, with a 255 in the back we'd want a 245 up front, but the R888R 245/40-18 is 25.7" in diameter, and we don't think that will fit the front. The non-255 18" Toyo/Nitto that would clearly fit in front are 225/235, and that's too narrow.

3) Run staggered with 18X9 in the rear and 17X9 up front. That would allow us to run an R888R 245/40-17 up front to go with the 255/35-18 in the rear. Arguably this is the simplest way to go if the 18X9 with 255/35-18 won't fit up front.

Any relevant experience or thoughts or insights you may have will be most appreciated.
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Last edited by dradernh; 07-25-2018 at 06:28 PM.
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      07-25-2018, 06:32 PM   #2
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Anthony235 runs 9.5 square with a 255 RE-71R. From what he's said, he'd be happy going down to a 9" wheel to reduce the spacer size that was required to make it fit w/ the coilovers/perch etc. He's rolled his fenders, and I believe runs more than 3* neg camber, but I don't know for sure..

Capt is also running 9.5 & 265 square, https://www.2addicts.com/forums/show...9&postcount=21

Apex makes the 9" wheel specifically for the 1&2 with an offset of 42. These are the proper width for a 255 section, so why wouldn't you want to go that route?

I finally decided on the 9" square setup this past winter, myself..
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Last edited by Dylan86; 07-25-2018 at 06:38 PM.
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      07-25-2018, 08:38 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan86 View Post
Anthony235 runs 9.5 square with a 255 RE-71R. From what he's said, he'd be happy going down to a 9" wheel to reduce the spacer size that was required to make it fit w/ the coilovers/perch etc. He's rolled his fenders, and I believe runs more than 3* neg camber, but I don't know for sure..

Capt is also running 9.5 & 265 square, https://www.2addicts.com/forums/show...9&postcount=21

Apex makes the 9" wheel specifically for the 1&2 with an offset of 42. These are the proper width for a 255 section, so why wouldn't you want to go that route?

I finally decided on the 9" square setup this past winter, myself..
Thanks for the info, and for the link.

It's not so much a matter of not wanting to run a 9" wheel. After all, we're considering 17X9 up front, or even square. Part of what we're wondering at the moment is if a 255 can be fit in the front wheel well with <=-2.5 camber, as well as what other modifications might have to be done to get a tire that size to fit.

Your build shows that you have -2.5 camber in front. Is there anything else you had to do to fit the 255s in front - e.g., fender roll, 2.25" springs, or something else?

Your build also shows you're running Apex ARC-08 18x9 square ET42 with Bridgestone Potenza RE-71R 255/35. I'm guessing your rear tires are very close to the fender lip, but with -2.0 camber they're not so close that they rub or required a fender roll. It would be helpful to know if that is correct.
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Last edited by dradernh; 07-25-2018 at 09:28 PM.
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      07-26-2018, 01:54 AM   #4
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17x9et42 with a 5mm spacer in front.
-2 camber all around, could dial in a bit more.
Ohlins with 7" long front springs and Vorschlag camber plates.
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      07-26-2018, 08:08 AM   #5
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I have a set of matte black Arc-8s in the size you are looking for that I am selling soon. The 265/35-18 RS4s have some life left. No TPMS since a low tire pressure will lock the car out of DSC off and force you to run all nannies on. Oddly enough, no TPMS allows you to do whatever. If you probably won't have to roll your fenders iff you run 255s. I do know that the 265s will require some fender rolling. In my opinion, an 18x9.5 wheel is the best wheel set up for the track. The grip level with the extra meat is worth it. The front will need a 5mm spacer and rear will need an 8mm spacer.

Don't run staggered, even with the camber set at -3.7 front and -2.2 rear with 1/8 toe out in the front, there is still a ton of understeer. Square set up is the much better.
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      08-08-2018, 09:38 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dylan86 View Post
Anthony235 runs 9.5 square with a 255 RE-71R. From what he's said, he'd be happy going down to a 9" wheel to reduce the spacer size that was required to make it fit w/ the coilovers/perch etc. He's rolled his fenders, and I believe runs more than 3* neg camber, but I don't know for sure..

Capt is also running 9.5 & 265 square, https://www.2addicts.com/forums/show...9&postcount=21

Apex makes the 9" wheel specifically for the 1&2 with an offset of 42. These are the proper width for a 255 section, so why wouldn't you want to go that route?

I finally decided on the 9" square setup this past winter, myself..
From a pure track perspective I prefer the 9.5" wheel with 255.

For street/track duty I would do 9" and 255.

Fender rolling may not be required. I did it only as a precaution with the front fenders.
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      10-17-2018, 03:22 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by capt_and View Post
I have a set of matte black Arc-8s in the size you are looking for that I am selling soon. The 265/35-18 RS4s have some life left. No TPMS since a low tire pressure will lock the car out of DSC off and force you to run all nannies on. Oddly enough, no TPMS allows you to do whatever. If you probably won't have to roll your fenders iff you run 255s. I do know that the 265s will require some fender rolling. In my opinion, an 18x9.5 wheel is the best wheel set up for the track. The grip level with the extra meat is worth it. The front will need a 5mm spacer and rear will need an 8mm spacer.

Don't run staggered, even with the camber set at -3.7 front and -2.2 rear with 1/8 toe out in the front, there is still a ton of understeer. Square set up is the much better.
How much front fender rubbing do you get with the 265's on a 9.5 rim ??
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      01-10-2019, 06:53 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by capt_and View Post
I have a set of matte black Arc-8s in the size you are looking for that I am selling soon. The 265/35-18 RS4s have some life left. No TPMS since a low tire pressure will lock the car out of DSC off and force you to run all nannies on. Oddly enough, no TPMS allows you to do whatever. If you probably won't have to roll your fenders iff you run 255s. I do know that the 265s will require some fender rolling. In my opinion, an 18x9.5 wheel is the best wheel set up for the track. The grip level with the extra meat is worth it. The front will need a 5mm spacer and rear will need an 8mm spacer.

Don't run staggered, even with the camber set at -3.7 front and -2.2 rear with 1/8 toe out in the front, there is still a ton of understeer. Square set up is the much better.

Where did you get your 8mm spacer for the rears??
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      01-11-2019, 09:23 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowfax028 View Post



Where did you get your 8mm spacer for the rears??
I believe it was either amazon or ebay. There are also people that can make them custom for very little money.
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      01-12-2019, 11:39 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by capt_and View Post
I believe it was either amazon or ebay. There are also people that can make them custom for very little money.
Thank you. I found someone yesterday 60.00 . Didn't seem to bad.
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      01-13-2019, 07:19 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by capt_and View Post
I believe it was either amazon or ebay. There are also people that can make them custom for very little money.
Is it just a slip on spacer?
Did you use a hub extender with it?
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      01-13-2019, 07:53 PM   #12
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Something to keep in mind is that if you ever need a custom size that you can't find off the shelf, you can always purchase a thicker size and have its thickness reduced at a shop with the appropriate equipment.
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      01-14-2019, 09:09 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
Is it just a slip on spacer?
Did you use a hub extender with it?
Yes, it was just a slip on spacer.
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      01-15-2019, 10:33 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
My car is being readied for the track, and we're having what must be a common issue with wheels and tires: putting together a wheel & tire package where the tires are wide enough to take advantage of at least most of the car's power and where the wheel & tire sizes are the same at all four corners.

Before going into it further, I'd like to run either the Toyo R888R or the Nitto NT01. I won't run a street tire, and I don't want to run an R7, R1, or something like that. The combination of grip and heat cycle-life that those "in-betweener" tires offer is what I'm after.

We'd like to run an 18X9 with the Toyo R888R 255/35-18. The Apex ARC-8 comes in that size with ET 58, which will fit in the back. Whether it can be made to fit in the front is the question. We'll have to do a test fit to find out, but I'm wondering if anyone has fit a combination like this in the front of a 2-Series. If so, can you share your spacer size, spring diameter, and anything you had to do to make it fit: e.g., roll the fenders, delete the fender liners, or run negative camber greater than -2.5 (which I don't want to do, because I'm going to run the same camber on the street and the track).

Even if you haven't run a combo that large up front, can you share the largest combo that you found would fit, especially if you or your shop made every effort to mount the largest tire that could be put in the available space in front without compromising the intended function of the installation.

FWIW, this is not going to be a track car. It's a street car that will be used to instruct advanced students 4-6 days per year. It will be set up to run well at my 8/10ths, and lap times won't be a consideration.

Other options under consideration:

1) Run 17X9s with the Nitto NT01 255/40-17. We haven't found a 17X9 with an offset that will work in the rear, so we'd need to have something custom-made, which is a last resort as far as insisting upon a square setup goes.

2) Run staggered 18s rear and front. As simple as that sounds, we immediately run into issues with tire diameter. Logically, with a 255 in the back we'd want a 245 up front, but the R888R 245/40-18 is 25.7" in diameter, and we don't think that will fit the front. The non-255 18" Toyo/Nitto that would clearly fit in front are 225/235, and that's too narrow.

3) Run staggered with 18X9 in the rear and 17X9 up front. That would allow us to run an R888R 245/40-17 up front to go with the 255/35-18 in the rear. Arguably this is the simplest way to go if the 18X9 with 255/35-18 won't fit up front.

Any relevant experience or thoughts or insights you may have will be most appreciated.
I remember guys in the E36/46 days running 2.5-3* Camber in the front on the daily, with low wear. They said the majority of the wear was from Toe, not camber.
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      01-15-2019, 11:12 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskmaster View Post
I remember guys in the E36/46 days running 2.5-3* Camber in the front on the daily, with low wear. They said the majority of the wear was from Toe, not camber.
I kinda agree. -2.5 with 0 toe. I think you would be ok. Any kinda toe in or out and you will go through rubber pretty quick.
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      01-16-2019, 12:18 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taskmaster View Post
I remember guys in the E36/46 days running 2.5-3* Camber in the front on the daily, with low wear. They said the majority of the wear was from Toe, not camber.
The car has toe-in of 1/32" front and 1/8" rear. The shop estimates 8K for tire life.
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