[Liquidpaper]

Originally Posted by thielepr

New member here. After reading all this thread it makes me wondering if people takes spring rates in account when swapping springs. The M235i have soft springs from factory, at least for my taste.

Apart from the M235i, I have an S2000 with GC\Koni coilovers with 550 front springs and 450 rears. But the factory rates of the s2000 was on the 200's. The M235i feels softer than my S2000 with the stock suspension. Of course the magic trick of the bimmer are the adjustable shocks.

Does anyone know the stock spring rate for the M235i? Also, what are the rates for the H&R

First, spring rate really isn't a key issue here as all of these springs are progressive -- they have varying spring rates depending on compression.

Second, after driving my car for almost two years and doing some mods (and going back) I really don't think the springs/dampers on this care are too "soft." Yes, the car has some excess body roll from the factory, but that is a swaybar issue, not a spring/damper issue.

The stock dampers/springs do a nice job of allowing you to feel the road while still being able to absorb bumps. A mistake a lot of people make is that a well tuned performance suspension needs to be bone-crunchingly stiff in order to work. I don't agree with this -- it assumes whatever you are driving on is as smooth as glass. Roads are never this smooth, and frankly, most tracks aren't this smooth either. The 4 I've been to in SoCal are varying degrees of smoothness. A very, very stiff suspension will hit a bump and get upset, rather than absorb the bump. It's a fine balance, but people frequently tune their car with the goal of "as stiff as possible" when it doesn't really make the car any faster -- it just makes it slower (much harder to handle in real-world conditions) and less comfortable.

[thielepr]

Originally Posted by Liquidpaper

First, spring rate really isn't a key issue here as all of these springs are progressive -- they have varying spring rates depending on compression.

Second, after driving my car for almost two years and doing some mods (and going back) I really don't think the springs/dampers on this care are too "soft." Yes, the car has some excess body roll from the factory, but that is a swaybar issue, not a spring/damper issue.

The stock dampers/springs do a nice job of allowing you to feel the road while still being able to absorb bumps. A mistake a lot of people make is that a well tuned performance suspension needs to be bone-crunchingly stiff in order to work. I don't agree with this -- it assumes whatever you are driving on is as smooth as glass. Roads are never this smooth, and frankly, most tracks aren't this smooth either. The 4 I've been to in SoCal are varying degrees of smoothness. A very, very stiff suspension will hit a bump and get upset, rather than absorb the bump. It's a fine balance, but people frequently tune their car with the goal of "as stiff as possible" when it doesn't really make the car any faster -- it just makes it slower (much harder to handle in real-world conditions) and less comfortable.

I basically agree 90% with your post. Making your car stiffer doesn't necessary means better handling. I also agree that swapping the sway bar is a better upgrade than the springs since it doesn't affect the ride quality. However, I still think that the M235i is more on the soft side, which isn't a bad thing for street car.

What I meant on my original comment was that some people swap springs to aftermarket ones without even knowing if they are even going to a softer springs

[Liquidpaper]

Originally Posted by thielepr

I basically agree 90% with your post. Making your car stiffer doesn't necessary means better handling. I also agree that swapping the sway bar is a better upgrade than the springs since it doesn't affect the ride quality. However, I still think that the M235i is more on the soft side, which isn't a bad thing for street car.

What I meant on my original comment was that some people swap springs to aftermarket ones without even knowing if they are even going to a softer springs

Fair enough. Ride quality is, to an extent, subjective. If you want a stiffer ride, go for it.

However, I think it might be difficult in the spring department because (as far as I know, could be wrong) most OEM-style progressive springs do not specify their spring rate(s), perhaps due in part to the fact that the rate changes based on compression.

That being said, I absolutely agree that a baseline metric would be super helpful. Something, anything so I can determine if the spring I am buying is objectively softer or stiffer than stock.

[Anderw]

Thought Id add my H&R springs Pic on Stock Wheels + 15mm Spacers all around

[Pparana]

all the bump stops do is allow the shock to travel more, which to be honest is out of there spec. I ran the hr springs, and the ride is rubbish. The dinan work well on stock edc.

If you want more of a drop you really need coilovers. When I switched to coilovers I could not believe how much better the ride was. It felt so much better.

Originally Posted by Richy_Boy

In the UK edc is an option.. I bought my car off a friend (who was moving to the US) and he didn't select edc when he spec'ed it from new.

The car came with passive M Sport suspension.. there's an upgrade kit to take it to M Performance spec, but so little people have given reviews that I decided to stick with a combo I know and can be adjusted to suit.

Picture comparing OEM M235i front bump stops to e36 M3 units:


The H&R units were a touch smaller still than the M3 ones.

I hope that helps...

Rich

[Richy_Boy]

Originally Posted by Pparana

all the bump stops do is allow the shock to travel more, which to be honest is out of there spec. I ran the hr springs, and the ride is rubbish. The dinan work well on stock edc.

If you want more of a drop you really need coilovers. When I switched to coilovers I could not believe how much better the ride was. It felt so much better.

I fitted my H&R springs with Koni Yellow dampers, which are adjustable, short throw units made to run with lowering springs, smaller bump stops allow you to use more of the travel.

On oem dampers, sure you'll shorten the damper life, but then this always the case with aftermarket springs. To be honest, I'm not sure about the internals of the oem shocks to know the limits of the workable travel.

Anyway, so far so good with my combo and I prefer a solid damper/spring combo to a set of coilovers any day..

Richard

[Pparana]

Originally Posted by Richy_Boy

I fitted my H&R springs with Koni Yellow dampers, which are adjustable, short throw units made to run with lowering springs, smaller bump stops allow you to use more of the travel.

On oem dampers, sure you'll shorten the damper life, but then this always the case with aftermarket springs. To be honest, I'm not sure about the internals of the oem shocks to know the limits of the workable travel.

Anyway, so far so good with my combo and I prefer a solid damper/spring combo to a set of coilovers any day..

Richard

there is not much difference between HAS coilovers and your setup, just you can choose the ride height. With HAS coilovers you have no pre load on the shocks, just like your setup.

[Tamim3]

Any update on the h&r springs?
Im looking for springs for My xdrive

[qJai]

Whats the part number for the m3 bump stops?

Also is it confirmed that HR provides bumpstops on all orders now? thanks.

Originally Posted by Richy_Boy

In the UK edc is an option.. I bought my car off a friend (who was moving to the US) and he didn't select edc when he spec'ed it from new.

The car came with passive M Sport suspension.. there's an upgrade kit to take it to M Performance spec, but so little people have given reviews that I decided to stick with a combo I know and can be adjusted to suit.

Picture comparing OEM M235i front bump stops to e36 M3 units:


The H&R units were a touch smaller still than the M3 ones.

I hope that helps...

Rich

[Mr_White]

Originally Posted by Liquidpaper

Yes, the car has some excess body roll from the factory, but that is a swaybar issue, not a spring/damper issue.

That is certainly not true. Spring rates definitely affect how much body roll there is in a car. Comfort, and absorbing bumps aside, if you're talking about controlling the yaw dyamics in both lateral and front/rear shift, then stiffer as well as shorter springs will reduce this.

[paposalsa]

New member here, after looking at some of the horror stories in this thread I don't know if I want to lower the car, which springs to choose or if I would trust any shop to do it. I had all my cars lowered in the past including a 95 BMW and seems like lowering these new BMWs are a problem for a simple spring installation ....

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by paposalsa

New member here, after looking at some of the horror stories in this thread I don't know if I want to lower the car, which springs to choose or if I would trust any shop to do it. I had all my car lowered in the past including a 95 BMW and seems like lowering these new BMWs are a problem for a simple spring installation ....

Bimmerworld is in your general neighborhood - why not call, talk to them, and take the mystery out of it. They know BMWs, they know this series, and they're straight-shooters.

[paposalsa]

Originally Posted by dradernh

Bimmerworld is in your general neighborhood - why not call, talk to them, and take the mystery out of it. They know BMWs, they know this series, and they're straight-shooters.

They are a good 4 hours away but I can give them a call ... Thanks