[shark715]

I bought these winter tires from Tire Rack based on the very positive comments on Tire Rack's website as well as other forum members here.

Unfortunately I have a major complaint. It's a similar complaint to what Tire Rack had to say about a competing tire:

"The Bridgestone Blizzak LM-60 displayed a small dead zone right around zero degrees of the steering wheel, but would then ramp up once the wheel was turned past the first few degrees. This subtle delay led to a somewhat disconnected feeling during more rapid maneuvers, or when coping with strong cross winds or other outside forces acting to push the car off its intended path."

The above is a great description of what I'm experiencing with the PA4's, except I would say it's beyond "subtle" and "somewhat". It makes driving at expressway speeds a real chore.

Other than that, the handling is decent for a winter tire (I've had winter tires on a number of other cars).

I was thinking that perhaps there is something amiss with the car itself, but I noticed the problem immediately after replacing the PA4's with the PSS's that came on the car. (BTW, I think the PSS tires are the best I've ever owned...have them on another car too, and was excited when I found out BMW was offering them as an option on the 235.)

I've tried playing around with different tire pressures to no avail.

One other thing to note...I have one of the first 235 xdrive convertibles (new for MY 16) to roll out of the factory. I can't imagine why that would be an issue, but I thought I would mention it

Anyone else experiencing what I am?

[Transfer]

Honestly I think they're the best winter tire you can buy. I love mine for cold weather driving and think they're nearly flawless. Are you sure that dead zone isn't just the electric power steering dead spot? These cars have shit on-center steering.

[shark715]

Originally Posted by Transfer

Honestly I think they're the best winter tire you can buy. I love mine for cold weather driving and think they're nearly flawless. Are you sure that dead zone isn't just the electric power steering dead spot? These cars have shit on-center steering.

. Thanks for responding. I don't think that is the case because with the Michelin PSS summer tires that came on the car from the factory I don't have this issue at all. I realize that the tires are very highly regarded. Even consumer reports, which comes from a different perspective, rated these tires very high. That's why I bought them, and that's why I am so disappointed. I am left wondering if for some reason there is something unique about the steering or suspension on the Xdrive 235 convertible that is not a good match for these tires I know it doesn't sound likely, but I just don't know what else could be going on. I wonder why BMW waited an extra year ( versus the 235 rwd convertible, or the 228 Xdrive convertible ) to bring the 235 Xdrive convertible to market. I always assumed that it was because there was some kind of additional engineering needed.

[nelsdvn]

They can't be any worse then the WS80's I have installed. Dry pavement handling feels like I am driving the SS Minnow. Wallows and wanders like crazy but when the snow flies these things are like sucker fish. It's all about trade offs. I'll take the crap dry performance for the ability to dominate in the snow.

[CanadianGatorBacon]

Originally Posted by nelsdvn

They can't be any worse then the WS80's I have installed. Dry pavement handling feels like I am driving the SS Minnow. Wallows and wanders like crazy but when the snow flies these things are like sucker fish. It's all about trade offs. I'll take the crap dry performance for the ability to dominate in the snow.

Agree, I've had the WS80s for a week and the difference is significant. But snow in this a RWD M235i is a scary proposition, so I'll suck it up for a while. I also get vibration all over starting at around 60mph, but really noticeable at about 70+mph. I'm pretty sure it's the tire tread (anyone else?) because I just had them balanced and aligned.

[shark715]

I completely understand that generally winter tires are never going to handle (on curves and exit and entrance ramps) as well as a summer tire.

But I currently have and have had other winter tires, including other Michelin models, as well as Pirelli's, on a number of other cars, and have never experienced any issue with general expressway driving like this.

For example, I currently have Michelin Xice 3's on our Mini, as well as Latitude Xice 2's on our X5.

[allthatisntnow]

I think they're really good tyres. They are a bit mallowy at higher speed lane changes etc, but they have taller side walls and taller tread blocks than the PSS, so its to be expected. Comparatively, everywhere else, i think they feel more or less the same as the PSS. No great departure. But just my opinion. I think you'd be hard pressed to find a performance winter with better steering feel.

[nelsdvn]

Originally Posted by CanadianGatorBacon

I also get vibration all over starting at around 60mph, but really noticeable at about 70+mph.

I apologize for continuing the WS80 thread hijack but mine are smooth as butter. I've had them up in the mid 90's without any vibration.

[shark715]

I don't have a vibration issue with the PA4's, just the issue I described in my original post.

[overcoil]

The 'vibration' the OP describes -could it be faulty belts or construction of the tire
Curious if a front to back swap comparison could be done?
Is vibration in steering wheel or seat?

To the poster who wrote 'SS Minnow' and 'sucker-fish' that's some colloquial idiomatic writing or something - I like it.

[German1967]

Originally Posted by nelsdvn

I apologize for continuing the WS80 thread hijack but mine are smooth as butter. I've had them up in the mid 90's without any vibration.

Same - no issues with WS80

[CanadianGatorBacon]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

The 'vibration' the OP describes -could it be faulty belts or construction of the tire
Curious if a front to back swap comparison could be done?
Is vibration in steering wheel or seat?

The vibration comment was mine. And it's all over. The whole car has like a massage chair kind of vibration. I'm hoping it subsides after break in, i've probably got another 100 miles or so to go. I didn't feel it on the fresh PSS. The car only has 600 miles. If it doesn't go away this week, I'll take it in to get checked out.

[Transfer]

Vibrations are usually due to improper balancing. I've had it done wrong, took the car back to the tire shop and they found the balance machine was off.

[krhodes1]

Silly question, but have you checked the tire pressures? Friend of mine got a winter tire and wheel package from The TireRack for his Subaru, had a local shop put them on the car, and complained of the same thing - car wandered all over the place. Turns out the tires were inflated to 55psi! I put them down where they belonged and all was as good as it gets in a craptastic 2016 Forester.

FWIW, in a straight line on the highway my car feels no different on 18" Falken Eurowinters than it did on the Pilot Sports. Obviously, not as much grip in the corners.

[shark715]

Originally Posted by krhodes1

Silly question, but have you checked the tire pressures?

Not a silly question, as it was one of the first things I thought of. But as I mentioned in my original post, I did try playing with the pressures to no avail.

[Cloud IX]

Originally Posted by Transfer

Vibrations are usually due to improper balancing. I've had it done wrong, took the car back to the tire shop and they found the balance machine was off.

This. Take it back and make sure they are balanced correctly.

[opfreak]

Originally Posted by German1967

Same - no issues with WS80

my ws80's seem great, even at 80 fairly stable. I've driven old blizzaks on a sunfire 15 years ago and didn't care for them. But these seem fine. quite even.

And traction in lightly packed snow covered roads is good. Didn't have a chance to drive in lose packed snow. but I wouldn't want to be on the roads with a lot of snow, not enough clearance.

[stealthwang]

i'ved been rolling on PA4s since i've picked up last week and so far they've been nothing less than perfect. quiet, responsive and better traction than the WRG3s on my last car.