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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum Technical Topics N20 (228i) / B46 (230i) Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Tuning GSR Technik 228i N20 ECU Flash Tune Now Available 50whp/90wtq

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      05-05-2015, 07:26 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkstarZero View Post
Are there any issues with the Stage 1 and the N26 stock downpipes? The N26 downpipes are much more restrictive than the N20 downpipes and therefor get much more hot under added boost.

If I were to get a Stage 1 for $1k and then want to upgrade to Stage 2 later, do I pay another $1500 or just the difference of an extra $500?
Actually that is a good question. Our Stage 1 dyno was done on a N26 and the Stage 2 was done on a N20 so I guess we can feel confident about the Stage 1 numbers.

For now we are allowing people to send ECU back in and only pay the difference - so $500 in your example. This could change in the future but for now that is the policy we are going with.
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      05-05-2015, 07:40 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by alexandertg21 View Post
Do you guys need an f30? I'm local and my car sits during the week. N55
We do, PM me and we'll work out a generous deal for your troubles.
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      05-05-2015, 07:44 PM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S4NoMore View Post
If a car has had JB4 or another tune that triggered the "tamper code," is that tamper code triggered for good or would it go away after some time?

Excellent work
My understanding is JB4s will not trigger tamper code because they a picking up signals outside of ECU.

If someone triggers tamper code trying to flash tune they will probably not be the ones who will be able to fix it so you will have to send ECU to someone like us to resolve issue. It is not permanent but it will not go away on its own.

Thanks.
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      05-05-2015, 07:46 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaswrath View Post
That's crazy competitive pricing!
If you have a laptop and it's easy to do, I'm happy to orchestrate an east coast trip and you can tune a number of cars out here, including mine!!
We are always up for flash parties in any geographies we can get enough cars together.
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      05-05-2015, 07:49 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryansauce View Post
So the car can run fine on 91 gas?
Yes, will run fine on 91 and will adapt to 93 and give you little more umph. In fact the more octane you put in it will adapt up but there is diminishing returns unless you begin to tune specifically for the higher octane fuels.
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      05-05-2015, 07:50 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Thanks for dropping the science!. It's clear that a lot of folks need to brush up on basic programming skills and sign up for your Tuning 102 class! .


You patiently, concisely, and thoughtfully made replies to many naysayers in clear layman English. Nicely done.


Thanks!
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      05-05-2015, 09:25 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSR Autosport View Post
As you mention OBD3 is primarily focused on recording and transmission (i.e. sending data wirelessly) for diagnosis purposes. OBD3 isn't necessarily getting at more information than OBD2 - the thing everyone is going on about is privacy issues of getting access to real time data from your car and using it to your disadvantage. California which usually leads the way for the USA on emissions regulations has already put out an RFP requesting that part of the OBD3 technology could be used to detect a car that doesn't meet emissions standards and automatically send you a violation. Obviously this is getting way into the scary big brother privacy issues so it's going to be interested to see how it all plays out. SEMA has gathered some good information if you want to read more about it here.

http://lobby.la.psu.edu/_107th/093_O..._questions.htm

So what you are saying might be true in the future but what we understand today is that emissions monitoring is not happening today.

As far as detection. The new FlexRay based ECUs do have a DME tamper code built in so if you do not address the issue of NOT triggering the DME tamper code then yes it will show up when you plug-in a diagnostic system. We have resolved this and our tune does not trigger the DME tamper code. We have loaded our tune and plugged it into an Autologic diagnostic system and taken it to a friend in the industry and plugged it into the factory diagnostic system and the tamper code was not triggered. We have had guys bring cars by our shop and we plug our diagnostic system in and we can see that the tamper code has been triggered - no bueno.

From what we know at this point, the changes we are making to the binary code and the recalculation of the checksum are undetectable.

Our tune does not change emissions. Obviously running downpipes does change emissions which COULD? be seen if they are truly recording emissions data. If we are talking the possibility of recording data, actually this issue would be true for a flash tune as well as piggyback systems so it would not be specific to how we are approaching tuning but every tuning product on the market today.

So just to recap - our current understanding is that our tune is not detectable. If you change the emissions systems (e.g. at catless downpipes) on your vehicle it might be possible (unverified) that recording/transmission capabilities built into FlexRay/ODB3 might be able to detect emission measures that are out of whack.

FlexRay which is starting to replace CAN is not a total mystery - it is an ISO standard. Each OEM is implementing it a little different and some are much more focused on security. Interestingly enough Mercedes is actually being more open where BMW is focused on locking everyone out. I think this is actually going to help Mercedes in the enthusiast market - we know they make great motors and we are seeing a rise in tuning Mercedes.

If you want to read more about FlexRay start here.

http://www.ni.com/white-paper/3352/en/

Great discussion forming on this thread, thanks.

If you are interested, PM me directly and would love to explore the specific cars that have been flagged and understand the state of the ECU when it was flagged. We know the M cars have more security implemented than non M cars so there is a lot more work to deal with M car ECUs. You can't treat them the same when tuning.
WOW!!!!! Thank you

Quote:
Originally Posted by GSR Autosport View Post
Stage 1: $999
Stage 2: $1,499

If you overnight to us, we will turn it around in 1 day, we will overnight back to to you and deduct cost of shipping to us from price.
+1

Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaswrath View Post
That's crazy competitive pricing!
If you have a laptop and it's easy to do, I'm happy to orchestrate an east coast trip and you can tune a number of cars out here, including mine!!
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      05-07-2015, 12:58 AM   #74
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Quick update for you N55ers

For those N55ers watching this thread and asking about the N55 tune - things are looking good. Dyno testing on the M235i showed solid results +55whp and +80wtq on 91. We are planning on doing some more testing next week and then we'll publish our final results and get the product out on the market.
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      05-07-2015, 05:24 AM   #75
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do you warrant it against damage the tune might cause like Dinan does?
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      05-07-2015, 08:34 AM   #76
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Does tuning the ECU erase all of my feature coding, like DVD in motion, seat belt gong delete, etc.?
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      05-07-2015, 09:39 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f30kid View Post
do you warrant it against damage the tune might cause like Dinan does?
They already said it's a use-at-your-own-risk tune.
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      05-07-2015, 10:23 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkstarZero View Post
They already said it's a use-at-your-own-risk tune.
Bummer!
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      05-07-2015, 10:26 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goon
Does tuning the ECU erase all of my feature coding, like DVD in motion, seat belt gong delete, etc.?
Doubtful. Those features are controlled by a different ECU(s), the engine has its own controller where the tuning tweaks are applied. I'm pretty sure that such coding alterations will be unaffected.
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      05-07-2015, 11:12 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSR Autosport View Post
For those N55ers watching this thread and asking about the N55 tune - things are looking good. Dyno testing on the M235i showed solid results +55whp and +80wtq on 91. We are planning on doing some more testing next week and then we'll publish our final results and get the product out on the market.
what was the baseline?
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      05-07-2015, 01:09 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alz0rz View Post
what was the baseline?
278 whp > 334 whp
320 wtq > 400 wtq
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      05-07-2015, 01:11 PM   #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by S4NoMore View Post
Doubtful. Those features are controlled by a different ECU(s), the engine has its own controller where the tuning tweaks are applied. I'm pretty sure that such coding alterations will be unaffected.
Correct, the only things that will reset are those things that reset as part of disconnecting the battery.
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      05-07-2015, 01:15 PM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by f30kid View Post
Bummer!
Yeah, it is our reality. Maybe someday, if we get big enough we can justify to cost of purchasing a secondary insurance policy like Dinan has done. But then again, that cost needs to be recovered so we would probably have to raise our prices up to where Dinan is today. A big chunk of the price premium is to fund that insurance (i.e. warranty). We've looked at secondary insurance/warranty options but they are just too expensive given our current situation.
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      05-07-2015, 03:12 PM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSR Autosport View Post
278 whp > 334 whp
320 wtq > 400 wtq
ooo, that's interesting. So a 228 with a GSR stage 1 should produce about the same power as a stock M235 - and a little more with the stage 2, all while weighing less.

Of course a M235 with a GSR will blow it away but still cool that for $1k a 228 becomes faster than a stock M235!
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      05-07-2015, 04:03 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GSR Autosport View Post
278 whp > 334 whp
320 wtq > 400 wtq
Hmm that is much less than what we've typically seen from a typical stock M235i (~300whp).
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      05-07-2015, 06:04 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alz0rz View Post
Hmm that is much less than what we've typically seen from a typical stock M235i (~300whp).
Yes, BMW quotes 320hp at the crank and lately they seem to be coming close to those numbers at the wheels so this one is reading a little low. But again dynos read differently and are dependent on atmospheric conditions -- this particular tune was done on a different dyno than we normally use so can't compare top line results against what we have seen on our normal dyno. We are putting a N55 335i on our dyno next week (Tue/Wed) for some final tweaking of the tune before we release it. We'll see what those baseline numbers look like. I expect they will be higher than what we saw on this M235i. Again, what we are focused on is the differential - same, car, same dyno, same day, same fuel, different tunes.

We're trying to be as open as possible with the empirical data so the community has better visibility rather than just cherry picking the best numbers we see, posting those and anointing ourselves tuning gods.

We'd like to think we are pretty good but ultimately the community determines that for you.
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      05-08-2015, 06:43 PM   #87
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N20/N26 Stage 3 Turbo Package Coming!!!

We agreed with Pure Turbos today to co-develop a Stage 3 package for the N20/N26 motors that includes a turbo upgrade (more specifically internal upgrades to the stock turbo). Pure Turbos are working on the upgrade as we speak and hopefully we'll get them on our 228i ASAP and develop the complimentary stage 3 tune. We'll see if this program makes it all the way to Stage 4 with bottom end internal upgrades and other sorted bits. Would be cool to see that little N20 producing S55 power on our little track beast. Of course at that point we would have slipped all the way down the slippery slope and into the realm of crazy time attack track car.
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      05-09-2015, 02:11 AM   #88
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alz0rz View Post
what was the baseline?
278 whp > 334 whp
320 wtq > 400 wtq
What are each of these numbers exactly
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