[HP Autosport]

Pagid RS29 is a recent development from the bases of RS29, with a very similar friction coefficient to RS19 with improvements in initial bite offering quicker response and slightly more temperature stable at the upper levels of the temperature range. Developments in raw material selection and compounding have resulted in improvements also in pedal feel and feedback, helping with modulation particularly on lighter applications.

This material provides very good levels of performance and response at all temperature levels, only slight temperature inputs are required to bring the pad up to its optimum performance level. Another favourite with endurance racers having won many classes at all major endurance events, such as Le-Mans, Daytona, Spa, Nurburgring, etc. Due to the exceptional pad life and very low wear on brake discs it has been possible to run 24 hours with out a change of pads or discs. Able to withstand slightly higher disc temperatures than RS19, this has proved more suitable for applications running very high disc temperatures.

Although designed primarily for endurance racing, because of the consistent levels of performance and user friendliness many competitors use this material successfully for sprint and short distance races also. This has been seen in British GT Cup class, winning the Championship for the last 3 years in races averaging 1-2 hours in duration. RS19 has also found favour in the growing track day market due to the level of control, good cold performance, long life and low disc wear.

While not being the cheapest brake pads on the market, we have proved that due to the longer life and less disc wear in comparison to other competitor’s product, running costs can be reduced in comparison to cheaper, inferior products.

It is clear that the customer should look beyond the initial purchase price and make an accurate comparison with other competitor’s products to find the most cost effective braking solution. When compared to cheaper pads that wear more quickly and reduce disc life, and may also not perform consistently to the same level, the initially more costly product can often work out to be cheaper when calculated over the entire season.

Friction Level

Cold 0.40 PAGID Brake Pads
At 100°C 0.43
At 300°C 0.47
Max at (@ 550°C) 0.49
Constant working temperature: 400 – 700°C
Max temperature for short period only: 750°C

For more information:

http://www.2addicts.com/forums/showt...8#post16695198

[Anthony235]

I use them for my track days. Happy with them so far.

Surprising though that my motul RBF600 seemed to not work well in this car. It's been my go to fluid in all my cars for years. Maybe need to bleed them more.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I use them for my track days. Happy with them so far.

Surprising though that my motul RBF600 seemed to not work well in this car. It's been my go to fluid in all my cars for years. Maybe need to bleed them more.

Are you boiling the fluid more than your other cars using the same Pagid pad?

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by HP Autosport

Are you boiling the fluid more than your other cars using the same Pagid pad?

Never used pagid before. I don't think it's the pad. Braking power from the pad is still there, but pedal gets mushy.

This happened at Big Willow. It's a high speed track so there are certain points where you're doing some serious braking, but lots of cool down between braking zones.

I really don't think the motul is boiling on this track either, but I think it's fluid related. I read somewhere that BMW says to run low viscosity brake fluid in their system. Don't think Motul is. Wonder if it's related.

Maybe the fluid is actually not getting hot enough on this track so viscosity is too high. That would be a first lol.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

Never used pagid before. I don't think it's the pad. Braking power from the pad is still there, but pedal gets mushy.

This happened at Big Willow. It's a high speed track so there are certain points where you're doing some serious braking, but lots of cool down between braking zones.

I really don't think the motul is boiling on this track either, but I think it's fluid related. I read somewhere that BMW says to run low viscosity brake fluid in their system. Don't think Motul is. Wonder if it's related.

Maybe the fluid is actually not getting hot enough on this track so viscosity is too high. That would be a first lol.

Big Willow is not a particularly brake demanding track so I don't believe you boil the fluid. Did you flush the brake system before the track day?

We like SRF and that has been our fluid of choice for years. It attracts moisture at a much lower pace than its competitors. A quick bleed is all you need before each track day.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by HP Autosport

Big Willow is not a particularly brake demanding track so I don't believe you boil the fluid. Did you flush the brake system before the track day?

We like SRF and that has been our fluid of choice for years. It attracts moisture at a much lower pace than its competitors. A quick bleed is all you need before each track day.

Yeah not a demanding track on brakes. Full flush before the track day.

I will do some bleeding before the next to see if it resolves the issue. Probably will be at auto club.

Worse case I will switch to a different fluid and go from there.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

Yeah not a demanding track on brakes. Full flush before the track day.

I will do some bleeding before the next to see if it resolves the issue. Probably will be at auto club.

Worse case I will switch to a different fluid and go from there.

That is very interesting that you are getting a mushy pedal from the Motul 600, but good for everyone to know if that is truly the case.

[Dylan86]

I can shed some feedback in the spring when I switch over to the RBF600. I've had good luck with it in my VAG cars, so I'm hoping I'm not wasting my time.. Anthony, what are you running for flex hoses?

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

I can shed some feedback in the spring when I switch over to the RBF600. I've had good luck with it in my VAG cars, so I'm hoping I'm not wasting my time.. Anthony, what are you running for flex hoses?

I've never had issues with RBF600 over the last ~10 years. I've always sworn by it.

OEM hoses...and now you have me thinking

My pedal doesn't "fail" just gets a mushy feel and have to apply a little more pressure (~25%??). I'll bleed the brakes before the next track day. If that doesn't solve it I'll shop for some new lines. What are you running?

I've had cars with and without braided hoses....honestly didn't think they made that big of a difference. Each car is different though and maybe it will end up being my solution.

EDIT: I did some reading. Technically Motul is not recommended for BMW because of viscosity in motul being too high. Guess it can interfere with the braking system/computer with the thin veins of the braking system. Though people also say it's fine once it gets up to track temp as it should then thin out....

Problem is no legit brake fluid will have a low viscosity to begin with.

[mdputnam]

If you're relying on heat to lower the viscosity, keep in mind all of the fluid, from the abs pump to the caliper piston, has to be hot, not just the fluid sitting in the brake caliper. At big Willow on a winter day doing a 15-20 minute open track day run the fluid may not be getting hot enough to thin out and operate optimally.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

I can shed some feedback in the spring when I switch over to the RBF600. I've had good luck with it in my VAG cars, so I'm hoping I'm not wasting my time.. Anthony, what are you running for flex hoses?

There are also a bunch of people think that the SS lines don't do anything.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I've never had issues with RBF600 over the last ~10 years. I've always sworn by it.

OEM hoses...and now you have me thinking

My pedal doesn't "fail" just gets a mushy feel and have to apply a little more pressure (~25%??). I'll bleed the brakes before the next track day. If that doesn't solve it I'll shop for some new lines. What are you running?

I've had cars with and without braided hoses....honestly didn't think they made that big of a difference. Each car is different though and maybe it will end up being my solution.

EDIT: I did some reading. Technically Motul is not recommended for BMW because of viscosity in motul being too high. Guess it can interfere with the braking system/computer with the thin veins of the braking system. Though people also say it's fine once it gets up to track temp as it should then thin out....

Problem is no legit brake fluid will have a low viscosity to begin with.

Now, thinking back...before switching exclusively using SRF, I did use everything else including Motul, but never felt any difference in pedal effort or firmness between the them.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

If you're relying on heat to lower the viscosity, keep in mind all of the fluid, from the abs pump to the caliper piston, has to be hot, not just the fluid sitting in the brake caliper. At big Willow on a winter day doing a 15-20 minute open track day run the fluid may not be getting hot enough to thin out and operate optimally.

Yeah it was a colder day at the track. Thought about that too. It seemed worse in the middle of the session and not bad towards the end. So it not getting up to temp to work with the BMW systems might be the cause.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by HP Autosport

There are also a bunch of people think that the SS lines don't do anything.

I'm generally in that camp.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I'm generally in that camp.

The resistance to line swell is definitely there, but most of the endusers may not sensitive enough to feel it. SS lines will be more consistent for sure as it is likely to be affected by temperature changes.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I've never had issues with RBF600 over the last ~10 years. I've always sworn by it.

OEM hoses...and now you have me thinking

My pedal doesn't "fail" just gets a mushy feel and have to apply a little more pressure (~25%??). I'll bleed the brakes before the next track day. If that doesn't solve it I'll shop for some new lines. What are you running?

I've had cars with and without braided hoses....honestly didn't think they made that big of a difference. Each car is different though and maybe it will end up being my solution.

EDIT: I did some reading. Technically Motul is not recommended for BMW because of viscosity in motul being too high. Guess it can interfere with the braking system/computer with the thin veins of the braking system. Though people also say it's fine once it gets up to track temp as it should then thin out....

Problem is no legit brake fluid will have a low viscosity to begin with.

Same here, still on OEM hoses and fluid. Was going to swing for the StopTech lines, since they're only about $60-80 per axle and one less thing to worry about. This along with RBF600 and either Pagid's or PFC for track days is my intention. Had the PFC pads and RBF-600 combo with the TTRS brake setup on my GTI and it was stellar.

The PFC-08 pads I used were the same as the factory supplied 991 GT3, IIRC, and can be used on the street if wanted, no different than driving a GT3 around on "stock" brakes, I suppose lol..

Going to get started on my car this month while I have some down time. Dinan springs/bump stops, M4 LCA's and camber plates (still unsure which route on the plates, and may wait it out until something solid surfaces). FBO parts in the trunk, just wanted to get the suspension sorted before I go from stock power to FBO. Once that happens, the brakes are being addressed right away, and I'm done for this year. Next year, coilovers like yours, or the Ohlins. This car enables my inner mod daemon, wayyy too easily!

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by HP Autosport

The resistance to line swell is definitely there, but most of the endusers may not sensitive enough to feel it. SS lines will be more consistent for sure as it is likely to be affected by temperature changes.

When I have done the brake lines in my previous cars it's usually done at the sametime as my fluid and pads. Probably why I can't feel the improvement on the lines individually.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

When I have done the brake lines in my previous cars it's usually done at the sametime as my fluid and pads. Probably why I can't feel the improvement on the lines individually.

Pads have a lot to do with pedal feel as well.

[bryan_G01]

bimmerworld stainless shielded ftw.

[Tamim3]

Used them on my GT-R and loved them.

[HP Autosport]

Originally Posted by Tamim3

Used them on my GT-R and loved them.

[pikcachu]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I use them for my track days. Happy with them so far.

Surprising though that my motul RBF600 seemed to not work well in this car. It's been my go to fluid in all my cars for years. Maybe need to bleed them more.

So do you swap them just for the track days and then go back to stock pads?

somewhere i read this " Pagid brakepads are not compatible with previously used rotors, especially if used with a carbon or Kevlar based race pad. "

so was wondering what that meant....