[dradernh]

Originally Posted by Shovelman

One caution when buying a manual sight unseen, 'it may be an automatic with paddles' (quack quack quack). Get them to text you a picture of the pedals.

...and/or do a VIN lookup – just to be sure.

[falkdal]

Originally Posted by Shovelman

One caution when buying a manual sight unseen, 'it may be an automatic with paddles' (quack quack quack). Get them to text you a picture of the pedals.

Yes it's amazing how many search results online turn up automatic labeled as manuals.

I found a CPO '16 black/black as well as a private sale silver/black that I'm going to check out. Black isn't my favorite color but at least I can test drive it.

Also found a cherry e93 m3 that's cheaper and low mileage to complicate things!

[Thalia949]

It took me 6 months of searching to find my car - what I wasn't aware of when I started was that how rare the 6MT was.

As mentioned previously, many (most) ads are incorrect, paddles are thought to be manual.

I made people take pics of the pedals for me in a couple of instances, as funny as it sounds.

Good luck - it is worth it. I ended up with almost everything I wanted. Made a concession on interior color, but now I actually like it more than I would of my original thought. 6MT, silver, red interior a nice color combo.

[morphomeman]

The problem is that manuals are so rare that many young North Americans have no idea what they are. They think that anything with paddles is a manual, clutch or no clutch.
Pedal pics a great idea.

[falkdal]

Silver & red is a nice classic combo. The silver & black near me is nice but it's a private sale and they want $37k for it cause it has just 6k miles. It does have the MPE with diffuser, but it still seems high when I can get a low mileage M240i CPO for less than that (with auto), and the '16 CPO's are considerably less (again almost all auto).

Or maybe I should think of it as a good price on a basically new & rare car?

[bimmerfile]

Originally Posted by falkdal

.................................................. ........................... Personally I'd rather have the coupe, but my twin 3rd grade boys are not fans of the windows not rolling down, and after renting a 428i convertible their love for a drop top is so strong they'd never forgive me for getting a coupe instead!

Thanks for any advice.

Getting anything other than a convertible would be tantamount to child abuse.

[Thalia949]

I went through the same deliberation when I bought mine - my wife pushed me over the edge on buying the more expensive non CPO car that I wanted versus a handful of automatics available in the market.

Her justification was that I should buy what I want - I buy cars so infrequently, so I went in that direction. Happy I did.

The irony (or benefit) is that she hates driving my car. She has a 92 Miata and is spoiled by the short throw shifter and lighter clutch.

I'm perfectly fine with that !

[falkdal]

That is a good woman you have there. :-)

Your comment is interesting too because I've never driven a 2 series manual and some reviews call them rubbery. I have driven the ND Miata (actually have the orange 30th anniversary on pre-order) and like that shifter a lot. But Miata doesn't have a backseat so I will probably cancel that in favor of the 2 series

[CE750Jockey]

'19 M240i 'vert 6spd picked up at the BMW Performance Center.

BMW Race Car Driver: "How many of you are picking up a manual?"

I was the only one to raise my hand.

BMW Race Car Driver: "On behalf of my other fellow drivers, let me personally thank you for carrying on the tradition. We call manual transmissions 'Millennial anti-theft devices'".

He was right. That night I asked a hotel valet attendant if he could drive a stick. "Nope". Get in and tell me where you want me to park my car.

Love this car. Near-Porsche performance for $30K less.

[mr. zero]

They are rare, I'd say probably 1 in 200 is a manual. As said, most want all wheel drive, so it's a non-starter.

I just picked up my CPO '18 last Wed. The dealer's buyer told me that they will grab every manual that comes up at auctions, lots, etc. across the country. He said that he transferred one in from out west, and someone bought it sight unseen from California, and they had to ship it back across the country.

As to the shifter, they're all a bit floppy, and I would definitely recommend a weighted knob.

Here's another CPO at my dealer that you might be interested in:

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ngId=510783033

Or a brand new one:

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ngId=510062903

[jules_78th]

Yes they are rare in Ontario as well. When I made my initial used search, there was only 2 in all of Ontario... 2 manual Convertible. Both were 2016 M235 with under 20,000km and fell in the range of 45- 49k. So I ended up buying new (2019) with a base sticker price of 54k and a 7% discount.

Bought off the dealer without even getting a shot of test driving it, since there was no manual available, coupe or convertible to test drive.

I have 3 young kids and they love it. I'll just leave this here.. my best upgrade!

https://flic.kr/p/RjgzfV

[MostlyHarmless]

I like to use Auto Tempest since it searches everything, including eBay and Craig's List. Here's a link for a search I just did within 500 miles of my location (which is actually not that far from your location).

Looks like there's one manual vert M235i on cars.com as of today, and one in Santa Rosa on Craig's List.

I didn't find any M240i manual verts with my criteria, but you can fine tune that to your needs obviously.

Hope that helps!

[falkdal]

That mineral white (it is mineral right?) and red is a great combo. I'm looking at 2 like that although auto. Starting to almost like it even more than the blue and red.

Having not bought a new car in 9 years I'm a bit rusty. I assume my bargaining power is much greater when dealing with inventory on hand? Like for instance this dealer has a '17 that's been on the lot for 2 years, and they also have a few CPO cars that have been sitting around. But if I order the configuration I want on the website does that turn into a "dealer will find that somewhere and bring it in" or "will be built new from factory", and the prices are much less flexible?

[falkdal]

Originally Posted by MostlyHarmless

I like to use Auto Tempest since it searches everything, including eBay and Craig's List. Here's a link for a search I just did within 500 miles of my location (which is actually not that far from your location).

Looks like there's one manual vert M235i on cars.com as of today, and one in Santa Rosa on Craig's List.

I didn't find any M240i manual verts with my criteria, but you can fine tune that to your needs obviously.

Hope that helps!

Thanks. That LA car is an auto labeled as a manual, and I've talked to the Santa Rosa guy. His car is basically new and it has some nice upgrades, but his asking price seems very high and he sounds unwilling to budge much.

There is a dealer with one too in black/black that I'm testing tomorrow to settle the manual vs. auto decision. I don't love black on black though.

[morphomeman]

If you have the time and patience, wait and see how Santa Rosa man is doing.
People have unrealistic ideas about the value of their cars, houses, etc. Ditto for upgrades, which generally add no value to a vehicle and often (in the case of powertrain mods) subtract resale value. People usually get worn down and lower their asking price.

[35mmSummicron]

6MT's are definitely rare here in Canada. I test drove a m240xi coupe and 228xi vert, before I ordered my m240i 6MT, a 6 month wait. My dealer did let me test drive an M2 OG 6MT--I was really surprised they had one on the lot! Really hope next gen 2er offers manual transmission and not just for their M division cars.

[XutvJet]

Seeing that the take rate for the 6MT in the M235/240 is around 10%, I would imagine the take rate for 6MT convertibles is below 3%. The 6MT M2 take rate is over 50%.

If you want a 6MT, get it. It makes these cars a joy to drive. Are they marginally slower? Yep, but that's the price you pay for driving fun. The 8AT drives REALLY good and is the best auto out there, PERIOD, but don't fall for it if you want the 6MT. You'll get bored of the 8AT and regret the purchase. Be patient.

I had to order my M235 6MT because I wanted all sorts of weird options. I love that it's my own. I could have saved $5k buying an auto from the lot, but none were exactly what I wanted. So i paid more and haven't lost an ounce of sleep over it in 3.5 years.

[jules_78th]

Originally Posted by falkdal

That mineral white (it is mineral right?) and red is a great combo. I'm looking at 2 like that although auto. Starting to almost like it even more than the blue and red.

Having not bought a new car in 9 years I'm a bit rusty. I assume my bargaining power is much greater when dealing with inventory on hand? Like for instance this dealer has a '17 that's been on the lot for 2 years, and they also have a few CPO cars that have been sitting around. But if I order the configuration I want on the website does that turn into a "dealer will find that somewhere and bring it in" or "will be built new from factory", and the prices are much less flexible?

I got a few quote that I mass e-mailed to the bmw dealership I wanted to work with and got them into a bidding war. That gave me the 7% off MSRP. Helped since starting 2019 BMW stared charging $1500 for the leather (red in this case) interior.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by XutvJet

Seeing that the take rate for the 6MT in the M235/240 is around 10%

Wow, I can't believe the take rate is only 10% for the manual 235/240s.

That pretty much seals its fate for the next generation; BMW is not going to spend the money certifying a manual 2 series if it's not worthwhile to them.

Shame, maybe I'm getting old but I actually now prefer the 'sleeper' nature of the 240i over all the fanfare of a full blown M cars..

[falkdal]

Thanks all. The dealer had a fully loaded 17 in silver and black with the auto, leftover new stock and they offered me $14k off msrp on that one. It's tempting because it looked really nice and even had apple CarPlay and wireless charging and all that, but still. It would be an automatic; and it's still $44k plus taxes.

I'm also starting to think that perhaps I should get an e46 or even e36 M3 manual convertible as a second car instead of buying an expensive new/ish 2 series as my only car. The 328 is handy when the whole family has to make a trip with some luggage, and an older car would be an opportunity to tinker with some power mods (my friend runs a bmw performance shop). Hmmm...

[FunInTheSun]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Wow, I can't believe the take rate is only 10% for the manual 235/240s.

That pretty much seals its fate for the next generation; BMW is not going to spend the money certifying a manual 2 series if it's not worthwhile to them.

Shame, maybe I'm getting old but I actually now prefer the 'sleeper' nature of the 240i over all the fanfare of a full blown M cars..

Wow, I was feeling optimistic and thought 10% might be enough for the 2 series to keep the manual, but looking at all the new offerings, 2020 might be the last chance to get one.

What's crazy is BMW spent the time and energy for MY2019/MY2020 getting all the active safety features like emergency braking to work with manual too (something few? no? other manufacturers have done). They also used to offer 6MT with xDrive on the 2017 configurator (and 2018 as well?), but that was apparently extremely rare. Perhaps the 6MT will be an M-car only thing for a generation or two.

And yeah 10% sounds about right, based on scanning cars.com for all US M235i/M240i's and filtering. Of course, this is heavily skewed by all the 2016s coming off lease, and what's available and on lots. How would one find out, just do a massive serial VIN scan to see the %?

From about a week ago:
2014 was 3 manual / 16 auto for 16%
2015 M235i 83 autos and 36 manuals listed = 30%. I guess all the diehards bought this year.
2016 M235i 654 autos 58 manuals = 8% (perhaps skewed by off lease)
2017 M240i 32 autos, 0 manual (I actually checked 2 unknowns)
2018 M240i 33 autos and 3 manuals ~ 9%
2019 M240i new: 322 auto, 6 manual (I checked the ~10 unknown) = 1.8%.
Some of the higher figures might be inflated by non-manual manuals, but I didn't want to scroll through 58 cars in 2016.

I also look at the M2's offered and the take rate on the manual M2 is actually closer to 35%. I don't think it suffers from the same "these aren't going to move, so we're going to only order autos" effect.

As an aside, 2009 to 2019 is a total sea change for manuals. I think only four performance cars are faster with manual today (BRZ/86, WRX, Miata, Fiat 124) and four are manual only with Ford axing their ST/RS cars (Civic Si/Type R, Shelby GT500, STi). We also didn't really have a long enough period where autos and manual were roughly equal in fuel and acceleration to gauge the take rate there, once the ZF 8 speed came out, it was game over. I'm sure a nontrivial number of manual-for-the-performance buyers shifted.

[p912guy]

They also used to offer 6MT with xDrive on the 2017 configurator (and 2018 as well?), but that was apparently extremely rare.

I don't believe the 2 Series in xDrive was ever offered with MT - AT only. I believe one could get a 3 Series in xDrive with MT. There is no doubt the MT's are sadly dying a slow death and I think you may be correct in assuming the current 2 Series may be the last 2er with an MT, outside of the next M2. I don't think you'll be able to get a 3 or 4 Series with an MT outside the M3 or M4 either and even the "M" cars will be dropping the MT eventually, leaving Porsche as the only reasonable option for an MT car.