[den525]

Originally Posted by beemer

http://www.carsales.com.au/cars/resu...srcx=makemodel

these would have to struggle to sell at this price, but it makes the M2 look better

I doubt it... Rs3 and m2 aren't exactly in the same market despite both cars being German and top of the range small cars.

Rs3 is a 5 door hatch while M2 is a 2 door coupe.

I think RS3 will sell well. Both should be fun

[Cpdbeemer]

Red calipers? uggh. My pet hate.

[WAY]

There will be plenty of cross shopping between M2 and RS3 for sure.

[nick85]

Why is the A45 ridiculously cheaper in comparison?

[den525]

Originally Posted by nick85

Why is the A45 ridiculously cheaper in comparison?

Interesting question... In my opinion despite the cla45 being an AMG. It's NOT anywhere near M2 territory! The M235i is better than the CLA45, so yeah At 86k base vs 100k base I'd pick the M2. The CLA45 is overpriced for what you're getting.

Ps. CLA45 more a competitor rather than the hatch A45

[nick85]

The new a45 has 280kw and adaptive dampening. Sleek interior are some of the pros and for around 25k $ cheaper... Amg almost stole me.

Trivett had told me m2 will be there around Feb 2016 starting from $110,000. But not 100% confirmed can't wait!

[nick85]

The salesman also said it was limited production for Australia. But from his tone it wasn't confirmed... Could be just trying to get my eoi. 😂

[05C4R]

Originally Posted by nick85

The salesman also said it was limited production for Australia. But from his tone it wasn't confirmed... Could be just trying to get my eoi. ��

A car salesman can accurately be described as one of the lowest forms of life on the planet, it's only natural competitors to being crowned the lowest form of life are real estate agents and lawyers so...probably not limited

[Hazey82]

Any salesman that says its limited i would ask them when the production run is then you can call him out and say it's 2018 and you won't fall for this limited nonsense. Play them off with the AMG and Rs3

[nick85]

True, but wouldn't hurt to just leave an EOI deposit, you can always get it back

[John_01]

I think the A45 and RS3 are cheaper because they are based on high production volume front wheel drive chassis. Also there is no BMW branding .

[BMWRX]

Originally Posted by nick85

The new a45 has 280kw and adaptive dampening. Sleek interior are some of the pros and for around 25k $ cheaper... Amg almost stole me.

Trivett had told me m2 will be there around Feb 2016 starting from $110,000. But not 100% confirmed can't wait!

They may yet still get me. The CLA45 has ALL the fruit and a much cheaper price. The M2 price will need to be sharp and include decent options to keep me in a BMW.

[den525]

Originally Posted by BMWRX

They may yet still get me. The CLA45 has ALL the fruit and a much cheaper price. The M2 price will need to be sharp and include decent options to keep me in a BMW.

Depends on your definition of "all the fruit"!!! I just think cla45 is just not good enough! Interior apart from the seats is just awful, cheap fake carbon fibre interior, cheap iPad screen, harsh ride. It's not very Mercedes!

Yes engine is great but if the car doesn't feel like a Mercedes what's the point? Wouldn't buy it even if it's another 10k cheaper!

[david.orr]

Originally Posted by den525

Depends on your definition of "all the fruit"!!! I just think cla45 is just not good enough! Interior apart from the seats is just awful, cheap fake carbon fibre interior, cheap iPad screen, harsh ride. It's not very Mercedes!

Yes engine is great but if the car doesn't feel like a Mercedes what's the point? Wouldn't buy it even if it's another 10k cheaper!

I agree CLA45 is M235 competitor not M2.

That said, I found the CF bits in my A45 felt and looked tons better than the M Performance hard CF parts in my M235, the same parts in M2. Alcantara nice in both. The screen tho clunky, has better functionality and is more user friendly than the ones in M235 and 1M. The suspension in the CLA45 is only the A-class sports suspension and is nowhere as stiff as the AMG suspension I optioned in the A45. The AMG suspension is however not as stiff nor unforgiving as the M suspension in my E46M3 nor 1M.

Agreed, first gen CLA45 and A45 are not the best but I do not believe they are as bad as you made them out to be.

[den525]

Originally Posted by 1M235i

I agree CLA45 is M235 competitor not M2.

That said, I found the CF bits in my A45 felt and looked tons better than the M Performance hard CF parts in my M235, the same parts in M2. Alcantara nice in both. The screen tho clunky, has better functionality and is more user friendly than the ones in M235 and 1M. The suspension in the CLA45 is only the A-class sports suspension and is nowhere as stiff as the AMG suspension I optioned in the A45. The AMG suspension is however not as stiff nor unforgiving as the M suspension in my E46M3 nor 1M.

Agreed, first gen CLA45 and A45 are not the best but I do not believe they are as bad as you made them out to be.

I don't know about that. The CF bits on the A45/CLA45 just looks cheap and tacky. It's not real CF, so never know why it should look CF.

Mercedes screen have better functionality? more user friendly? The system feels outdated, looks even more outdated.

CLA45 indeed don't have the AMG performance suspension, in stock form it's pretty bad, in AMG Performance suspension? The ride is unbearable, having driven both the 1M and A45 extensively, I can't agree with the 1M suspension being stiffer than the AMG performance suspension. Did drive a E46 M3 for several weeks, but that had aftermarket parts on it so can't really compare.

What I dislike the most about the A-class is it doesn't feel Mercedes, the seats, dials, buttons yes. But you sit in that car, the visual just doesn't do it for me, the ride just don't do it for me.

I love the Mercedes brand, my next car will the be C63S coupe, drove the sedan version, and it feels Mercedes.

[BMWRX]

So apart from the suspension and a few carbon bits that are subjectively tacky or not, you think it's a good bit of kit?

The suspension is adaptive/selectable in the MY16 and the carbon trim is indeed proper carbon too. Problem solved!

I do agree with you a bit that it's not pure Mercedes. However the interior feels far more special than that in the M235i on which the M2 is heavily based. At the prices these cars are I want to feel like I'm sitting in something special. The M235i failed in that regard, whereas the CLA45 succeeded. Hopefully the M2 raises the bar even higher.

[den525]

Originally Posted by BMWRX

So apart from the suspension and a few carbon bits that are subjectively tacky or not, you think it's a good bit of kit?

The suspension is adaptive/selectable in the MY16 and the carbon trim is indeed proper carbon too. Problem solved!

I do agree with you a bit that it's not pure Mercedes. However the interior feels far more special than that in the M235i on which the M2 is heavily based. At the prices these cars are I want to feel like I'm sitting in something special. The M235i failed in that regard, whereas the CLA45 succeeded. Hopefully the M2 raises the bar even higher.

For the price? No.

I haven't driven the MY16 maybe the adaptive suspension will solve the rough ride. I expect a rough ride from an EVO, WRX, civic type r or rs275... Mercedes? Not so much.

As for the interior, Mercedes clearly states, carbon effect trim NOT carbon fibre trim.

As for the "feel" that's definitely a personal opinion. BMW is definitely more understated, I think it's a more mature feel and look while the Mercedes is boyish... Special? That's pushing it. Like I said previously, the seats are great, steering wheel and instrument cluster are also great. But iPad screen? Functionality? Middle console? All feels cheap.

Anyways... A45 goes up against the M135i and the M135i is 10k cheaper and is a better car. M235i also 10k cheaper than the CLA45 which is also a better car...

So for the price? Despite it being a decent bit of kit, it's doesn't drive well enough or a complete enough package.

[BMWRX]

All fair points. However I'd like to know where everyone is getting their M235i's with the same options as the CLA45 for $85K. The best I've been offered is $105K and that was after haggling.

Personally I think the M235i is a good car but the steering and brakes are a massive let down and the reasons I didn't buy one. I actually think the CLA45 seats aren't as comfortable as those in the BMW despite looking awesome.

All of this is subjective. What I think feels special, others think is boyish. What I think is poor design and hard plastics, other think is understated. That's the joy of car ownership, you (should) only have one person you need to impress to want a car.

[Hazey82]

I posted this in the M2 vs thread, thought I would post it here as it may help others but for my own sanity this is what I came up with. Comments welcomed

M2

Negatives (in order)
Seats
No M Mirrors
M buttons
Weight
No CF Roof
No Power Dome
Notes: Has been restricted by M division

Positives
Sounds better than F80/F82
Footprint/Tossable, Coupe (Back to old school M3 size e.g E46)
Price
Road Presence
Last small size manual non Hybrid M car??
Notes: Can change seats, Mirrors, Add CF Roof or wrap

M3
Negatives(in order)
Size/Footprint/Playfulness??
Exhaust Sound (replacing exhaust is $$ and I don’t think it does much)
Price

Positives
Bespoke Engine (beast)
Seats / Interior
CF Roof and other CF bits
Mirrors
Weight reduction
Power Dome
M3 badge
M buttons
Road Presence
Last manual non Hybrid M car??
Notes: All the bits, M gave it everything

In conclusion it comes down to at the end of the 5 years do I want

a) Smaller 2 door Manual M car that will retire to become the weekend toy and have a separate family car. Last small sized playful coupe manual M car?? Has hints of E30, E46. Desirable in 5-10yrs +

b) Practical full M car covers family and play duties. Last manual M car?? Desirable in 5-10yrs +

Option of leasing M2 for 3 years and then making the switch to M3 on a 5 year lease is too much money to blow over 7 years.
I'm leaning toward the F80 and will take one for a good drive around some twisties to see if the size is really a issue

Note: Final pricing of the M2 will also be a big factor

Now if only I could afford to keep my E46 M3 while getting the F80 that would be perfect as it covers both a and b options.
Cheers

[david.orr]

Originally Posted by den525

I haven't driven the MY16 maybe the adaptive suspension will solve the rough ride. I expect a rough ride from an EVO, WRX, civic type r or rs275... Mercedes? Not so much.

As for the interior, Mercedes clearly states, carbon effect trim NOT carbon fibre trim.

As for the "feel" that's definitely a personal opinion. BMW is definitely more understated, I think it's a more mature feel and look while the Mercedes is boyish... Special? That's pushing it. Like I said previously, the seats are great, steering wheel and instrument cluster are also great. But iPad screen? Functionality? Middle console? All feels cheap.

you must be getting old den

[den525]

Originally Posted by BMWRX

All fair points. However I'd like to know where everyone is getting their M235i's with the same options as the CLA45 for $85K. The best I've been offered is $105K and that was after haggling.

Personally I think the M235i is a good car but the steering and brakes are a massive let down and the reasons I didn't buy one. I actually think the CLA45 seats aren't as comfortable as those in the BMW despite looking awesome.

All of this is subjective. What I think feels special, others think is boyish. What I think is poor design and hard plastics, other think is understated. That's the joy of car ownership, you (should) only have one person you need to impress to want a car.

I got mine fully optioned (except HK) for just under $82k 8 months ago brand new. The best i got for the CLA45 was 94k.

[den525]

Originally Posted by 1M235i

you must be getting old den

That's definitely true as well! These things probably didn't bother me 4-5 years ago, while now I find important.