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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum Technical Topics B58 (M240i) Engine, Transmission, Exhaust, Tuning Update on B58 problems - finally resolved

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      04-09-2021, 06:53 PM   #1
BrettKA7
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On April 1 at 52,000 miles, my car suddenly began experiencing some issues. It began squealing, followed by heavy smoke coming out of the tailpipe. Once it was towed and unloaded, it began shaking.

BMW initially thought it was the valvetronic motor / actuator due to a stored code and a noise, so they replaced it. I think this was related to a small squeaky noise I've been randomly hearing but unable to reliably duplicate. This did not have a positive effect on the car's operation.

The shop foreman reached out to engineering and they proceeded with a valve cover replacement next. Upon starting the car, it continued to exhibit all original symptoms.

Next, the fuel tank vent valve in the engine bay was replaced. This was related to a check engine light that only illuminated once the car arrived at the dealership.

Finally, engineering approved a second valve cover for the car. This, along with cleaning the oily spark plugs and replacing injector rings during the second valve cover replacement, is what resolved the concern.

With the engine so new, I hope this can help someone as these cars start to exit their warranty coverage!
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      04-10-2021, 10:29 AM   #2
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I'm glad to hear that they fixed your car. How long did the whole process take them?

Also, do you happen to have your statement with the parts numbers that have been replaced? I ask because my 240 just hit 40,000 miles, and with reading a few threads on here already about cars starting to smoke, I would feel better having them check my car out before mine starts experiencing the same symptoms.
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      04-12-2021, 11:49 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by imperialgrunt View Post
I'm glad to hear that they fixed your car. How long did the whole process take them?

Also, do you happen to have your statement with the parts numbers that have been replaced? I ask because my 240 just hit 40,000 miles, and with reading a few threads on here already about cars starting to smoke, I would feel better having them check my car out before mine starts experiencing the same symptoms.
Here are all the parts they replaced. Total process was 8 days, not too bad.
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      04-13-2021, 01:02 PM   #4
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Thank you for the update 👍🏻👍🏻
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      04-21-2021, 02:17 PM   #5
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Glad it for worked out.
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      04-21-2021, 05:30 PM   #6
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My friend who knows about my valve cover / PCV failure sent me a video that I suppose looks like ANOTHER valve cover failure from a random M240i owner. Here are a couple screen grabs.
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      04-21-2021, 07:47 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettKA7 View Post
My friend who knows about my valve cover / PCV failure sent me a video that I suppose looks like ANOTHER valve cover failure from a random M240i owner. Here are a couple screen grabs.
The first thing that always occurs to me is we shouldn't be buying BMWs thinking they're reliable in the way that Japanese cars are.

Since the mid-1970s, I've owned Japanese and BMW cars exclusively, and always simultaneously. The BMWs have always needed to be owned with the understanding that they will have more problems and that those problems will cost significantly more than if they'd occurred in a Japanese car.

Mind you, the Japanese cars typically don't have any problems, making the difference even more stark. Still, it's always cooler to be driving a BMW. That's just the way it is.

So, and as has been the question for decades now: what do BMW owners get out of owning a car with the Roundel on the hood, beyond driving the cooler car?

My argument has always been this: better inherent handling, especially if it's augmented with aftermarket parts. My car has those significantly expensive parts. When I'm not going to be taking advantage of them, I drive the wife's Mazda 3. Go figure, right.
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      04-21-2021, 09:00 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettKA7 View Post
My friend who knows about my valve cover / PCV failure sent me a video that I suppose looks like ANOTHER valve cover failure from a random M240i owner. Here are a couple screen grabs.
The first thing that always occurs to me is we shouldn't be buying BMWs thinking they're reliable in the way that Japanese cars are.

Since the mid-1970s, I've owned Japanese and BMW cars exclusively, and always simultaneously. The BMWs have always needed to be owned with the understanding that they will have more problems and that those problems will cost significantly more than if they'd occurred in a Japanese car.

Mind you, the Japanese cars typically don't have any problems, making the difference even more stark. Still, it's always cooler to be driving a BMW. That's just the way it is.

So, and as has been the question for decades now: what do BMW owners get out of owning a car with the Roundel on the hood, beyond driving the cooler car?

My argument has always been this: better inherent handling, especially if it's augmented with aftermarket parts. My car has those significantly expensive parts. When I'm not going to be taking advantage of them, I drive the wife's Mazda 3. Go figure, right.
No offense intended, but this feels like an excuse.

Why can Toyota make the 2UR-GSE V8 with 475 HP, 395 lb ft of torque reliably, but BMW still can't make an I6 for their mid-level cars without a significant (20, maybe even 30) amount of people reporting serious issues within 5 years of ownership?

This is also even AFTER teaming up with Toyota and still not being willing to put the extra cost into parts that last.
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      04-21-2021, 09:20 PM   #9
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No offense intended, but this feels like an excuse.
Who might I be excusing: the Japanese for being willing to offer more bang-for-the-buck, or the Germans for laughing all the way to the bank?
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      04-22-2021, 01:05 AM   #10
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My experience with Japanese cars is that the low-stressed low-tech engines tend to be quite reliable, but Toyota certainly has seen a lot more basic engine problems, outside of the problematic 3.0 V6s and general sludge problems in the past such as:

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/...lling-73881740

https://www.consumerreports.org/car-...camry-rav4-es/

https://www.industryweek.com/the-eco...er-engine-flaw

https://www.auto123.com/en/news/2018...pistons/64522/
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      05-06-2021, 11:19 AM   #11
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Pulling the thread back on topic, thank you for your post op and showing your warranty comments! My 2017 only has 22k miles so I’ve got a ways to go but good to know as something to look out for! Like you said, we need these types of threads to keep track of gremlins.
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      05-06-2021, 01:06 PM   #12
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I question this as an inherent issue with these motors - my car has 64,000 miles now, I ordered it and got it in Jan 2017. It had it's first oil change @ 1,200 miles, and then at 2,500 miles, since then it's been every 5,000 miles. I changed the gearbox fluid @ 20,000 miles and again @ 40,000 miles then 60,000 miles. Differential fluid has been changed every 30,000 miles. The coolant has been flushed and changed @ 40,000 miles.

I recently got back from a 2500 mile road trip where I spent a week flogging it at Deal Gap and other roads in the Smoky mountains. My car burns no oil, Blackstone analysis is good nothing out of the ordinary, it also does not smoke. While I might be over doing the preventative maintenance - I firmly believe many people do the extended fluid changes, especially oil or do not let the engine oil get up to temp before flogging it, or even use cheap oil. I don't think it's as simple as the motors as flawed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrettKA7 View Post
My friend who knows about my valve cover / PCV failure sent me a video that I suppose looks like ANOTHER valve cover failure from a random M240i owner. Here are a couple screen grabs.
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      05-24-2021, 10:36 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfGTI View Post
I question this as an inherent issue with these motors - my car has 64,000 miles now, I ordered it and got it in Jan 2017. It had it's first oil change @ 1,200 miles, and then at 2,500 miles, since then it's been every 5,000 miles. I changed the gearbox fluid @ 20,000 miles and again @ 40,000 miles then 60,000 miles. Differential fluid has been changed every 30,000 miles. The coolant has been flushed and changed @ 40,000 miles.

I recently got back from a 2500 mile road trip where I spent a week flogging it at Deal Gap and other roads in the Smoky mountains. My car burns no oil, Blackstone analysis is good nothing out of the ordinary, it also does not smoke. While I might be over doing the preventative maintenance - I firmly believe many people do the extended fluid changes, especially oil or do not let the engine oil get up to temp before flogging it, or even use cheap oil. I don't think it's as simple as the motors as flawed.
Black stone came back A ok?
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      05-28-2021, 08:51 AM   #14
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60,000 mile Blackstone results were good nothing out of the ordinary was noted, based on the traces nothing is wearing abnormally.

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Black stone came back A ok?
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      08-09-2022, 04:52 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfGTI View Post
I question this as an inherent issue with these motors - my car has 64,000 miles now, I ordered it and got it in Jan 2017. It had it's first oil change @ 1,200 miles, and then at 2,500 miles, since then it's been every 5,000 miles. I changed the gearbox fluid @ 20,000 miles and again @ 40,000 miles then 60,000 miles. Differential fluid has been changed every 30,000 miles. The coolant has been flushed and changed @ 40,000 miles.

I recently got back from a 2500 mile road trip where I spent a week flogging it at Deal Gap and other roads in the Smoky mountains. My car burns no oil, Blackstone analysis is good nothing out of the ordinary, it also does not smoke. While I might be over doing the preventative maintenance - I firmly believe many people do the extended fluid changes, especially oil or do not let the engine oil get up to temp before flogging it, or even use cheap oil. I don't think it's as simple as the motors as flawed.
While I admire your dedication to preventative maintenance, we cannot presume that it will prevent failures due to design flaws. If your goal is to get 64000 miles out of your modern passenger car while performing and paying for exorbitant maintenance, then perhaps BMW is for you. Last month I would have agreed with you and probably supported your position. This month I am driving my daughters 2003 Lexus with over 210,000 miles and no issues because my 2017 M240i totaled itself, with no warning at 51000 miles. My maintenance routine was very similar to yours; LL-01 Liqui Moly, OEM filters, coolant change with OEM coolant, all done prior to recommended intervals. However, it didn't stop my turbo from failing and destroying the motor presumably due to failed seals and foreign debris down the intake. This was most likely caused by idling the car for an extended period just prior. By the way, BMW of North America has declined to assist with any of the out of warranty repairs. Initial quote from the dealership is $31,000.
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      08-09-2022, 05:57 PM   #16
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Which specific Liqui Moly did you use? The B58 requires Liqui Moly Top Tec 6600 0w20 or Top Tec 6100 0w30 to meet BMW oil specs.
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      08-09-2022, 08:02 PM   #17
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Sorry to hear about your car. My car is now @ 78,000 miles and still has no issue. I have never had anything but maintenance and I did not find it exorbitant (I don't go to the dealer once my warranty expired @ 50,000 miles) I wish you good luck in the future. Incidentally I was in Park City all week last week, wish I had my car out there as the rental wasn't quite the same.

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Originally Posted by LuckyMike View Post
While I admire your dedication to preventative maintenance, we cannot presume that it will prevent failures due to design flaws. If your goal is to get 64000 miles out of your modern passenger car while performing and paying for exorbitant maintenance, then perhaps BMW is for you. Last month I would have agreed with you and probably supported your position. This month I am driving my daughters 2003 Lexus with over 210,000 miles and no issues because my 2017 M240i totaled itself, with no warning at 51000 miles. My maintenance routine was very similar to yours; LL-01 Liqui Moly, OEM filters, coolant change with OEM coolant, all done prior to recommended intervals. However, it didn't stop my turbo from failing and destroying the motor presumably due to failed seals and foreign debris down the intake. This was most likely caused by idling the car for an extended period just prior. By the way, BMW of North America has declined to assist with any of the out of warranty repairs. Initial quote from the dealership is $31,000.
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      08-10-2022, 02:29 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyMike View Post
While I admire your dedication to preventative maintenance, we cannot presume that it will prevent failures due to design flaws. If your goal is to get 64000 miles out of your modern passenger car while performing and paying for exorbitant maintenance, then perhaps BMW is for you. Last month I would have agreed with you and probably supported your position. This month I am driving my daughters 2003 Lexus with over 210,000 miles and no issues because my 2017 M240i totaled itself, with no warning at 51000 miles. My maintenance routine was very similar to yours; LL-01 Liqui Moly, OEM filters, coolant change with OEM coolant, all done prior to recommended intervals. However, it didn't stop my turbo from failing and destroying the motor presumably due to failed seals and foreign debris down the intake. This was most likely caused by idling the car for an extended period just prior. By the way, BMW of North America has declined to assist with any of the out of warranty repairs. Initial quote from the dealership is $31,000.
I wouldnt go that far to call it failure due to design flaw. Horrible and terribly sorry to hear your case but does not sound like it happens to many of us. Yours are likely and hopefully part of special lemon cases
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      08-12-2022, 10:52 AM   #19
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The reason I call it a design flaw is because I believe that to be true. My justification for this position is numerous complaints of having serious issues after idling B58 motors for extended periods. Idling the vehicle is within its standard operating profile and should not cause failures. The most common complaint is PCV valve failure which results in a horrific amount of smoke from the exhaust. While you can easily replace the PCV valve, replacement does not correct the untold damage caused to the internals of the motor and turbo. A less common, but still significant number of complaints are for turbo failure after idling. This was the case for me and it went unnoticed because I happened to be cruising and was unaware the turbo had malfunctioned until it was too late. No check engine light, no indication of the problem that resulted in total destruction of my motor, which apparently can not be consistently successfully rebuilt and must be replaced. As an aerospace engineer I understand how to design complicated systems, and the system must be designed for the entire operational envelope, even idle, even for extended periods.
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      08-14-2022, 07:39 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyMike View Post
The reason I call it a design flaw is because I believe that to be true. My justification for this position is numerous complaints of having serious issues after idling B58 motors for extended periods. Idling the vehicle is within its standard operating profile and should not cause failures. The most common complaint is PCV valve failure which results in a horrific amount of smoke from the exhaust. While you can easily replace the PCV valve, replacement does not correct the untold damage caused to the internals of the motor and turbo. A less common, but still significant number of complaints are for turbo failure after idling. This was the case for me and it went unnoticed because I happened to be cruising and was unaware the turbo had malfunctioned until it was too late. No check engine light, no indication of the problem that resulted in total destruction of my motor, which apparently can not be consistently successfully rebuilt and must be replaced. As an aerospace engineer I understand how to design complicated systems, and the system must be designed for the entire operational envelope, even idle, even for extended periods.
Your issue makes no sense. People experience PCV failures due to built up crankcase pressure but that does not cause turbos to fail and engines to fail.
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      08-14-2022, 05:24 PM   #21
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Quote:
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Your issue makes no sense. People experience PCV failures due to built up crankcase pressure but that does not cause turbos to fail and engines to fail.
I'm quite literally listening to one of your YouTube videos as I type this haha

Keep up the good work man!
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      08-15-2022, 08:25 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LuckyMike View Post
While I admire your dedication to preventative maintenance, we cannot presume that it will prevent failures due to design flaws. If your goal is to get 64000 miles out of your modern passenger car while performing and paying for exorbitant maintenance, then perhaps BMW is for you. Last month I would have agreed with you and probably supported your position. This month I am driving my daughters 2003 Lexus with over 210,000 miles and no issues because my 2017 M240i totaled itself, with no warning at 51000 miles. My maintenance routine was very similar to yours; LL-01 Liqui Moly, OEM filters, coolant change with OEM coolant, all done prior to recommended intervals. However, it didn't stop my turbo from failing and destroying the motor presumably due to failed seals and foreign debris down the intake. This was most likely caused by idling the car for an extended period just prior. By the way, BMW of North America has declined to assist with any of the out of warranty repairs. Initial quote from the dealership is $31,000.
So they offered to build you a replacement car for that price?
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