[BelugaaF22]

hi guys,

do you think our f series 228 or m235s will begin to appreciate in value as the the new g series 2s come out given there controversial design and styling? especially if we have a manual transmission? thoughts?

[overcoil]

Guess the general car drought occurring now is having a greater increase on your cars value than what the intro of the new 2-Series will create.

[freakystyly]

Appreciate, as in not be below MSRP? never..

Drive it, enjoy it, buy another if you love it enough.

Depreciation may slow compared to F30/32 but I highly doubt it will be a highly sought after car in a generation or two.

[shadowfax]

The M2 CS might.

[harma24]

If you're looking to cars for an investment, you need to be looking at cars in the $500k and up range which will never be driven and are stored in a climate controlled garage that can hold 20-30 cars.

If you're asking if your daily driver 2'er will gain value, you've been smoking some really good exhaust fumes. If you're buying a 2-series, you're about 10x out of the ballpark of an investment car (willing to bet not even the M2 CS is a good investment*). As Freaky said, drive it and enjoy it.



* - Good investment being defined as something that could beat putting your money in the stock market for an inflation adjusted annualized real return of 7%.

[Unicorn123]

Originally Posted by harma24

If you're looking to cars for an investment, you need to be looking at cars in the $500k and up range which will never be driven and are stored in a climate controlled garage that can hold 20-30 cars.

If you're asking if your daily driver 2'er will gain value, you've been smoking some really good exhaust fumes. If you're buying a 2-series, you're about 10x out of the ballpark of an investment car (willing to bet not even the M2 CS is a good investment*). As Freaky said, drive it and enjoy it.



* - Good investment being defined as something that could beat putting your money in the stock market for an inflation adjusted annualized real return of 7%.

Ditto.

At the end of the day, few BMW's achieve "investment grade" status unless they are very rare / limited edition (i.e. 507 or Z8), a full out "M" model (i.e. E30 M3 or a 1M) or in a lesser case, retain decent residual value due to cult status (E39 540i 6M, E46 ZHP).

I seriously doubt our 2-Series cars, will get to this point; perhaps cult status in 25-30 years or so...

[freakystyly]

Originally Posted by Unicorn123

Ditto.

At the end of the day, few BMW's achieve "investment grade" status unless they are very rare / limited edition (i.e. 507 or Z8), a full out "M" model (i.e. E30 M3 or a 1M) or in a lesser case, retain decent residual value due to cult status (E39 540i 6M, E46 ZHP).

I seriously doubt our 2-Series cars, will get to this point; perhaps cult status in 25-30 years or so...

While not amazing, the S54 powered cars showed some appreciation over the years. I've been watching Z3M coupes (clownshoe is rare) pricing and most are above MSRP (adjusted for inflation). The S52 powered are still up there but much less desirable. True "S" engines are typically worth more. With the exception to the 1 series M (again due to rarity). There isn't really anything amazing about these modern BMWs until maybe the last gas powered car rolls off the line. Even the last manual model may go unnoticed by the market.

[leftoverture]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

Guess the general car drought occurring now is having a greater increase on your cars value than what the intro of the new 2-Series will create.

^What he said. The used car market is crazy right now so trade in values are up or holding steady. But as an investment cars are horrible. So drive it like you stole it.

[VAcurler]

If you bought something like an M2CS and garaged it for 20 years it might eventually be worth what you paid for it. It would have to be museum quality and not driven and then you'd need to hope that people that they were cool. Now if you bought something super rare and limited (Ford GT was the last non-exotic I could think of) and kept it that would be another story but as posted above you need to spend 6 digits on a new car and not drive it to keep its value. You could buy something older like an E30 that will go up in value but appreciating above MSRP plus inflation takes a long time and a little luck for regular production vehicles.

[BelugaaF22]

Thanks for your input all. I wasnt referring to investment worthy at all actually. I simply just want to switch cars (maybe to f87 or something of the likes) and was wondering if its worth while to wait a few more years or will the values go down significantly at that point.

[overcoil]

Originally Posted by BelugaaF22

Thanks for your input all. I wasnt referring to investment worthy at all actually. I simply just want to switch cars (maybe to f87 or something of the likes) and was wondering if its worth while to wait a few more years or will the values go down significantly at that point.

I don't know investment or future values. However, I do think a 4-cylinder, six-speed 2-Series is a wonderful ( just don't know what other word to use ) car. Such a good configuration that you really need to assess if you need a more powerful car and it's associated higher running cost.

[Shovelman]

Originally Posted by ScottSinger

I don't know investment or future values. However, I do think a 4-cylinder, six-speed 2-Series is a wonderful ( just don't know what other word to use ) car. Such a good configuration that you really need to assess if you need a more powerful car and it's associated higher running cost.

Agree, mine will not be available anytime soon.

[USA-RET]

I just got a trade in notice from my dealership. 2017 M240i 8K miles, absolutely perfect in every way (not even one road nick), interior is perfect, non-smoker, Dinan Elite tune, Dinan CF intake, Car has never been raced or tracked, most I've done with it is 3/4 throttle from a 25 mile roll. All services done, moon roof delete Fully optioned. Garage kept.

Offer was $29K if I traded for the 2 series Gran Coupe......................Last time I checked KBB it was $37K trade and $39K Private party.

[raddoc]

Carvana pays much better than dealers or CarMax and you don't need to leave your house to do the deal. I got $39K for my 2020 230x F23 w/7500mi. Dealer and CarMax both offered $31K.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by USA-RET

I just got a trade in notice from my dealership. 2017 M240i 8K miles, absolutely perfect in every way (not even one road nick), interior is perfect, non-smoker, Dinan Elite tune, Dinan CF intake, Car has never been raced or tracked, most I've done with it is 3/4 throttle from a 25 mile roll. All services done, moon roof delete Fully optioned. Garage kept.

Offer was $29K if I traded for the 2 series Gran Coupe......................Last time I checked KBB it was $37K trade and $39K Private party.

Talk about going backwards...

[msej449]

I think that cars built in the last 10 years are actually going to be highly undesirable as 'classics' because they are too sophisticated to be converted to electricity.

Here in the UK, there's a rapidly-expanding industry based on retro-fitting electic drive to older classic cars. This, where the bodywork and suspension are in good condition (or refurbished) but the engines/drivetrain are too old to get spares for. Conversion costs range from GBP £15K off-the-shelf to £30K+ for a one-off bespoke conversion.

Key thing is that these all have simple vehicle electronics, so ditching the engine, gearbox and drivetrain is easy - there's no firmware to get confused. Modern cars have too much digital stuff spread all over the vehicle.

So if you're after a classic, I'd say look at something pre-1990ish that's been well-maintained but higher mileage, then buy it to subsequently retro-fit electic: something like my E30 Touring for example. A popular off-the-shelf conversion is the classic VW Transporter. There are quite a lot of restored examples where the engine/gearbox is just too old to replace and a e-conversion makes sense. For a lot of classic car owners, an e-conversion is attractive because they can actuallly drive the car much more, where previously every mile driven brought it nearer to engine/drivetrain failure, despite sound suspension and bodywork.

With the current low mileage rate of my F23 I thought that even the top-end, £30K e-conversion might be attractive in comparison with buying a new M440i equivalent replacement. But the digital electronics are so diverse and integrated into the engine, gearbox and transmission that replacing the interfaces would be impossible.

[leftoverture]

Originally Posted by BelugaaF22

Thanks for your input all. I wasnt referring to investment worthy at all actually. I simply just want to switch cars (maybe to f87 or something of the likes) and was wondering if its worth while to wait a few more years or will the values go down significantly at that point.

I just traded in my (non- BMW) car last weekend. Five months ago it had a KBB trade in value of just over $9000. Last weekend the KBB trade in was up to $11,900. The dealer gave me $14,000! And the car I bought was priced under KBB trade in value... I could litterally trade it in today for what I paid. The used car market is crazy right now. My 2 series, on the other hand, had a KBB trade value of $24,000 a month or so ago, but now is back down to $21,500. The only way to find out your situation is to go try to make the deal but be prepared to be blown away.

[USA-RET]

Originally Posted by dradernh

Talk about going backwards...

Exactly my thoughts too I already have a Mini Cooper

[harma24]

Originally Posted by USA-RET

Offer was $29K if I traded for the 2 series Gran Coupe

That's an insult; you'd have to give me something closer to $75k to get me to switch to a 2GC. With that, I'd buy the 2GC and get a rental car to drive for a few months. Then I'll trade in the 2GC with only 50 miles on it (round trip to the dealer plus the 5 or so miles on a new car) and order a proper 2-series!

And yes, I have driven one (2020 BMW Ultimate Driver Experience); wasn't a fan.

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by harma24

That's an insult

That was certainly my first impression, and one that I still have.

I suppose some dealers' sales staffs operate from the point of view that the people they engage with are uninformed about the market. Perhaps many, or most(?), are uninformed, I don't know. However, you can't turn on your tv or read a newspaper article today without hearing about the substantial increase in used car prices, and all of the reasons for them. What I'm clear on is that entering the market without having done our due diligence for the second largest purchase that most of us make opens us up to all sorts of unfortunate practices.

I get that BMW dealers have remarkable overheads, many of their new car sales are made at relatively modest profit margins, and that they make the bulk of their income from the service bays and their used car lots. Also that BMW itself has noticeable influence over their dealers, not least when a newly-introduced marketing model requires dealers to spend very large sums revamping their physical plants. The latter aspect is when I began to understand why dealerships are not our first choice when trying to keep maintenance costs in check.

TLDR; caveat emptor, still the best advice on offer to our consumerist society.

[BelugaaF22]

hmm I don't know I sometimes want to switch cars maybe to m2 or m3 just because I've never been in a M car. if I have this thought sometimes, do I really love my car? but whenever I do drive it, I fall in love with it again. I really like the exterior looks or the M cars compared to the non M variants so maybe that plays into a reason why I still feel like my old 228i isn't "good enough" but in reality, it's a great car. just getting conflicted haha :

[Nickies]

Originally Posted by BelugaaF22

hmm I don't know I sometimes want to switch cars maybe to m2 or m3 just because I've never been in a M car. if I have this thought sometimes, do I really love my car? but whenever I do drive it, I fall in love with it again. I really like the exterior looks or the M cars compared to the non M variants so maybe that plays into a reason why I still feel like my old 228i isn't "good enough" but in reality, it's a great car. just getting conflicted haha :

I have never been interested in an M2 because I don't like the fat fenders and the N55 engine has not a good reputation. The M240 full fill my needs and it doesn't attract much attention.

After 18K from new, I consider it is in showroom condition with no dings or scratches, immaculate detailed paint, all options with desirable accessories minus leather and it is also a LCI. Furthermore, it is fully stock and has no mods that in my opinion just reduce the value when time come to sell.

If it is true that car value is up, I would sell to the first to offer $45k but I know it will never happen because after all they are not so desirable.