[selmeralto]

I have a large collection of CDs, a portion of which I'd like to make available for my HK system in a 2016 M235i. What is the best way to do this that would result in the highest possible audio quality?

I'm assuming that the key is to create FLAC lossless files. Yes?

And if so, what device would be best for the highest quality? An external player connected by USB?

Any recommendations on how to do this and what equipment to use would be appreciated.

Flat sound a priority.

Thanks.

[Kristalov]

I use an external FLAC player (small FiiO X3) and use HDTracks for optimum lossless file quality. I also have converted regular CD's to FLAC using PC software.

Overall the HK system is mediocre at best for sound quality but you can tell a difference. Hope that helps.

FYI Slickdeals.com has a sale on some FLAC players currently

[selmeralto]

Great, Kristalov. Thanks.

And and am I right that the FiiO effectively adds an equalizer to the system in case I want to tweak the HK stock sound?

Originally Posted by Kristalov

I use an external FLAC player (small FiiO X3) and use HDTracks for optimum lossless file quality. I also have converted regular CD's to FLAC using PC software.

Overall the HK system is mediocre at best for sound quality but you can tell a difference. Hope that helps.

FYI Slickdeals.com has a sale on some FLAC players currently

[Kristalov]

Yep. You sure can

[selmeralto]

Thanks, Kristalov.

Another question. I know there are several very good portable units out there in addition to the FiiO X3, including the FiiO X5 and the more expensive Astell & Kern AK Jr. Does anyone have any experience comparing these units? Or others that should be considered?

Also, even if (say) the A&K is better, is that difference something a listener would hear, given that the signal is being fed into the mediocre HK system?

I ask this on the assumption that, at least for now, I'd be sticking with the stock HK system.

[Kristalov]

In my experience the flac files are really only as good as the system you are playing them through. There are numerous players on the market with varying price ranges but ideally the speakers or headphones you use and how you "tweak" the players settings really make the difference. I have noticed a difference in flac vs mp3 on playback but by no means are the HK speakers in my M235i perfect. I typically listening to flac files on a great pair of headphones (at home).

[6MT4me]

Hey, I have a much better suggestion, as I have the hk system, and have been using flash drives in several generations of BMWs. Download a ripping program called "EAC" (exact audio copy). You will be making wav files that are more stable than flac files and actually sound better. Use a 32 or 64 gig flash drive to then store your files. You can setup music playlists or leave them as their original albums. Your system will be able to play them either way! The flash drives work great and sound surprisingly good. Lots cheaper than previously mentioned players. The only downside maybe loss of some metadata and album covers. But if sound is what matters...you will be a happy camper. This works great also with audiophile quality files(24/96 and 24/192), and even sounds better
Works great with our BMWs and not in Audi's or Mercedes

[selmeralto]

Thanks very much, GMT4me.

I've got a question. I've started using EAC and - at least on my computer and on my Samsung S5 - the FLAC files sound much better than MP3 files. Much more definition. So I guess the first question is whether people think the FLAC files sound better than WAV files.

But here's another question: can the iDrive/HK system read FLAC files on a flash drive? Or must I use an outboard FLAC-enabled unit?

Originally Posted by 6MT4me

Hey, I have a much better suggestion, as I have the hk system, and have been using flash drives in several generations of BMWs. Download a ripping program called "EAC" (exact audio copy). You will be making wav files that are more stable than flac files and actually sound better. Use a 32 or 64 gig flash drive to then store your files. You can setup music playlists or leave them as their original albums. Your system will be able to play them either way! The flash drives work great and sound surprisingly good. Lots cheaper than previously mentioned players. The only downside maybe loss of some metadata and album covers. But if sound is what matters...you will be a happy camper. This works great also with audiophile quality files(24/96 and 24/192), and even sounds better
Works great with our BMWs and not in Audi's or Mercedes

[selmeralto]

And a follow-up: what did you mean when you said WAV files were more stable than FLAC files?

[6MT4me]

Wav files are bit to bit, flac files have to go through a process that can affect them, and are known over time to degrade. They do save metadata, however and are more compact..take up less space on a drive. They will not play on a flash drive, either. More to the point, wav files are unchanged through a good ripping program and so are more faithful to the original source. Flash drives are cheap and very stable. I have one that is 6 years old and the music does not degrade, and they do not break! Try one, easy enough for a minimal cost and you will not be disappointed.

[6MT4me]

MP4 files and Flac files are files put thro compression algorithms, they throw away data to make the files smaller and easier to handle for basic player systems If you try to convert them to wav files, the damage has already been done...they are missing music data. They sound one dimensional with loss of some highs and lows. That is why the flac files sound better. But CDs are not usually MP4 files, they are " cd files" and if we'll mastered, sound much better than any compression file type.
There is a new file type developed by Bob Stuart of Meridian Audio that will solve these issues, but for the moment, wav files are the most consistent for sound. But the old rule still applies, "garbage in, garbage out" i.e. MP3 and MP4 files

[6MT4me]

Again, rip a great sounding CD, transfer to a flash drive and play it in your car. Report back to us...

[selmeralto]

I will. Thanks. In the meantime my head is spinning from my web research on the FLAC v. WAV debate. Makes the Philadelphia Eagles v. Dallas Cowboys rivalry seem like pattycakes.

[selmeralto]

I just thought I'd add my own $.02 about listening to FLAC and WAV files, to add to the huge number of people who have discussed this on the web.

I've been comparing FLAC and WAV files for music I've been listening to since I was a kid.

There's no doubt that the files sound different. For example on a Mel Tormé recording ("The London Sessions") I can hear him taking in breaths quite distinctly. That's just not there in the WAV file. Similarly on a 1960 George Shearing recording, I can hear analog tape hiss through the FLAC file that's only barely hearable on the WAV file. On the other hand, the sound of the mallets hitting the vibraphone is much cleaner and the tone of the vibes just shimmers on the FLAC file in a way that I don't hear on the WAV file.

Is one preferable to the other? Well, that's a complicated question. Personally, I'd rather have the added detail even if that means getting the detail of the tape hiss. Others will have different preferences.

This of course doesn't bear on the question of whether the HK system will even register these differences. I'll let you know when I have a chance to test it out in the car.

I've been doing my testing on my home computer with planar speakers and with headphones.

My understanding - correct me if I'm wrong - is that the HK won't read the FLAC files directly from a flash drive. So the only way to run the test would be to use a FLAC-capable unit as an external drive connected to the HK.

This means having to buy an outboard unit. I guess science requires this sacrifice on my part.

[TiM235i]

The HK system can indeed read FLAC files directly from a flash drive. And in my opinion, there is a difference in the sound that can be heard over MP3. I think it is easy to hear if the car is stationary and no road noise is getting in the way. Once in motion, the differences can still be heard, but it is not nearly as obvious.

Like others have mentioned, I use EAC to rip files directly from CDs as FLAC files. I then copy them to a 32 GB flash drive. I probably have 10-12 albums so far, so I have not nearly filled up the flash drive.

[selmeralto]

Thanks, TiM235i. That's really helpful, even if you've taken away my excuse for buying the external unit.

Originally Posted by TiM235i

The HK system can indeed read FLAC files directly from a flash drive. And in my opinion, there is a difference in the sound that can be heard over MP3. I think it is easy to hear if the car is stationary and no road noise is getting in the way. Once in motion, the differences can still be heard, but it is not nearly as obvious.

Like others have mentioned, I use EAC to rip files directly from CDs as FLAC files. I then copy them to a 32 GB flash drive. I probably have 10-12 albums so far, so I have not nearly filled up the flash drive.

[TiM235i]

Well, you may still need to buy the external FLAC player to get equalization!

[selmeralto]

Originally Posted by TiM235i

Well, you may still need to buy the external FLAC player to get equalization!

[eclipes]

is it worth having an external flac player vs. flac converted down to MP3 on USB?

the sound is OK with usb with best possible rip so not sure how much more i will get with an external flac player. Now i really miss the old days with flac player +portable amp with IEMs

Originally Posted by Kristalov

I use an external FLAC player (small FiiO X3) and use HDTracks for optimum lossless file quality. I also have converted regular CD's to FLAC using PC software.

Overall the HK system is mediocre at best for sound quality but you can tell a difference. Hope that helps.

FYI Slickdeals.com has a sale on some FLAC players currently

[Redbeemer]

Originally Posted by selmeralto

I have a large collection of CDs, a portion of which I'd like to make available for my HK system in a 2016 M235i. What is the best way to do this that would result in the highest possible audio quality?

I'm assuming that the key is to create FLAC lossless files. Yes?

And if so, what device would be best for the highest quality? An external player connected by USB?

Any recommendations on how to do this and what equipment to use would be appreciated.

Flat sound a priority.



Thanks.

As to the debate over which sounds better, FLAC or WAV, that has been a sometimes heated issue in audio circles for many years. The facts are that both are lossless files in that you get back the original bits from either one. Yes, a FLAC file can be compared to the original after it is decoded and it is bit for bit the same. As for FLAC files being unstable, I have a large CD collection ripped exclusively to FLAC and have had them for many years with no degradation of sound quality. The two things about FLAC files that cannot be disputed is that the take up significantly less space than WAV files which is usually an important consideration in a portable environment (the Fiio players only have the capacity for one micro SD card and the largest size readily available is 128 Gb. I doubt you can fit all your CD collection in that space, especially if they are in WAV format. Finally, FLAC files can carry the metadata which includes the song title, artist, album art, etc. whereas the WAV files cannot do this. I like being able to see this info, especially since the BMW's have a nice colorful screen on the newer models. You can decide with your own ears as to which format sounds better to you, but all I can tell you is that I have written audio reviews professionally and I usually listen to FLAC files, unless I am specifically trying to test a components ability to play WAV or DSF, AIFF, ALAC, etc.

[selmeralto]

Thanks very much, Redbeemer. One follow-up. You say that FLAC and WAV files both return the original bits.

But does this mean they sound the same? It seems to me they sound different. I also discovered that when I substituted some FLAC files for the MP3 files I had, I had to change the EQ settings on the Neutron player I use on my Android phone. In particular, I had to turn down the bass because it was distorting on the FLAC file. I assumed that this was because the FLAC file was producing more of the original bass sound than the previous file.

Thx.

Originally Posted by Redbeemer

As to the debate over which sounds better, FLAC or WAV, that has been a sometimes heated issue in audio circles for many years. The facts are that both are lossless files in that you get back the original bits from either one. Yes, a FLAC file can be compared to the original after it is decoded and it is bit for bit the same. As for FLAC files being unstable, I have a large CD collection ripped exclusively to FLAC and have had them for many years with no degradation of sound quality. The two things about FLAC files that cannot be disputed is that the take up significantly less space than WAV files which is usually an important consideration in a portable environment (the Fiio players only have the capacity for one micro SD card and the largest size readily available is 128 Gb. I doubt you can fit all your CD collection in that space, especially if they are in WAV format. Finally, FLAC files can carry the metadata which includes the song title, artist, album art, etc. whereas the WAV files cannot do this. I like being able to see this info, especially since the BMW's have a nice colorful screen on the newer models. You can decide with your own ears as to which format sounds better to you, but all I can tell you is that I have written audio reviews professionally and I usually listen to FLAC files, unless I am specifically trying to test a components ability to play WAV or DSF, AIFF, ALAC, etc.

[Redbeemer]

Since they are playing the same bits, they should sound the same. As I stated, there is some controversy among audiophiles about this. Of course, mp3 files are lossy, so much of the actual music (bits) are being discarded, depending upon the bit rate. So, yes, the loss of part of the music may account for the decreased bass you noted. We really don't know which parts of the music are being discarded by the mp3 algorithm. That being said, many people find it hard to distinguish between very high bit rate mp3 files and lossless files of the same song. The algorithm's available to compress mp3 files have improved since they first came out and, since storage is so much cheaper than it used to be, most mp3's are encoded at higher bit rates nowadays. The first downloads were at 128 kbps and then everyone went to 256 kbps. Now services like Spotify and Google Play stream at 320 kbps which can sound quite good, especially in a car or other noisy environment.