[MPBK]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

The OEM process doesn't work this way. The original design did not have the strips....
The lack of benefit by some later model owners may just be evidence of BMW having found a more cost-effective solution to road noise.

How do you know that?
Isn't it possible that the original design included weather strips on all doors based on past history with prior models? The 2-series is based on the 1-series, correct?

I was responding to a owner of a M2 Competition. That's the latest released model in the pipeline, right? It would certainly have included the more cost-effective solution to road noise that you're talking about. Yet, he says that adding strips back does reduce noise further.
To which I say: placebo effect (as he presented no solid evidence) since another poster presented measure dB levels that prove no difference is achieved.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by MPBK

How do you know that?
Isn't it possible that the original design included weather strips on all doors based on past history with prior models? The 2-series is based on the 1-series, correct?

I was responding to a owner of a M2 Competition. That's the latest released model in the pipeline, right? It would certainly have included the more cost-effective solution to road noise that you're talking about. Yet, he says that adding strips back does reduce noise further.
To which I say: placebo effect (as he presented no solid evidence) since another poster presented measure dB levels that prove no difference is achieved.

The 2 Series was based on the prior generation 3 Series platform and the 1 Series rwd hatch is a shared platform/unique top hat.
The 2014 model launched without the strips.
At some subsequent point, they were added in production and released as a OE replacement part.
At some further subsequent point, reports are the part has been discontinued. I addressed some possible reasons for that above. What must be realized is that the part would not have been released without a rigorous process which convinced BMW of the need, even as they may have working on a more effective long-term solution.

We also don't know that what was perceived was not a function of decibel but of frequency/resonance which was displeasing to the NVH engineers. It is also possible that the dB tested vehicle here also had whatever later countermeasures were adopted. Regarding the M2C, whatever newest NVH countermeasures have been added to the program to reach the original objective for 230 and 240, M2 may have different NVH objectives based on the projected buyer. However, even if it had the same treatment, it would seem reasonable that adding the strips on top may have more sound reduction. The team may have concluded that this became what we called "belt and suspenders" engineering, suggesting it was overkill for the need and and excessive, thus no OE strips. Keep in mind, engineers never consider the proverbial glass half full nor half empty. They simply point out the glass was twice the size it needed to be.

I do know, fully aware of how the placebo effect operates on the human psyche, that I heard a decrease in sound from tires, just as I know that when I turn down the TV volume, I hear a decrease in sound. It was that evident to me. I have a bit more confidence in my assessment versus the general population, as this was part of what I used to do at the Proving Grounds when evaluating new program prototypes as the Product Planner. Our measurement scale including noting NVH issues which may be heard by the general public ranging to observed by only the most astute listener and we categorized what we heard. I noticed the road/tire noise in my 2015 model at delivery, willing to put up with that for loving the car, but immediately installed the strips upon learning about them, to my personal benefit.

[AlpsRider]

Originally Posted by MPBK

Nobody is denying what you're hearing (or not). What you're experiencing is the very definition of placebo effect.
I refer you to my previous post.
https://www.2addicts.com/forums/show...&postcount=197

Ok, you can use debate tactics all day long. People with common sense will understand. Bye.

[MPBK]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

...Keep in mind, engineers never consider the proverbial glass half full nor half empty. They simply point out the glass was twice the size it needed to be.

As an engineer myself, I like that one. Cheers.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by MPBK

As an engineer myself, I like that one. Cheers.

This is the internet, everyone is an engineer.

I also moonlight as a porn star and a pastor. Not necessarily in that order.

I guess BMW had nothing better to do than to add to the strip to the then 2014 228i and then later again on a new 2019 M240i, when the noisy timing chain moved to the back of the motor because they had extra strips and nothing better to do than mess with you.

Why would any manufacture do something so asinine as add insulation to insulate noise when according to you, they serve no purpose and is all in our head.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by Poochie

I also moonlight as a porn star and a pastor. Not necessarily in that order.

POTUS and VPOTUS calling for Poochie on lines 1 and 2!

[evilstib]

Has anyone installed these on a 2019 M2 competition?

Found em on ecs tuning but they say it does not fit.

[AlpsRider]

Originally Posted by evilstib

Has anyone installed these on a 2019 M2 competition?

Found em on ecs tuning but they say it does not fit.

The door jams on the M2 are the same as the M235i. I've installed these seals on my M2 Competition, they fit perfectly.

[evilstib]

Thank you. Road noise on the car really gets to me ;(

[MPBK]

Originally Posted by Poochie

This is the internet, everyone is an engineer.

I also moonlight as a porn star and a pastor. Not necessarily in that order.

I guess BMW had nothing better to do than to add to the strip to the then 2014 228i and then later again on a new 2019 M240i, when the noisy timing chain moved to the back of the motor because they had extra strips and nothing better to do than mess with you.

Why would any manufacture do something so asinine as add insulation to insulate noise when according to you, they serve no purpose and is all in our head.

What you posted above is only half the story. The other half is... why BMW chose not to include that piece in subsequent production runs? Explain that.

Not according to me. According to the people who actually installed such "noise insulating" piece, and posted here that they could NOT tell the difference.
Sure, there are a few who posted that they noticed a difference.
So, the difference, if it exists at all, must be really small since some noticed and some didn't. If you noticed it, good for you. After all, that's all that matters, what your brain tells you, not what an instrument can measure.
Isn't that the definition of a placebo effect? It is, in your head, after all.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by MPBK

What you posted above is only half the story. The other half is... why BMW chose not to include that piece in subsequent production runs? Explain that.

Not according to me. According to the people who actually installed such "noise insulating" piece, and posted here that they could NOT tell the difference.
Sure, there are a few who posted that they noticed a difference.
So, the difference must be really small, since some noticed and some didn't. Isn't that the definition of a placebo effect? It is, in your head, after all.

Well, based on my experience, I've found several vehicles with the weather stripping but only in diesel and 4 cylinder motors, for the same exact MY year and dealership.

BMW is a company that loves to save a buck, so if didn't serve or purpose was just there for style, they would surely just eliminated it, like they did in the M2/235/240i ect.

If you don't want to spend $15 on the weather striping, fine, more power to you. But don't say it doesn't serve a purpose or it's all our head unless you have something to back it up with.

The M2 and M2C already had almost all the noise insulation already eliminated, so I don't expect restoring just this piece to make much of a difference but on some vehicle's like the M240i that's already heavily insulated, I assume this does reduce tire/road noise to a discernible level.

[MPBK]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Well, based on my experience, I've found several vehicles with the weather stripping but only in diesel and 4 cylinder motors, for the same exact MY year and dealership.

BMW is a company that loves to save a buck, so if didn't serve or purpose was just there for style, they would surely just eliminated it, like they did in the M2/235/240i ect.

If you don't want to spend $15 on the weather striping, fine, more power to you. But don't say it doesn't serve a purpose or it's all our head unless you have something to back it up with.

The M2 and M2C already had almost all the noise insulation already eliminated, so I don't expect restoring just this piece to make much of a difference but on some vehicle's like the M240i that's already heavily insulated, I assume this does reduce tire/road noise to a discernible level.

Seems to me you are saying it yourself. lol

[morphomeman]

We have a 4-cylinder and a 6-cylinder BMW of about equal age. The 4 has the classic 4-cylinder clackety-clack sound, especially under heavy throttle, which is absent in the 6. I suspect that this particular insulation is meant to dampen that particular frequency. No need for this dampening on the 6. One of the reasons for spending the extra bucks is to hear the velvety sound under acceleration that you get only in a BMW straight 6. Why try to make that sound go away?
As for saving money, ALL CAR COMPANIES do that. Otherwise, they would go out of business. The trick is to save it wisely without reducing the allure of the product.
I hope that we all strive for that in our lives.

[evilstib]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Well, based on my experience, I've found several vehicles with the weather stripping but only in diesel and 4 cylinder motors, for the same exact MY year and dealership.

BMW is a company that loves to save a buck, so if didn't serve or purpose was just there for style, they would surely just eliminated it, like they did in the M2/235/240i ect.

If you don't want to spend $15 on the weather striping, fine, more power to you. But don't say it doesn't serve a purpose or it's all our head unless you have something to back it up with.

The M2 and M2C already had almost all the noise insulation already eliminated, so I don't expect restoring just this piece to make much of a difference but on some vehicle's like the M240i that's already heavily insulated, I assume this does reduce tire/road noise to a discernible level.

I have a 2019 M2 comp. I just installed:
- Sealing side panel, left: 51487300693
- Sealing side panel right: 51487300694

I find the difference is very noticeable. Has only been ~20km, but very impressed with the road noise reduction in the cabin.

Very impressed with my $78 (cad) purchase.

[BeautyInMotionF22]

I purchased a set of these only to find out my 17 M240i already has them. So if anybody needs a set in the DMV or i can mail them i guess lemme know.

[John in VA]

Originally Posted by BeautyInMotionF22

I purchased a set of these only to find out my 17 M240i already has them. So if anybody needs a set in the DMV or i can mail them i guess lemme know.

Thanks to BeautyInMotionF22 for arranging to meet me to hand off the weather strips. Looking fwd to installing them!

[GarageMadness]

Originally Posted by evilstib

I have a 2019 M2 comp. I just installed:
- Sealing side panel, left: 51487300693
- Sealing side panel right: 51487300694

I find the difference is very noticeable. Has only been ~20km, but very impressed with the road noise reduction in the cabin.

Very impressed with my $78 (cad) purchase.

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

The door jams on the M2 are the same as the M235i. I've installed these seals on my M2 Competition, they fit perfectly.

Can either of you give me some installation tips. I can't get the bottom to line up.

[AlpsRider]

Originally Posted by GarageMadness

Can either of you give me some installation tips. I can't get the bottom to line up.

It's been awhile since I installed mine. Check the photos, make sure that they are not upside down.

[GarageMadness]

Originally Posted by AlpsRider

It's been awhile since I installed mine. Check the photos, make sure that they are not upside down.

I did. Unfortunately. The pics aren't helpful as it come to that bottom section. No worries. I will figure it out. Thanks.

[quenotte]

Originally Posted by MPBK

What you posted above is only half the story. The other half is... why BMW chose not to include that piece in subsequent production runs? Explain that.

Not according to me. According to the people who actually installed such "noise insulating" piece, and posted here that they could NOT tell the difference.
Sure, there are a few who posted that they noticed a difference.
So, the difference, if it exists at all, must be really small since some noticed and some didn't. If you noticed it, good for you. After all, that's all that matters, what your brain tells you, not what an instrument can measure.
Isn't that the definition of a placebo effect? It is, in your head, after all.

Just installed them on my M2C after installing them on my M235i 5 years ago.

Basically your postulate is false.

Point is : Why do they remove them on M235i/M2/M4 ?

They are present in all other models (316d to 335i since F30 start for example, even M3 has them).

So, why do they remove them on M235i/M2/M4??

Not for motor cooling since M3 F80 has them.

And, why BMW remove lots of insulation from M2, even on M2C, the last "revision" of the model?

- Hood sound insulation
- Dashboard sound insulation
- Rear panels aluminium holes
- Trunk sound insulation
- ...

It's just because BMW decided to make them more noisy because they are considered to be the "sportier/raw" models.

Just some product definition. And maybe cost saving also...

Installing weather strips to an OG M2 may not be very noticiable because they are very noisy. Noise floor is high.

It will be more noticiable on M2C since it's less noisy.

And even more noticiable if you install sound insulation parts (rear panels, trunk,...)

[vrooooom]

part ending 3 for the LEFT; 4 for the RIGHT. Thicker part is bottom (photo shown).

Start from the top. it has a notch for where the front panel's screw is. align those 2. Work from the top going down. just keep pushing your fingers "forward direction" into the cavity. the bottom will just get there by itself. .

I would suggest wetting the part and area w/ soapy water = easier to push the foam into position. It's less effort to push into position than dry.

Less than 10 mins to get both installed. More room when the doors are only slightly open.

[M2RAW]

Originally Posted by evilstib

I have a 2019 M2 comp. I just installed:
- Sealing side panel, left: 51487300693
- Sealing side panel right: 51487300694

I find the difference is very noticeable. Has only been ~20km, but very impressed with the road noise reduction in the cabin.

Very impressed with my $78 (cad) purchase.

Is this the same part numbers for OG m2?