[jmwilson125]

I am actually planning on filling up with denatured alcohol this time around to experiment.

[KAY-OS]

Just ordered the BMS WMI kit, 2 gallon, dual CM5 nozzles. A couple of questions before the install:

1) From the installation instructions, it says you will need teflon paste and thread sealant. Any recommended brand of teflon paste?

(Edit: I decided to use Permatex high performance thread sealant. This one seems to be the one used often in automotive application.)

2) BMS support says I can prime the system without unplugging the nozzles. I'll have to rev the engine (to about 3000rpm) at the same time as pressing the prime button. Is this how you guys prime your system? Any issues? I hope this works because unplugging the nozzles is a PITA since the plug in the ER charge pipe is facing downwards and is quite low.

3) How often do you guys clean the methanol filter?

4) What is your boost level like on Map 3 (stock turbo, BEF, pump gas)?

5) I plan to use 50/50 water meth. It's difficult to get boost juice outside USA, so I plan to mix my own. You guys mix by volume or by weight? I have read mixing by volume is not accurate and will result in more water than meth. According to here (https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...=592217&page=2) for 1 Gallon of 50/50 mix :
water 0.44 gallon to methanol 0.56 gallon
or water 55 oz to methanol 73 oz.
Anyone using this method for 50/50 mix?

(Edit: I've asked Snow Performance, AEM, and BMS and they all said mixing 50/50 by volume is fine. It's easier to mix and performance wise isn't such a big difference. I think I'm just gonna mix by volume. How about you guys?)

Also, if I purchase methanol, it is colourless. Does this make checking for bubbles in the line extremely hard or is still doable?

Thanks!

[M235SDCA]

Kay - my experience / opinions below. There are a lot of different variations possible, so others will will have different experiences.

Originally Posted by KAY-OS

Just ordered the BMS WMI kit, 2 gallon, dual CM5 nozzles. A couple of questions before the install:

1) From the installation instructions, it says you will need teflon paste and thread sealant. Are these 2 the same? Any recommended brand of teflon paste?

I used a pretty generic teflon sealant from the hardware store. Given the relatively low pressure in the CP I honestly doubt you really need it for the nozzles. Last time I took the nozzle out and put it back in I didn't bother adding extra sealant.


2) BMS support says I can prime the system without unplugging the nozzles. I'll have to rev the engine at the same time as pressing the prime button. Is this how you guys prime your system? Any issues? I hope this works because unplugging the nozzles is a PITA since the plug in the ER charge pipe is facing downwards and is quite low.

Agree I have the ER CP and getting the nozzle out takes a bit of time. I have primed the system without the engine running. Boost Juice is red, and I primed until I saw the fluid in the line up to the solenoid. The priming cycle on the JB4 is just a few seconds. It also doesn't take too many to fill the system, maybe 3 or so IIRC. What you would NOT want to do is keep priming and dump a bunch of fluid in the CP without the engine running. Bad.

3) How often do you guys clean the methanol filter?

Had the system 6 months and haven't done it yet. In retrospect I should have gotten the Devlis Own tank connection with the filter / screen in the tank.

4) What is your boost level like on Map 3 (stock turbo, BEF, pump gas)?

OK, I am running BM3 with the Stage 2 91 octane OTS BEF stock turbo. Map 3 works bad with that BEF. This past week I ran on a Dynojet and saw no additional peak HP with map 3. Right now I am running map 6 with 18 PSI about 3k-5.5k. My max torque was 450 ft-lbs, but peak HP was only 360. Having some boost control problems up high which seemed to be limiting my HP. Something I need to look into - probably with a different BEF.

5) I plan to use 50/50 water meth. It's difficult to get boost juice outside USA, so I plan to mix my own. You guys mix by volume or by weight? I have read mixing by volume is not accurate and will result in more water than meth. According to here (https://www.e90post.com/forums/showt...=592217&page=2) for 1 Gallon of 50/50 mix :
water 0.44 gallon to methanol 0.56 gallon
or water 55 oz to methanol 73 oz.
Anyone using this method for 50/50 mix?

Have only run Boost Juice, so sorry no help here.

Also, if I purchase methanol, it is colourless. Does this make checking for bubbles in the line extremely hard or is still doable?

In my system I haven't ever noticed any bubbles. If all the lines are connected good you really shouldn't get any.

Thanks!

[KAY-OS]

Originally Posted by M235SDCA

Kay - my experience / opinions below. There are a lot of different variations possible, so others will will have different experiences.

Hi there. Thanks for your input. I've decided to use Permatex high performance thread sealant. Anyone used this?

And I think I'll just mix 50/50 by volume. I've sent emails to Snow performance, AEM and BMS and they all said mixing by volume is more convenient and performance wise pretty much the same as mixing by weight. I have edited my previous post to include this info.

[Dylan86]

When are you guys having the WM kick in? I'm finding lately in this blistering hot weather that on a full launch/wot run starting at 3.0-3.5psi works great, super smooth delivery. I used to run 6-7psi to start, and you could feel it hit a bit harder (less linear than the lower setting). I feel like the car is smoother, but slower, maybe a placebo?

Curious what other have theirs set at. I'm running the single CM10 into the charge pipe..

Boost additive currently 20 (been running Shell 91) Was running 35-40 when I was using ethanol free 94, maybe this is the reason? lol

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

When are you guys having the WM kick in? I'm finding lately in this blistering hot weather that on a full launch/wot run starting at 3.0-3.5psi works great, super smooth delivery. I used to run 6-7psi to start, and you could feel it hit a bit harder (less linear than the lower setting). I feel like the car is smoother, but slower, maybe a placebo?

Curious what other have theirs set at. I'm running the single CM10 into the charge pipe..

Boost additive currently 20 (been running Shell 91) Was running 35-40 when I was using ethanol free 94, maybe this is the reason? lol

Damn only 20?

I have set mine as low as 6 and as high as 9.5 on the track to conserve methanol with my small 1 gallon tank.

Even when I went down to 6 I didn't notice any big or issue. Maybe I'll try it out a little bit lower this weekend.

I run a cm5 + cm7 in mine and I have been running additive from 70-100 depending one the fuel. Either 93 or 93+e35.

Recently I switched to a 3.5 bar tmap sensor. For some reason the car feels more powerful although that must be a placebo. I think I have the additive set to 50 now. (Basically 100 on the previous sensor). I have been hitting 20-22 psi with that setup. Timing looks pretty good too.

[M235SDCA]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

When are you guys having the WM kick in? I'm finding lately in this blistering hot weather that on a full launch/wot run starting at 3.0-3.5psi works great, super smooth delivery. I used to run 6-7psi to start, and you could feel it hit a bit harder (less linear than the lower setting). I feel like the car is smoother, but slower, maybe a placebo?

Curious what other have theirs set at. I'm running the single CM10 into the charge pipe..

Boost additive currently 20 (been running Shell 91) Was running 35-40 when I was using ethanol free 94, maybe this is the reason? lol

I have meth kick on 11 PSI, 2700 RPM min, 3 gear and higher. Using map 6 with 18 PSI max, as my BEF targets 15. Also running a CM10 on the CP. Reason I am running this is I am either driving pretty casually or on the throttle. Low boost settings are easy to hit and I didn't want to be burning through the meth during normal driving.

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by M235SDCA

I have meth kick on 11 PSI, 2700 RPM min, 3 gear and higher. Using map 6 with 18 PSI max, as my BEF targets 15. Also running a CM10 on the CP. Reason I am running this is I am either driving pretty casually or on the throttle. Low boost settings are easy to hit and I didn't want to be burning through the meth during normal driving.

That makes sense. I know with the 1 gallon tank and additive around 70 and flow start around 6.5 psi I would run the tank dry on a 20 minute hpde heat.

When I dropped it to 30-40 additive and bumped start flow psi to 9-10 psi. I would finish the 20 minute session with 20% left in the tank.

The only nice think about a slightly lower starting flow rate is that the cooling kicks in sooner. The jb4 looks for meth flow, cooling, octane before raising boost in it's default saftey setting. (As far as I understand).

If you have it set to min flow 11 psi your temps may be rising and timing just being "ok" when you put your foot down. The jb4 is probably waiting for that flow before it says "ok let's target 18 psi now".

Again I'm not super experienced with how it will work in the real world. Just trying to think about what the jb4 logic is.

I'll also note that I have not seen or felt a huge difference from 100% meth vs 50/50 vs 33/67. 33/67 is straight -20 wiper fluid. I'll run it in a pinch or on the track. It is cheap for track days and provides the cooling that I'm looking for.

Imo the stock power is enough for track use. Other things seem to be the weak link.

[Quicksilver_M235]

Alright, came across this... Is anyone familiar with ProMeth and their direct injection systems?

I searched around on the forum, but found no mention of them (no I do not work for them, and I am not trying to drive customers to their product, just trying to find out if anyone knows of them and can provide feedback).

They have 3 setups... the base, one with a 7th injector using a check valve and one with a 7th injector using a solenoid (link/image below for reference).

https://prometh.com/collections/nozz...nt=44074669966

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Damn only 20?

I have set mine as low as 6 and as high as 9.5 on the track to conserve methanol with my small 1 gallon tank.

Even when I went down to 6 I didn't notice any big or issue. Maybe I'll try it out a little bit lower this weekend.

I run a cm5 + cm7 in mine and I have been running additive from 70-100 depending one the fuel. Either 93 or 93+e35.

Recently I switched to a 3.5 bar tmap sensor. For some reason the car feels more powerful although that must be a placebo. I think I have the additive set to 50 now. (Basically 100 on the previous sensor). I have been hitting 20-22 psi with that setup. Timing looks pretty good too.

Yea I found with the 91oct fuel, the car would make no timing at all, at higher targets. Setting to 20 seems to feel the best, with no timing pull, but still not getting more than 3-5* which is pretty shitty. I did try setting meth start higher even up to 12psi, but it felt more like an extra kick, instead of a linear power increase across the powerband. This is why 3psi seems to work well, for me. I've also noticed most of the Burger guys also run the lower PSI setting. I guess I just have some finicking to do, I haven't spent much time on it, and the temps here are at a peak, so that could also be hindering things, a bit..

Originally Posted by M235SDCA

I have meth kick on 11 PSI, 2700 RPM min, 3 gear and higher. Using map 6 with 18 PSI max, as my BEF targets 15. Also running a CM10 on the CP. Reason I am running this is I am either driving pretty casually or on the throttle. Low boost settings are easy to hit and I didn't want to be burning through the meth during normal driving.

In order to do this, I need to run map 6, yea? Map 3 seems pretty "set and forget" which is why I liked it. Can you actually set those boost targets by gear and RPM? If so that's pretty cool. I am a total newb to the JB4, but you guys have me very interested about Map 6, now...


D

[M235SDCA]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Yea I found with the 91oct fuel, the car would make no timing at all, at higher targets. Setting to 20 seems to feel the best, with no timing pull, but still not getting more than 3-5* which is pretty shitty. I did try setting meth start higher even up to 12psi, but it felt more like an extra kick, instead of a linear power increase across the powerband. This is why 3psi seems to work well, for me. I've also noticed most of the Burger guys also run the lower PSI setting. I guess I just have some finicking to do, I haven't spent much time on it, and the temps here are at a peak, so that could also be hindering things, a bit..



In order to do this, I need to run map 6, yea? Map 3 seems pretty "set and forget" which is why I liked it. Can you actually set those boost targets by gear and RPM? If so that's pretty cool. I am a total newb to the JB4, but you guys have me very interested about Map 6, now...


D

Well have to say I would prefer map 3 because of the built in failsafes, but for some reason it does not want to play nice with my BM3 OTS 91 stage 2. Map 3 probably works really well with the stock tune, but unfortunately when I only had the JB4 I didn't have meth. Then I added BM3, took off the JB4, added the JB4 back to control meth...

Still having some issues at the high end 6500-redline, and when I had it on the dyno it looked like some kind of boost control problem. I'm not overly concerned, since my turbo is stock and it does not provide a lot of boost there anyway. It would be nice to have it running perfect so the car OCD part of me is going to have to keep futzing with it. May end up going with a different tune, but have had mixed results with remote tuners.

Have to say I was reluctant about map 6 but it is just a map where you can set boost targets every 500 RPM. Some of the hassle is looking at logs and adjusting duty bias, meth parameters, etc.

[KAY-OS]

Just installed the BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 50:50 meth mix). Horrible weather in past few days so couldn't get a log. However, I've been thinking about the kit. Does this kit come with an actual flow sensor? Does the meth gauge on the app shows actual flow rate or is it showing how much percentage of voltage the JB4 is sending to the solenoid to tell the solenoid how much to pump?

Is map 3 a kind of a simple boost activated on/off switch? I have set min flow boost at 9.0 psi (default WMI setting according to the install instructions) and other setting at default (boost additive 40, scaling 60). So far, I have seen 100% meth on the gauge when reaching 9.0 psi. So I assume min flow boost setting at 9.0 psi means the JB4 will tell the solenoid and pump for full flow at 9.0 psi. Am I correct? Is a progressive meth flow control better for our engine tuning? Can the JB4 allow progressive meth flow control?

Thanks guys for your help!

[M235SDCA]

Originally Posted by KAY-OS

Just installed the BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 50:50 meth mix). Horrible weather in past few days so couldn't get a log. However, I've been thinking about the kit. Does this kit come with an actual flow sensor? Does the meth gauge on the app shows actual flow rate or is it showing how much percentage of voltage the JB4 is sending to the solenoid to tell the solenoid how much to pump?

Is map 3 a kind of a simple boost activated on/off switch? I have set min flow boost at 9.0 psi (default WMI setting according to the install instructions) and other setting at default (boost additive 40, scaling 60). So far, I have seen 100% meth on the gauge when reaching 9.0 psi. So I assume min flow boost setting at 9.0 psi means the JB4 will tell the solenoid and pump for full flow at 9.0 psi. Am I correct? Is a progressive meth flow control better for our engine tuning? Can the JB4 allow progressive meth flow control?

Thanks guys for your help!

The BMS kit just detects current flowing to the pump, and it is either on or off. When it turns on it goes up to 100% and then when it turns off it slowly tapers off. There is no detection for actual flow, but if the system is empty the motor pulls a lot less current. Not enough current in map 3 and the JB4 will not add boost.

If you have the meth set to turn on at 9, it will switch on at 9 provided all the other parameters enable it as well. You can set the RPM range, gear, etc. for activation. With the N55 EWG BMS has not implemented progressive flow even though the switch is there.

I can't answer the questions on map 3 as I use map 6. Map 3 didn't work very well with my BM3 flash. If you are running the MHD BEF it will likely work much better. From the logs you could see if the JB4 is using a target higher when the meth is flowing and then adjust the additive. Make sure you read the logs, as meth takes a bit of tweaking to get right.

[KAY-OS]

Originally Posted by M235SDCA

The BMS kit just detects current flowing to the pump, and it is either on or off. When it turns on it goes up to 100% and then when it turns off it slowly tapers off. There is no detection for actual flow, but if the system is empty the motor pulls a lot less current. Not enough current in map 3 and the JB4 will not add boost.

If you have the meth set to turn on at 9, it will switch on at 9 provided all the other parameters enable it as well. You can set the RPM range, gear, etc. for activation. With the N55 EWG BMS has not implemented progressive flow even though the switch is there.

I can't answer the questions on map 3 as I use map 6. Map 3 didn't work very well with my BM3 flash. If you are running the MHD BEF it will likely work much better. From the logs you could see if the JB4 is using a target higher when the meth is flowing and then adjust the additive. Make sure you read the logs, as meth takes a bit of tweaking to get right.

Thanks for the reply! BMS also just replied to my query. Just a small correction however. The WMI uses FSB current to determine line pressure, instead of the pump.

There is also confirmation that map 3 is basically spraying off or 100% on. There is an option to allow direct user PWM mapping only for special cases, like large turbo upgrade with large WMI nozzles.

How do you guys feel about the meth kit spraying 0 or 100% on map 3? Good enough for daily driving/ occasional track? Or prefer progressive spray control?

[Dylan86]

I recently stopped using the -45 Blue Washer Fluid to experiment with Methyl-Hydrate/ Distilled Water.

Happy to report that the gains are significant. The car is hauling some serious ass, now. The Washer fluid worked well as an intake "cooler" and slight Octane Booster but didn't like to burn in the lower RPM range as well as the Meth mixture does.

I am now seeing 9-10* of timing advance almost instantly with Meth triggering at around 4-5psi, with a very smooth and linear power delivery. The car is running almost, if not smoother, than when I run Map5, which is great! With the washer fluid mix I feel it was having a hard time burning it fast enough, which would cause a lot of timing pull until the higher RPM's. So it works, but you have to start the delivery much higher (11psi +) to stop any timing retard, and should be used mainly for intake cooling for high temperature months, and not to expect big power gains as you would with running a proper Meth mixture.

Either way, I'm seeing a whole new light, with the Meth tune and power delivery. I plan on a BEF on the DME over winter, and will have it sent out for a proper bench flash when the winter sales begin

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

I recently stopped using the -45 Blue Washer Fluid to experiment with Methyl-Hydrate/ Distilled Water.

Happy to report that the gains are significant. The car is hauling some serious ass, now. The Washer fluid worked well as an intake "cooler" and slight Octane Booster but didn't like to burn in the lower RPM range as well as the Meth mixture does.

I am now seeing 9-10* of timing advance almost instantly with Meth triggering at around 4-5psi, with a very smooth and linear power delivery. The car is running almost, if not smoother, than when I run Map5, which is great! With the washer fluid mix I feel it was having a hard time burning it fast enough, which would cause a lot of timing pull until the higher RPM's. So it works, but you have to start the delivery much higher (11psi +) to stop any timing retard, and should be used mainly for intake cooling for high temperature months, and not to expect big power gains as you would with running a proper Meth mixture.

Either way, I'm seeing a whole new light, with the Meth tune and power delivery. I plan on a BEF on the DME over winter, and will have it sent out for a proper bench flash when the winter sales begin

100% agreed, washer fluid basically is just cooling. It feels much better to me when using 100% meth.

I used mhd to load the jb4 bef. It completely smoothed out my boost, and seems like my avg ign value dropped and the timing increased. Overall running very smoothly in map3.

Also kayos, in the most recent jb4 update you will see flow displayed on your dash with the cruise control. Very cool feature.

[KAY-OS]

Weather cleared up a bit and had a chance to do some logs. Wanted to share my current set up for those who are interested.

Initially I used 50/50 water meth mix with default WMI settings (boost additive 40, scaling 60, min boost flow 9.0psi). Sent a log to Terry and he suggested to increase my meth concentration to increase octane and then increase boost additive.

Thus I now used 70% meth mix, boost additive to 50, scaling 60, min boost flow 9.0 psi. Terry is satisfied with this current set up. I am now hitting max boost of 16.5 to 17.0 psi. Wanted to drive a bit more with this set up but weather is real crap these days. So far so good though, definitely more power.

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Also kayos, in the most recent jb4 update you will see flow displayed on your dash with the cruise control. Very cool feature.

Oh really? how does it work? Just turn on cruise control and flow will be displayed?

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by KAY-OS

Weather cleared up a bit and had a chance to do some logs. Wanted to share my current set up for those who are interested.

Initially I used 50/50 water meth mix with default WMI settings (boost additive 40, scaling 60, min boost flow 9.0psi). Sent a log to Terry and he suggested to increase my meth concentration to increase octane and then increase boost additive.

Thus I now used 70% meth mix, boost additive to 50, scaling 60, min boost flow 9.0 psi. Terry is satisfied with this current set up. I am now hitting max boost of 16.5 to 17.0 psi. Wanted to drive a bit more with this set up but weather is real crap these days. So far so good though, definitely more power.



Oh really? how does it work? Just turn on cruise control and flow will be displayed?

Just run the most up to date firm from bms. I believe it's on revision 15 now. When I floor it the cruise control indicator will rise up to 100 and stay there while meth is spraying.

[KAY-OS]

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Just run the most up to date firm from bms. I believe it's on revision 15 now. When I floor it the cruise control indicator will rise up to 100 and stay there while meth is spraying.

ah ok cool. Thanks for the info!

[designatedposter]

looking for suggestions on where to tap for 12v switched power in the engine bay or near driver / passenger. meth pump can take up to an additional 11amps.

[KAY-OS]

Originally Posted by designatedposter

looking for suggestions on where to tap for 12v switched power in the engine bay or near driver / passenger. meth pump can take up to an additional 11amps.

Another member here kindly sent me this pic for tapping switched power in the fuse box under the hood. I used this fused. No issues.

[designatedposter]

My meth bung is pretty close to the tmap sensor, any concerns of repeatedly wetting this sensor? Additionally I'm using a boost tap that is a spacer on the tmap so that boost line is getting some water too.. Potentially making it to my meth controller.

Any persons run into issues?