M240i steering

BadBadDog · 10-24-2016, 09:54 AM

A similar question to the "m240i vs m240iX performance" thread a few down below.

I am on the verge of pulling the trigger on an m240i with manual transmission and RWD (personal preferences). The one thing holding me back is a concern about the steering "feel" --- the lack of road surface and tire communication.. I understand that electrically assisted power steering is a wave that can't be fought, but coming off of the hydraulic (and excellent) steering of a 2007 335i and (before that) 2002 m3 and (wayyyyyy before that) 1974 2002 , I wonder whether it is a major irritation or whether it is something that I will just get used to.

The obvious answer is to test drive a RWD m240i but here in New Jersey that is impossible; the only m240s at dealers are IXs (with auto trans). I've did drive an IX for an extended period of time and was underwhelmed by the steering feel, though I found it to be relatively quick and accurate.

So I am curious to hear any opinions and experiences of members of this community who have moved from older BMWs with hydraulic steering to a new m240i.

Thanks in advance!

nikijack · 10-24-2016, 10:22 AM

BBD: I drove a standard, RWD 235 last week, and the steering can be adjusted by pushing the Sport button. I noticed how mushy it was, but it firmed up nicely in Sport mode. I didn't try Sport Plus.
Jack

ianp622 · 10-24-2016, 10:32 AM

I've driven a couple of older BMWs before getting my M240i - an E36 M3, and two E46 325xi's with different levels of power steering, and one which I upgraded the suspension with Bilsteins and H&R lowering springs. I certainly enjoy the steering feel of all the upgraded 325xi and the M3 (didn't quite care for the higher power steering E46), but I also enjoy the M240i. With the E46 with suspension upgrade, it can actually feel like quite a lot of work to turn sometimes.

I think it's different, but not worse. You still feel some road vibrations, but it feels smoother - like there's a thin soft fabric between the wheel and the road. I think it fits with the rest of the car better, actually - I never felt like the wheel didn't accurately convey the sportiness or suspension performance I was getting, even when driving around the Nordschleife. I think the "heaviness" some people complain about feels good.

There is an adjustment period, though. You might not like it in the first test drive. But in the end, I think it fits with what the car is - a sporty luxury car. You get sufficient feedback but it still feels like you have comfort. The fact that this came with the electric steering transition that everyone is doing is probably coincidental, but it works.

Maybe I'm not a purist, but I really wouldn't want to drive the E36 M3 every day, and the E46 with suspension upgrades is starting to wear on me because the engine performance no longer matches the suspension performance, so it's a stiffer ride without the power to back it up. The M240i, on the other hand, is a perfect balance - in feel, performance, and aesthetics.

griz31 · 10-24-2016, 10:45 AM

I think you will find the steering only marginally better in the RWD model, but no where near that of the older BMW's. Basically had an extended test drive in an 08 M3 before leasing the m235i - and the steering is just not comparable. I also test drove a '15 m3 and just preferred the feel of the older one. I would say that if it is really important to you, definitely test drive first. The newer models are very beautiful and much more refined, but I think have taken a step back in overall feel. Just depends what is more important to you as you really can't go wrong!

I have found that after the memory of the 08 m3 has faded, the steering feel in the 235 is just fine. This is clearly the direction it's going and I think the suspension will start to impact how much more/less "feel" you have in the steering (I imagine it feels much better in the more aggressive m2). As nikijack said - it tightens up considerably in Sport and Sport+ modes. Odviously, only guessing the m240i would be similar as I have no experience in that car.

pz619 · 10-24-2016, 11:30 AM

Well, I can't speak to a M240i but I can speak extensively on a M235i. The steering feel isn't that great. I would say it's almost as good as some 80's racing games I played at the arcade as a kid. It feels a little light to me but more importantly you just don't get any real feeling out of it. I'm never really sure what the front tires are doing. The steering rack is precise but it sort of lacks emotion.

I recently drove a e46 M3 ZCP and that had awesome steering feel. I don't know if we'll ever get back there but the steering feel to me on the M235i is biggest letdown to an otherwise awesome car.

Viffermike · 10-24-2016, 01:47 PM

Understand that electric steering, by its nature and operation, will not approach the same feel of hydraulic in any equivalent application -- just as hydraulic will not approach the same feel of an unassisted, completely mechanical rack in any equivalent application.

This is the even the case with the electric steering used in recent Porsches, which by most regards has had the best overall 'feel' for many, many years -- and still does, even in electric. (But the P-car purists are all bitching about it, too, or course ... )

Your concern and comparison, OP, has been beaten to a pulp by not just previous posters, but by mainstream car mags. Can BMW make it 'feel' better? Probably, but likely at the expense of other design goals of the steering system ...

... and, as electric racks go, it's really not that bad. A tip: play around with the tire pressures when/if you get your car. Bite, turn-in, and overall feel do change perceptively with pressure changes. For instance, a buddy of mine with a 228i M Sport w/ZHP who runs an E30 as a track car claims that raising the fronts to 37 or so from the stock 32 does wonders for initial bite. I've verified that with my car, and now run my pressures at 36/36 F/R.

Basically, you're hoping for apples from an orange grove. Electric racks are a design necessity for most larger car manufacturers now. We all need to learn to get used to how they 'feel'.

Dylan86 · 10-24-2016, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by griz31

I think you will find the steering only marginally better in the RWD model, but no where near that of the older BMW's. Basically had an extended test drive in an 08 M3 before leasing the m235i - and the steering is just not comparable. I also test drove a '15 m3 and just preferred the feel of the older one. I would say that if it is really important to you, definitely test drive first. The newer models are very beautiful and much more refined, but I think have taken a step back in overall feel. Just depends what is more important to you as you really can't go wrong!

I have found that after the memory of the 08 m3 has faded, the steering feel in the 235 is just fine. This is clearly the direction it's going and I think the suspension will start to impact how much more/less "feel" you have in the steering (I imagine it feels much better in the more aggressive m2). As nikijack said - it tightens up considerably in Sport and Sport+ modes. Odviously, only guessing the m240i would be similar as I have no experience in that car.

Agreed.

Gotta remember, people want less NVH, and adaptive steering racks like the other "super duper" cars out there, so that's what we got. It's different for sure, but to say it's "disconnected" as I've seen over and over is a bit of a joke. A hydro rack does the same thing as an electro rack, only electro does it better, and with no dead spot at center. The difference in feel also comes with the newer F series chassis and soft shitty engine mounts that we get form the factory. The mounts in this car are very sloppy, it's pretty sad. I'm currently looking into some M2 mounts, to see if they're in fact stiffer, or different in overall design.

If you want more "feel" out of your F22, install some higher durometer engine/trans mounts in the car (if/when avail), and a set of M4 LCA's and you'll get your "feel" back. Remember, they made these cars for the 90% crowd who want luxurious ride quality (less NVH) and soft/smooth like driving characteristics, with the "option" to have Sport mode/feel/sound (mitigated by electronics yet again lol). We the other 10% wish it was more "raw", but this is easy to change IMO, if one so chooses to.

Viffermike · 10-24-2016, 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Remember, they made these cars for the 90% crowd who want luxurious ride quality (less NVH) and soft/smooth like driving characteristics, with the "option" to have Sport mode/feel/sound (mitigated by electronics yet again lol). We the other 10% wish it was more "raw", but this is easy to change IMO, if one so chooses to.

This is precisely what I mean by this line in my post above: "Probably, but likely at the expense of other design goals of the steering system ... ".

Like it or not, 'raw' doesn't sell -- even to many performance enthusiasts now. That rawness must now be mitigated with a blanket of comfort and refinement, hence the soft engine mounts, springs, etc. that Dylan86 mentions above.

Even on a car on which directness was an asset -- the first-gen MINI Cooper -- enthusiasts felt compelled to modify soft motor mounts, progressive-rate springs, etc. to create even more directness. On my '06, for instance, I had an engine dampener installed to stiffen the engine-to-chassis connection -- something key to improving throttle response because the engine mounts were so soft, initial throttle inputs were partially lost through crank inertia into the soft mounts.

While I wanted that more direct connection, the vast, vast majority of MINI Cooper owners didn't. And there you have it.

unseen orko · 10-24-2016, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadBadDog

A similar question to the "m240i vs m240iX performance" thread a few down below.

I am on the verge of pulling the trigger on an m240i with manual transmission and RWD (personal preferences). The one thing holding me back is a concern about the steering "feel" --- the lack of road surface and tire communication.. I understand that electrically assisted power steering is a wave that can't be fought, but coming off of the hydraulic (and excellent) steering of a 2007 335i and (before that) 2002 m3 and (wayyyyyy before that) 1974 2002 , I wonder whether it is a major irritation or whether it is something that I will just get used to.

The obvious answer is to test drive a RWD m240i but here in New Jersey that is impossible; the only m240s at dealers are IXs (with auto trans). I've did drive an IX for an extended period of time and was underwhelmed by the steering feel, though I found it to be relatively quick and accurate.

So I am curious to hear any opinions and experiences of members of this community who have moved from older BMWs with hydraulic steering to a new m240i.

Thanks in advance!

I drove an E90 330i from 2006 to 2014. Loved that car. I regret selling it everyday. I test drove these new Fxx 335i in 2014 and I was disappointed. I am sure you have read all about how numb that early steering was compared to the hydraulic. I ended up buying an Audi because it's numb and luxurious

I waited for 2yrs. That BMW itch- I just could not get over it. So, I decided to give it another shot. Test drove a 2015 M3 and then the 340i. M3 was handful. great car, steering was good but wasn't playful. 340i, huge improvement. much better and sporty feeling than the early 335i. But I just didn't love it. Someone suggested I should try the M235i. 1 test drive is all that it took for me to order an M240i. There you have it.

To me, the M240i had that feel. It's not the E90 feeling per se but it did have the balance and the feel that you need for a sporty feeling...i enjoy driving fast and this steering gives you that confidence.

The one advice I would give you is -- Make sure you get the PSS tires (if you are custom ordering, it's easy to select that box). I hate to admit but I think the PSS + EPS in M235/240 is as good or better overall feeling than my old E90. I hated the run flats in my old car. The EPS in M2xx is more playful but not as direct as Hydraulic. It is equally precise.

Here is how I would describe in one sentence. My E90 felt like i was on rails when i took a fast turn driving on the freeways as the road curves at 70mph.

The M235 feels like i am on rails that are not made of iron but something slightly softer..almost like some soft layer is between your car and the rails..

Aaron240 · 10-25-2016, 12:00 AM

I've had my M240i for a couple of weeks now and I am happy with it. Over the weekend I took it for a drive through the canyons on a local bmw cruise, and I am happy with the steering and handling overall.

In comfort mode, the steering is light, which makes parking and turning at very low speeds really easy.

In Sport/Sport+, the steering tightens up significantly, and it feels very solid when turning at speed.

I know you said you can't test drive one locally, but maybe there is a RWD one somewhere a short road trip away? It might be worth taking a weekend trip and fitting in a test drive to help you make up your mind about purchasing a $50k+ car.

rainfall · 10-25-2016, 12:18 AM

I've had hydraulic steering before and test drove the M235i (I guess the steering didn't change much?).

Like others said, if you switch to sport mode, you will have a little more WEIGHT to the steering.
But if you are looking for FEEDBACK, then I don't think you'll get it with a modern BMW.

I remember driving cars with hydraulic steering and cars with no steering assist at all. In either case, not only you feel the weight of the steering, but also you get the feedback from the road when you run over the imperfections of the road.

As a side note: I also test drove a Miata. I think they had something in it, because I think I felt some FEEDBACK. If I remember well, MotorTrend said this one has an electric motor just to provide that feedback.

BadBadDog · 10-25-2016, 11:21 AM

Thanks for the many thoughtful responses. I suppose the bottom line is simply “quit complaining and take it like a man”, electric steering is here to stay. The m240i, RWD and manual is now ordered.

I AM intrigued to investigate the many adjustments that you all have kindly suggested: tire pressure, motor mounts, lower control arms, etc to try and find that “sweet spot” of “road feel” plus “feedback”. It sounds like I am at the beginning of an expensive (but interesting) pursuit.

I do have the benefit of being able to compare the m240i, and the changes I make, against my wife's mileage 2003 BMW 330i (E46). While not the final word in steering, it is at least an “8”.

Sportstick · 10-25-2016, 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadBadDog

I AM intrigued to investigate the many adjustments that you all have kindly suggested: ... lower control arms, etc to try and find that “sweet spot” of “road feel” plus “feedback”. It sounds like I am at the beginning of an expensive (but interesting) pursuit.

FYI....with LCAs ordered from Turner and installation by my BMW dealer, the total was just around $1000, including a new alignment, of course.

P.S. Just noticed what you "drive"....how about my 1967 Schwinn Varsity!?!?

XutvJet · 10-25-2016, 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BadBadDog

Thanks for the many thoughtful responses. I suppose the bottom line is simply “quit complaining and take it like a man”, electric steering is here to stay. The m240i, RWD and manual is now ordered.

I AM intrigued to investigate the many adjustments that you all have kindly suggested: tire pressure, motor mounts, lower control arms, etc to try and find that “sweet spot” of “road feel” plus “feedback”. It sounds like I am at the beginning of an expensive (but interesting) pursuit.

The stock front recommended PSI is 33. Up it to 36-38psi. Keep the years at the recommended 38psi. I find the steering feel much better. Also, as the tires wear down, feel will continue to improve.

Dylan86 · 10-25-2016, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XutvJet

The stock front recommended PSI is 33. Up it to 36-38psi. Keep the years at the recommended 38psi. I find the steering feel much better. Also, as the tires wear down, feel will continue to improve.

I run 38psi all around as well, and have had great wear and performance out of the PSS's at this pressure, on this car. The PSS's do have about a 1/32" break in section from what I've found, which takes away a bit from the overall lifespan, but hey....

Cavpilot2k · 10-27-2016, 08:29 AM

I'm sure the EPS is the least expensive option and suits the 90% of drivers, so why bother with something special for the 10% enthusiast crowd, but I always wondered why they wouldn't use an electrically driven hydraulic pump.

Any thoughts? You would have the great steering feel of hydraulics with the increased efficiency of removing the parasitic power drag on the drive train. Best of both worlds, and people like us would stop beating BMW up about their numb steering.

Viffermike · 10-27-2016, 04:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cavpilot2k

I'm sure the EPS is the least expensive option and suits the 90% of drivers, so why bother with something special for the 10% enthusiast crowd, but I always wondered why they wouldn't use an electrically driven hydraulic pump.

Any thoughts? You would have the great steering feel of hydraulics with the increased efficiency of removing the parasitic power drag on the drive train. Best of both worlds, and people like us would stop beating BMW up about their numb steering.

Read this Car and Driver article on hydraulic vs. electric steering from 2012. It's enlightening. A quote from it to answer your question:

<<Manufacturers can’t wait to ditch HPS, and for several reasons beyond the aforementioned 1-mpg fuel-efficiency gain. With no pressurized fluid coursing through rubber hoses under the hood, there’s no chance a leak will erupt, eliminating related service stops and warranty claims. Engineers add that EPS is easier to install during a car’s assembly. It’s also more tolerant of out-of-spec alignment settings and crowned road surfaces; the software that controls the assist motor is programmed to compensate, keeping the car on the beam during straight-ahead cruising. Finally, computer-controlled, motor-driven steering enables features such as lane keeping, cross-wind correction, and auto parking.>>

There are hybrid electro-hydraulic systems; the first-gen Mini Cooper used one, for instance. IIRC, they are used almost exclusively now in heavy-duty applications.

scoale · 10-27-2016, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cavpilot2k

I'm sure the EPS is the least expensive option and suits the 90% of drivers, so why bother with something special for the 10% enthusiast crowd,

Because BMW used to turn drivers into enthusiasts!

midlifecrisis · 10-27-2016, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pz619

Well, I can't speak to a M240i but I can speak extensively on a M235i. The steering feel isn't that great. I would say it's almost as good as some 80's racing games I played at the arcade as a kid. It feels a little light to me but more importantly you just don't get any real feeling out of it. I'm never really sure what the front tires are doing. The steering rack is precise but it sort of lacks emotion.

I recently drove a e46 M3 ZCP and that had awesome steering feel. I don't know if we'll ever get back there but the steering feel to me on the M235i is biggest letdown to an otherwise awesome car.

Funny you mention the E46. I thought the M235 steering was pretty good until I drove a friend's E46 ZHP. That's what steering is supposed to feel like! Most of the newer cars aren't even close. I drove a 340i with the track handling package at Oktoberfest, and that one felt pretty good to me. I'm hoping they keep improving it - and use the E46 ZHP as the reference standard.

Rayscott · 10-27-2016, 06:28 PM

My 228ix feels fine to me. Put me the 90% percentile. If you want to be in the 10% percentile modify it to your liking. It's a great car either way. It is my first BMW moderate performance car and my wife and I like that we can select our preferred driving mode. We feel lucky to be able to afford such an awesome vehicle.

Dylan86 · 10-27-2016, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rayscott

It is my first BMW moderate performance car and my wife and I like that we can select our preferred driving mode. We feel lucky to be able to afford such an awesome vehicle.

That is a great takeaway, sir. The forever changing/growing world of performance vehicles constantly fogs our vision of what a great car "should" be. The 2 series, is a GREAT car.

mikeythedude · 10-29-2016, 03:46 PM

Have owned the M240i w/xDrive for about a week now, I am definitely satisfied with the steering feedback.

Still breaking it in, so haven't had the chance to have some fun with the car yet, but compared to some of the hydraulic power steering vehicles I have owned before, this one is very responsive.

I haven't made any final judgments on being able to "feel the road" as it still feels a little soft for me (even in Sport+), but I really do like the stability. Some of the hydraulic power steering vehicles I've had before usually had anywhere between 3-6 degrees of "give" in the wheel, and that takes some of the fun out of it.

Definitely not sensing much give (if any) in the M240i though

.

10-24-2016, 09:54 AM	#1
BadBadDog New Member 9 Rep 10 Posts Drives: 1972 Schwinn Cavalcade Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Pastoral New Jersey iTrader: (0)	M240i steering A similar question to the "m240i vs m240iX performance" thread a few down below. I am on the verge of pulling the trigger on an m240i with manual transmission and RWD (personal preferences). The one thing holding me back is a concern about the steering "feel" --- the lack of road surface and tire communication.. I understand that electrically assisted power steering is a wave that can't be fought, but coming off of the hydraulic (and excellent) steering of a 2007 335i and (before that) 2002 m3 and (wayyyyyy before that) 1974 2002 , I wonder whether it is a major irritation or whether it is something that I will just get used to. The obvious answer is to test drive a RWD m240i but here in New Jersey that is impossible; the only m240s at dealers are IXs (with auto trans). I've did drive an IX for an extended period of time and was underwhelmed by the steering feel, though I found it to be relatively quick and accurate. So I am curious to hear any opinions and experiences of members of this community who have moved from older BMWs with hydraulic steering to a new m240i. Thanks in advance!
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10-24-2016, 10:22 AM	#2
nikijack Second Lieutenant 37 Rep 246 Posts Drives: 2016 M235i, Grey, manual Join Date: May 2010 Location: Markdale, On, Canada iTrader: (0)	BBD: I drove a standard, RWD 235 last week, and the steering can be adjusted by pushing the Sport button. I noticed how mushy it was, but it firmed up nicely in Sport mode. I didn't try Sport Plus. Jack
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10-24-2016, 10:32 AM	#3
ianp622 Private First Class 52 Rep 117 Posts Drives: 2017 M240i Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: FL iTrader: (0)	I've driven a couple of older BMWs before getting my M240i - an E36 M3, and two E46 325xi's with different levels of power steering, and one which I upgraded the suspension with Bilsteins and H&R lowering springs. I certainly enjoy the steering feel of all the upgraded 325xi and the M3 (didn't quite care for the higher power steering E46), but I also enjoy the M240i. With the E46 with suspension upgrade, it can actually feel like quite a lot of work to turn sometimes. I think it's different, but not worse. You still feel some road vibrations, but it feels smoother - like there's a thin soft fabric between the wheel and the road. I think it fits with the rest of the car better, actually - I never felt like the wheel didn't accurately convey the sportiness or suspension performance I was getting, even when driving around the Nordschleife. I think the "heaviness" some people complain about feels good. There is an adjustment period, though. You might not like it in the first test drive. But in the end, I think it fits with what the car is - a sporty luxury car. You get sufficient feedback but it still feels like you have comfort. The fact that this came with the electric steering transition that everyone is doing is probably coincidental, but it works. Maybe I'm not a purist, but I really wouldn't want to drive the E36 M3 every day, and the E46 with suspension upgrades is starting to wear on me because the engine performance no longer matches the suspension performance, so it's a stiffer ride without the power to back it up. The M240i, on the other hand, is a perfect balance - in feel, performance, and aesthetics.
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10-24-2016, 10:45 AM	#4
griz31 Second Lieutenant 172 Rep 254 Posts Drives: 2020 BMW 330xi Join Date: May 2016 Location: Northern Virginia iTrader: (0)	I think you will find the steering only marginally better in the RWD model, but no where near that of the older BMW's. Basically had an extended test drive in an 08 M3 before leasing the m235i - and the steering is just not comparable. I also test drove a '15 m3 and just preferred the feel of the older one. I would say that if it is really important to you, definitely test drive first. The newer models are very beautiful and much more refined, but I think have taken a step back in overall feel. Just depends what is more important to you as you really can't go wrong! I have found that after the memory of the 08 m3 has faded, the steering feel in the 235 is just fine. This is clearly the direction it's going and I think the suspension will start to impact how much more/less "feel" you have in the steering (I imagine it feels much better in the more aggressive m2). As nikijack said - it tightens up considerably in Sport and Sport+ modes. Odviously, only guessing the m240i would be similar as I have no experience in that car.
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10-24-2016, 11:30 AM	#5
pz619 Brigadier General 3279 Rep 3,256 Posts Drives: F87 M2C 6MT, Tesla 3 Join Date: Oct 2013 Location: San Diego iTrader: (1)	Well, I can't speak to a M240i but I can speak extensively on a M235i. The steering feel isn't that great. I would say it's almost as good as some 80's racing games I played at the arcade as a kid. It feels a little light to me but more importantly you just don't get any real feeling out of it. I'm never really sure what the front tires are doing. The steering rack is precise but it sort of lacks emotion. I recently drove a e46 M3 ZCP and that had awesome steering feel. I don't know if we'll ever get back there but the steering feel to me on the M235i is biggest letdown to an otherwise awesome car.
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10-24-2016, 01:47 PM	#6
Viffermike Colonel 1753 Rep 2,942 Posts Drives: '18 black-n-blue 718 Cayman Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: Big D iTrader: (0)	Understand that electric steering, by its nature and operation, will not approach the same feel of hydraulic in any equivalent application -- just as hydraulic will not approach the same feel of an unassisted, completely mechanical rack in any equivalent application. This is the even the case with the electric steering used in recent Porsches, which by most regards has had the best overall 'feel' for many, many years -- and still does, even in electric. (But the P-car purists are all bitching about it, too, or course ... ) Your concern and comparison, OP, has been beaten to a pulp by not just previous posters, but by mainstream car mags. Can BMW make it 'feel' better? Probably, but likely at the expense of other design goals of the steering system ... ... and, as electric racks go, it's really not that bad. A tip: play around with the tire pressures when/if you get your car. Bite, turn-in, and overall feel do change perceptively with pressure changes. For instance, a buddy of mine with a 228i M Sport w/ZHP who runs an E30 as a track car claims that raising the fronts to 37 or so from the stock 32 does wonders for initial bite. I've verified that with my car, and now run my pressures at 36/36 F/R. Basically, you're hoping for apples from an orange grove. Electric racks are a design necessity for most larger car manufacturers now. We all need to learn to get used to how they 'feel'. __________________ --Life is a journey made more exciting with a fast car.-- --Helmets are for closers.-- <<Current: "Blackened" '18 NBM Porsche 718 Cayman ... Gone (but not forgotten): "Blackened" MG '15 228i M Sport w/aFe filter/scoop, Hertz drivers, P3Cars multigauge, other goodies>>
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10-25-2016, 12:00 AM	#10
Aaron240 Registered 0 Rep 2 Posts Drives: 2017 M240i Coupe Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	I've had my M240i for a couple of weeks now and I am happy with it. Over the weekend I took it for a drive through the canyons on a local bmw cruise, and I am happy with the steering and handling overall. In comfort mode, the steering is light, which makes parking and turning at very low speeds really easy. In Sport/Sport+, the steering tightens up significantly, and it feels very solid when turning at speed. I know you said you can't test drive one locally, but maybe there is a RWD one somewhere a short road trip away? It might be worth taking a weekend trip and fitting in a test drive to help you make up your mind about purchasing a $50k+ car.
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10-25-2016, 12:18 AM	#11
rainfall First Lieutenant 162 Rep 395 Posts Drives: A Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: West coast iTrader: (0)	I've had hydraulic steering before and test drove the M235i (I guess the steering didn't change much?). Like others said, if you switch to sport mode, you will have a little more WEIGHT to the steering. But if you are looking for FEEDBACK, then I don't think you'll get it with a modern BMW. I remember driving cars with hydraulic steering and cars with no steering assist at all. In either case, not only you feel the weight of the steering, but also you get the feedback from the road when you run over the imperfections of the road. As a side note: I also test drove a Miata. I think they had something in it, because I think I felt some FEEDBACK. If I remember well, MotorTrend said this one has an electric motor just to provide that feedback.
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10-25-2016, 11:21 AM	#12
BadBadDog New Member 9 Rep 10 Posts Drives: 1972 Schwinn Cavalcade Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Pastoral New Jersey iTrader: (0)	Thanks for the many thoughtful responses. I suppose the bottom line is simply “quit complaining and take it like a man”, electric steering is here to stay. The m240i, RWD and manual is now ordered. I AM intrigued to investigate the many adjustments that you all have kindly suggested: tire pressure, motor mounts, lower control arms, etc to try and find that “sweet spot” of “road feel” plus “feedback”. It sounds like I am at the beginning of an expensive (but interesting) pursuit. I do have the benefit of being able to compare the m240i, and the changes I make, against my wife's mileage 2003 BMW 330i (E46). While not the final word in steering, it is at least an “8”.
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10-27-2016, 08:29 AM	#16
Cavpilot2k Chief Warrant Officer 1023 Rep 1,638 Posts Drives: like a damn lunatic Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Boston iTrader: (0)	I'm sure the EPS is the least expensive option and suits the 90% of drivers, so why bother with something special for the 10% enthusiast crowd, but I always wondered why they wouldn't use an electrically driven hydraulic pump. Any thoughts? You would have the great steering feel of hydraulics with the increased efficiency of removing the parasitic power drag on the drive train. Best of both worlds, and people like us would stop beating BMW up about their numb steering. __________________ "Prius" is Latin for Eunuch. "Hrothgar": 2012 135i: 6MT M-Sport, BSM/Blk; Nav, Premium, Convenience, HK Dinan Stage 2 +PPK /// BMW PE /// VRSF CP /// K&N /// Koni Sports /// RSFB Inserts /// MPS4S 225/255 /// Other Stuff
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10-27-2016, 06:28 PM	#20
Rayscott Major 376 Rep 1,154 Posts Drives: BMW 228ix Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: Lewes DE iTrader: (0)	My 228ix feels fine to me. Put me the 90% percentile. If you want to be in the 10% percentile modify it to your liking. It's a great car either way. It is my first BMW moderate performance car and my wife and I like that we can select our preferred driving mode. We feel lucky to be able to afford such an awesome vehicle.
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10-29-2016, 03:46 PM	#22
mikeythedude Registered 0 Rep 3 Posts Drives: 2017 M240i xDrive (EB) Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Washington iTrader: (0)	Have owned the M240i w/xDrive for about a week now, I am definitely satisfied with the steering feedback. Still breaking it in, so haven't had the chance to have some fun with the car yet, but compared to some of the hydraulic power steering vehicles I have owned before, this one is very responsive. I haven't made any final judgments on being able to "feel the road" as it still feels a little soft for me (even in Sport+), but I really do like the stability. Some of the hydraulic power steering vehicles I've had before usually had anywhere between 3-6 degrees of "give" in the wheel, and that takes some of the fun out of it. Definitely not sensing much give (if any) in the M240i though .
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