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      07-06-2022, 03:43 PM   #1
Ajowhan
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LCA and TS bushings

Hey guys,

Looking into some suspension mods next.

Looking at these

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-powerfle...pff5-1902~pfx/

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-turner-m...021440tms01~a/

poly bushings for LCA and Monoball upgrade for the TS. Heard that these should give much crispier steering feels and feedback while nvh increase is alright.

Anyone has any experience with these?

Anyone know how these compared to m3/m4 LCA TS?
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      07-08-2022, 12:28 PM   #2
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      07-08-2022, 01:15 PM   #3
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Johnung has a few good write-ups about the control arms (on the f30post side of the forums). It's looking like we use the same control arms as the 3er.
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      07-10-2022, 08:29 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakystyly View Post
Johnung has a few good write-ups about the control arms (on the f30post side of the forums). It's looking like we use the same control arms as the 3er.
Thanks for pointing that out, there were some good reads including this one that definitely make me want to save up some cash for the VAC upper and or lower control arm kit for my purposes.
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      07-11-2022, 07:53 AM   #5
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will the M4 lca swap work for a AWD m240?
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      07-11-2022, 11:19 AM   #6
freakystyly
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The stock AWD and RWD arms have different part numbers for a reason...

The M3/4 arms also don't technically fit RWD either, they need custom spacers at the subframe connection to work. They also modify the geometry (-camber, +caster, etc...). IF they did bolt up.. that geometry change likely would cause problems with your axles since the wheel hub is in a new place.

I think there's a reason why much discussion has switched to the monoball or other bushing upgrades as they've become more available.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1815421 I'd recommend just pressing in new AWD specific bushings (or AWD monoballs) to your original AWD arms and try not to worry about mixing and matching stuff but that's just my unprofessional opinion.

Last edited by freakystyly; 07-11-2022 at 11:24 AM..
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      07-12-2022, 09:11 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakystyly View Post
The stock AWD and RWD arms have different part numbers for a reason...

The M3/4 arms also don't technically fit RWD either, they need custom spacers at the subframe connection to work. They also modify the geometry (-camber, +caster, etc...). IF they did bolt up.. that geometry change likely would cause problems with your axles since the wheel hub is in a new place.

I think there's a reason why much discussion has switched to the monoball or other bushing upgrades as they've become more available.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1815421 I'd recommend just pressing in new AWD specific bushings (or AWD monoballs) to your original AWD arms and try not to worry about mixing and matching stuff but that's just my unprofessional opinion.
Thanks, i actually scheduled to take my car to the dealer, it keeps pulling to the right and after 2 alignments it good for a month then it falls off again so it leads me to think a suspension component is bad. i will wait until after they check it out and fix it to do the bushings. my neighbor has a press so we can do it.
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      08-04-2022, 10:32 AM   #8
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I just installed SPL monoballs on my M240 rear drive
Results were very worth while .

Tested it at Road atlanta last week
I would recommend it. But there is more NVH
Race shop suggested only doing poly bushings since it is street car but it is a reasonable trade off

They were a bitch to press out and press in

Vorshlag camber plates
KW v2 coil overs

I bought them for $250 on a forum but If I had to do it over again I would have purchased the
Two-piece power flex poly units Less cost , easier install , probably longer life than mono balls and close enough for a street car that is tracked which is not a dedicated race car

Bill
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      08-04-2022, 01:36 PM   #9
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I had SPL monoballs for the TS on my m235i with the m4 lca + ts to correct my caster. It did feel a lot better
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      08-04-2022, 08:37 PM   #10
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I skipped the whole f8x LCA upgrade and just put in camber adjustable bushings from powerflex. Zero increase in NVH, have 1.6* both front wheels (remember I'm on Kw V3 and pretty low), clear and instant improvement in cornering stability and feel under load. Definitely both a PITA to swap them and a major alignment change, my toe was off the chart afterward and steering wheel wouldn't recenter. So do them close to your alignment shop or have them do it.
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      08-22-2022, 08:19 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rtl32 View Post
I skipped the whole f8x LCA upgrade and just put in camber adjustable bushings from powerflex. Zero increase in NVH, have 1.6* both front wheels (remember I'm on Kw V3 and pretty low), clear and instant improvement in cornering stability and feel under load. Definitely both a PITA to swap them and a major alignment change, my toe was off the chart afterward and steering wheel wouldn't recenter. So do them close to your alignment shop or have them do it.
after a while. how about the adjustable powerflex? I have read in other posts that they do not have long duration. what do you think?
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      08-23-2022, 10:17 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madriz View Post
after a while. how about the adjustable powerflex? I have read in other posts that they do not have long duration. what do you think?
All I know on that is it might be more of a pain in the ass for alignment.

I am now torn on monoball vs powerflex bushings vs meyle HD for my tension strut.

Meyle HD is so much cheaper than powerflex, so much that I worry about quality...

Anyone that can chime in on that?
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      08-23-2022, 12:01 PM   #13
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Powerflex are not generally designed for fit-and-forget if you want long life. They work well and last a long time when the stainless steel inserts and bushing bores and ends are greased every year or so with their special silicone grease.

Last edited by aerobod; 08-23-2022 at 12:09 PM..
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      08-23-2022, 12:08 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajowhan View Post
All I know on that is it might be more of a pain in the ass for alignment.

I am now torn on monoball vs powerflex bushings vs meyle HD for my tension strut.

Meyle HD is so much cheaper than powerflex, so much that I worry about quality...

Anyone that can chime in on that?
Here's Bimmerworld's take on Meyle HD's product line (as of ~2012 or so, it looks like): https://www.bimmerworld.com/About-Us...Parts-for-BMW/;

BW's Meyle HD parts and kits: https://www.bimmerworld.com/ssearch....q:meyle$2520hd; and,

BW's description of the Meyle HD tension strut: https://www.bimmerworld.com/Front-Ri...6855742HD.html.

hth
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      08-23-2022, 03:44 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aerobod View Post
Powerflex are not generally designed for fit-and-forget if you want long life. They work well and last a long time when the stainless steel inserts and bushing bores and ends are greased every year or so with their special silicone grease.
Yikes, I didn't know that, that could be annoying but not deal breaker if the greasing method is not too hard.

Are you referring to this "Use of Powerflex Copper Grease PCG1 is recommended for ease of installation. Periodic reapplication is recommended to extend squeak-free service life of bushings."?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
Here's Bimmerworld's take on Meyle HD's product line (as of ~2012 or so, it looks like): https://www.bimmerworld.com/About-Us...Parts-for-BMW/;

BW's Meyle HD parts and kits: https://www.bimmerworld.com/ssearch....q:meyle$2520hd; and,

BW's description of the Meyle HD tension strut: https://www.bimmerworld.com/Front-Ri...6855742HD.html.

hth
That definitely helps! As always, that tips the scale in Meyle HD tension strut. I can't find an equivalent on Meyle HD for the LCA though.. I might be leaning towards Meyle HD arms and bushing change to the powerflex for the LCA right now.I only see regular Meyle non HD for the LCA..
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      08-23-2022, 04:01 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajowhan View Post
Yikes, I didn't know that, that could be annoying but not deal breaker if the greasing method is not too hard.

Are you referring to this "Use of Powerflex Copper Grease PCG1 is recommended for ease of installation. Periodic reapplication is recommended to extend squeak-free service life of bushings."?

That definitely helps! As always, that tips the scale in Meyle HD tension strut. I can't find an equivalent on Meyle HD for the LCA though.. I might be leaning towards Meyle HD arms and bushing change to the powerflex for the LCA right now.I only see regular Meyle non HD for the LCA..
I recommend calling BW for advice; they'll give it to you straight, with no BS.

If a poly bushing is going to squeak, and therefore need periodic greasing, I think you want whatever the poly is housed in to have a grease fitting so that you can re-grease the bushing without having to remove it.

That's been my experience with poly sway bar bushings, anyway. I had a set that squeaked enough that it really annoyed me, and the only way to get rid of the squeak was to remove the bushings, re-grease them, and then re-install them. In my book, for a street car, that's asking too much. I must not have been the only one as it seems common today that poly sway bar bushings come with grease fittings.
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      08-23-2022, 04:27 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
I recommend calling BW for advice; they'll give it to you straight, with no BS.

If a poly bushing is going to squeak, and therefore need periodic greasing, I think you want whatever the poly is housed in to have a grease fitting so that you can re-grease the bushing without having to remove it.

That's been my experience with poly sway bar bushings, anyway. I had a set that squeaked enough that it really annoyed me, and the only way to get rid of the squeak was to remove the bushings, re-grease them, and then re-install them. In my book, for a street car, that's asking too much. I must not have been the only one as it seems common today that poly sway bar bushings come with grease fittings.
Good news and bad news from BW. Bad news is need to remove powerflex for regreasing. Good news is, he thinks that they should not need regreasing unless it becomes noisy which it shouldn't...

I am just going to go for it, gonna order meyle HD tension strut and powerflex bushing for the LCA.

Thank you everyone!

Will post update on how it goes in 3-4 weeks when parts are installed.
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      08-24-2022, 12:57 AM   #18
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The Powerflex bushings are designed for the stainless insert to move inside the polyurethane, so the special silicone grease is applied between the centre insert and bushing and on the dust washers at each end. It is a clear grease used on those surfaces, as opposed to any copper slip or other lubricant applied between the bushing and housing during installation. The aim of the grease is to allow movement with minimum stiction, as the bushing (especially the track orientated “black” series) are not designed to flex rotationally, as the OEM ones do.
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      08-24-2022, 12:51 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aerobod View Post
The Powerflex bushings are designed for the stainless insert to move inside the polyurethane, so the special silicone grease is applied between the centre insert and bushing and on the dust washers at each end. It is a clear grease used on those surfaces, as opposed to any copper slip or other lubricant applied between the bushing and housing during installation. The aim of the grease is to allow movement with minimum stiction, as the bushing (especially the track orientated “black” series) are not designed to flex rotationally, as the OEM ones do.
Gotcha, I reach out and here is the response from powerflex.

Hello,

Our bushings do not normally need to be greased after initial installation.

Thank you.

Best regards,
Logan Whitt
TF: 855.374.1877
DL: 540.307.4505
Logan@PowerflexUSA.com
www.PowerflexUSA.com
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      08-24-2022, 05:33 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajowhan View Post
Gotcha, I reach out and here is the response from powerflex.

Hello,

Our bushings do not normally need to be greased after initial installation.

Thank you.

Best regards,
Logan Whitt
TF: 855.374.1877
DL: 540.307.4505
Logan@PowerflexUSA.com
www.PowerflexUSA.com
They may need less attention in the F22, but my Caterham needs them lubricating about every 10 hard track days and year of road use, though they are relatively small surface area wise compared with those used in the BMW. I left the single rear bushing on that car a bit long last year (double the normal inspection period) and it was dry when I took it apart with some scuffing of the polyurethane starting.
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      08-25-2022, 08:03 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aerobod View Post
They may need less attention in the F22, but my Caterham needs them lubricating about every 10 hard track days and year of road use, though they are relatively small surface area wise compared with those used in the BMW. I left the single rear bushing on that car a bit long last year (double the normal inspection period) and it was dry when I took it apart with some scuffing of the polyurethane starting.
Got it, I will take a look at it in about a year as a precaution.
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      08-27-2022, 03:40 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ajowhan View Post
Good news and bad news from BW. Bad news is need to remove powerflex for regreasing. Good news is, he thinks that they should not need regreasing unless it becomes noisy which it shouldn't...

I am just going to go for it, gonna order meyle HD tension strut and powerflex bushing for the LCA.

Thank you everyone!

Will post update on how it goes in 3-4 weeks when parts are installed.


I think I'm going to follow your path.

Please indicate when you can how you feel.
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