[USA-RET]

Originally Posted by jstein55

I don't see the upgrade with the 4er's interior. The F3X is pretty cheap even when loaded up, you may get some more trim on the dash but as a whole its a pretty mediocre interior imo, same with the G20, the only good thing is you can get merino leather but I have yet to find a dealer that has spec'd the car with one.

That's why you order

[Mehim]

No heads up display on the 240 either.😩

[Ron Jeffries]

2er for me. the 4 is immense.

[Rocky58]

I drove both convertibles at a BMW event at Santa Anita because I liked the idea of a hard top. The cars are just so different that there was no question for me. One feels like a sports car. The other (to me) is an ungainly beast, slower and heavier and just not what I was looking for. Two completely different cars for different people.

[Rockfresh15]

UPDATE:

Welp. Test drove a 440i (no MPPSK), M240 AWD, and an M2...

Now I need an M2.

My E92's been in the shop for the past week and I drove a minivan to the test drive, so when I hopped in the 440i it felt incredible. It was quicker than I remember from the 4 series loaners I got a couple years ago which were likely in fact slower, but also the steering feel was much better than I remembered. Again, this could be partially due to me driving a Toyota Sienna for 90 min to the test drive, but I genuinely think it's improved over the 428's from 2 years back (I'm sure someone more knowledgeable can confirm these upgrades).

Drove the M240 next and it was certainly peppier and more light on its feet. I think I was still in awe of how much quicker the 440i was than I remember from previous years because, at first, they felt pretty similar to me when I stomped on the gas for 2-3 seconds. My sister on the other hand, from that first launch, said it definitely had better pick up -- which I agreed with, but didn't think it was THAT pronounced at the time.

Driving it around a bit more, it's clear it was more playful. Got a little slide going around an exit which was fun, anticipated, and controlled -- the exact things I'd heard about the M2, which surprised me a little on an AWD car, but at the same time I figured A) tires could be a factor and B) this could also just be the tossability of the M240 everyone loves so much. Very fun drive, very controllable. Oh yeah and I didn't notice steering play on this 2018 M240 at on-center; in fact the steering on sport/sport+ felt every bit as tight and heavy as I'd want (electronic steering considering) and I had 0 issue with it. Was nice actually to loosen it up at slower driving in comfort mode -- honestly, same assessment goes for the 440.

Then there was the M2. I was almost worried the M2 would be too fast or squirrely, based on the way people talk about it, but two things struck me right off the bat:

1. Ooof this steering is tiiiiiight -- in the best possible way.
2. Wow, although more dramatic with its turbo-come-on and upshifts, it really doesn't feel any faster than the M240.

On the first point, I looooved the tight/heavy steering on the highway, ugh it felt so good and so connected to me that I couldn't help but smile and laugh, like wow, I've never driven a car that felt that way (granted I haven't driven THAT many cars). So that was an incredible feeling I'm still currently day-dreaming about.

BUT, it was also so stiff that, even on comfort, if you're cruising on the highway, you can't just do little hand/wrist adjustments for minor corrections (going straight). You can use one hand, but you gotta put a little torque into it. Again, super cool to feel like if I let go of the wheel it would only ever keep going straight and to have that amazing feeling turning with that kind of steering feel, but I could totally see that becoming a little fatiguing as my DD or on longer drives.

That's about the only thing that gave me pause on the M2, because on that second point (it being more dramatic but not necessarily much faster than the M240 -- tho that drama is sooo good, feeling that punch, hearing the turbos spool up, omg my palms are sweating) BUT that kinda power delivery could get annoying on longer drives for passengers, y'know, SO's, family n the like. I see now that there's an M2 CS transmission tweak that can smooth this all out, but I was pretty ready to tell everyone I know (including myself) to just deal with it cause I'm in love.

SO..now I'm convinced I need an M2. Almost pulled the trigger on a couple, but then I FURTHER convinced myself....you should get the M2 Competition. By all accounts it sounds like the better DD, 70% of reviews seem to say it's better than the OG M2 in every way (I agree with most tho that the OG M2 sounds better, and pending a test drive, may just feel better to drive too? although few reviewers seem to make that case). I've also heard it's less stiff over bumps (tho still springy) and just more FUN to drive, even than the original M2.

The only thing I'm a liiil concerned about is one of the biggest praises of the M2C, which is that it's soo easy to throw the tail end out (and control it, most times) and that sounds a little scary to this guy who hasn't driven RWD in about 8 years and fishtail crashed that car..(I was driving way too spirited on WAY too bald of tires, but still, it gives me pause). Also, in my head I prefer the idea of sticking in my corners more often than not, but being able to step out when I want it to like it seems everyone says the OG M2 did basically perfectly. So, a lil conflict, but..almost certainly not gonna stop this M2C purchase. Too in love now

Ultimately, I realized the truest truth of them all, especially about BMWs. These are all exceedingly excellent cars and if you buy one you're going to love it. Period. You may not love it forever, but you're gonna love it. And I think the M2C may give me the longest period of sustained love (in Long Beach Blue, of course)

[Sportstick]

M2C is fun (at least for a moment under WOT)...my kid has a 2020. Just keep in mind that the summer performance tires on that car should not be driven on under 40 degrees F. Lots of traction loss, possible compound cracking, and warranty exclusions. Plan to have another set for the "shoulder seasons", perhaps some UHPAS, and being in New Jersey, winters for the snow.

[cristo]

The cracking isn’t really a worry until
you get down to 20F.
Then it really is.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by cristo

The cracking isn’t really a worry until
you get down to 20F.
Then it really is.

Michelin is quite explicit about 40F but we all set our risk tolerances differently.

[WolfGTI]

Keep telling yourself that. It's not only about cracking it's about tire pliability and traction at temps below 40F. They become hockey pucks below 40F.

Originally Posted by cristo

The cracking isn’t really a worry until
you get down to 20F.
Then it really is.

[Rockfresh15]

Right. I’d read about how bad these tires are below 40..guess I’ll have to look into this ASAP as it could be November before I get mine. I wont really NEED to drive this in the snow unless its an emergency (and even then there’s other cars at the house) what with WFH and all, so perhaps some UHPAS could do the trick?

[gosi]

Why not get some dedicated winter tires? It’s a shame to fit this car with all seasons. You will be missing out in the summer.

And like others have said it’s not about snow, but about grip when the tires are cold.

IMHO you are better off with cheapish winter tires. If you aren’t going to be driving it much during that time anyway. And cheap winters will still be better than all seasons.

[Rockfresh15]

I like cheaper and better re: winter tires..any personal suggestions?

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by Rockfresh15

I like cheaper and better re: winter tires..any personal suggestions?

Michelin XIcexi3 (better on dry than Blizzak, but excellent on snow/ice)
Blizzak WS90 (even better on snow/ice, ok on dry, but not "performance")

I would avoid the so-called "performance winter" category....a half step which is not the "best of both worlds". Those include Michelin Alpin PA4 and Blizzak LM series.

Nokian makes excellent winter tires, but are more expensive and harder to find.

[cristo]

I’m a big fan of X-ice xi3 in Winter and colder
shoulder seasons and PSS4 in Summer and
warmer shoulder seasons (when consistently
above 35F and no snow in the 14 day forecast).

[dradernh]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Nokian makes excellent winter tires, but are more expensive and harder to find.

I like Nokians. These are winters in 225/45-17 shipped out of Michigan by the vendor I use: https://www.tiresbyweb.com/tbw_tires...Nokian%20Tires

[RvR]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Michelin XIcexi3 (better on dry than Blizzak, but excellent on snow/ice)
Blizzak WS90 (even better on snow/ice, ok on dry, but not "performance")

I would avoid the so-called "performance winter" category....a half step which is not the "best of both worlds". Those include Michelin Alpin PA4 and Blizzak LM series.

Nokian makes excellent winter tires, but are more expensive and harder to find.

PA4s have worked just fine for me, in snow up to 4". Much deeper than that and the front dam would start to plow, especially cross street berms, so I stay in. PA4s are great on cold wet or dry pavement.

It all depends on what you're dealing with. If you're on continuous snowpack or mixed ice/snow more than say 50% of the time, the Nokians or Hakkis would be a best bet.

Here we have snow for 2-3 days before the salt trucks dose it into oblivion (and rust everything in sight), and are left with salty slush and wet/ dry pavement.

On other cars I have had Pirelli winter tires (don't remember the model) and they were excellent.

I've also had Blizzaks (there are multiple models with different characteristics.) The ones I had were fine on snowpack, but had a seriously disconcerting amount of tread block squirm and I would not want those again. Now other models in the line might be okay, but the ones I had were the worst winter tires I've owned.

[Rockfresh15]

Hmm, tryna think whether I should see if they can spec mine with winter tires to save some upfront cost, since if I ordered now it wouldn't be until about November when the car gets here. Then I'd just order summers later. I'm thinking if the price difference is negligible then that's what I'd do, but if a decent set of summers are significantly more then I'd bite the bullet earlier on the winters

[Finn Germai-Yaz]

I put a down payment on a CPO 2017 M240i with 25k miles. Was $35,000 before taxes and fees. It came out to $39,221.xx out the door.

There was a CPO 2018 440i X Drive also on the lot for $37,491.xx. Reason why I went with the 2 Series was because it would cost me at least $5000.00 to "M Performance" the 440i with a MPPSK and BMW Brakes.

[darckmate]

Originally Posted by Rockfresh15

Hey all,

I'm coming from a 2013 e92 that I absolutely love, but I just need something faster and a little more exhilarating to drive, so here I am stuck between the 2017 M240 xDrive and 2018 440i xDrive w/ M Performance power and sound.

I gotta say, between the things I've read and watching the Straight Pipes reviews on these cars, I'm really conflicted, (

) especially with the big praise the 440i (w/ MPPSK) got from them for being a near-perfect car. I'm planning to schedule some test drives soon but until then I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts. Especially since I can't find a 440i with MPPSK to test.

So here's my pros and cons why I'm stuck so far:

M240 Pros:

• Looks better (prefer the body style, stock rims are black/gray, etc.)
• So quick and nimble without needing a single engine mod
• It's new and exotic to me and to others (less on the road, change-up from my 3 etc.)
• Better brakes? I'm assuming, due the M sport brakes.

M240 Cons:

• Many complain about the HK sound system being pretty trash - a big drawback for me which would need to be fixed immediately, and seems complicated/"guess-and-check-y" to do. Lotta hassle especially with things how they are now..
• Steering feel. Owners and reviewers alike complain not just of numbness but up to an inch of play on dead-center. I've driven newer BMWs and this sounds very annoying and potentially cruise-ruining going fast on a highway with that kinda "responsiveness." Would definitely be looking to remedy this with aftermarket parts, another sort of guess and check endeavor (albeit less so than the sound system) especially for xDrives.

440 MPSSK Pros:

• Oh my god that exhaust. And changing it with a click of a button?? Ugh, so good. That said, I prefer the natural tone of the 240, but the mode switch and pops are a reeaal sell for the 440.
• Potentially better steering feel? Straight Pipes seems pretty convinced. They didn't really have a single complaint, unlike with the 240. (Check 2:30 on the 240 review vs 3:40 on the 440 review)
• HK sound system that I won't have to touch if it's anything like my superb HK setup in my e92
• Slightly more well-appointed interior -- really just icing on the cake, cause I don't reeally care too much about these differences, besides the sound system.

440 MPSSK Cons:

• Not really a fan of the looks, especially the rear. Much prefer the 240 in those regards -- more reminiscent of a sportier, more up-to-date e92.
• Potentially not as fun/nimble? I did read a lot of people who bought 2's complaining that the 4 felt big and boaty, though perhaps some aftermarket tweaks could remedy this?

TL;DR

I love the idea of a smaller, better-looking, and super fast car like the M240, but driving around rocking that damn-near perfect HK sound system and the classic 3 series steering are huge for me. I know the 440i is electric too but it sounds like it might be better from what I'ver heard. So, if I got the 240 I'd no doubt need to change the sound system and try to add back some steering feel, but if I got the 440 I THINK I'd only need the MPPSK, since I can't change much of how it looks, wheels are a waste of money (to me), and the steering feel is better (?).

So..anyone driven both care to comment?

So i going to go to each point as i reasently went through the same process.

M240i does feel more nimble than the 440, easier to toss around and overall more playfull. looks are more of a personal think.

Regarding the audio you should test a 240 with HK and test it yourself as at least from me is good enough, and in case you are looking at a 240 without HK you can retrofit it, i'll be doing a thread on this in the future.

The interior may be better put together on the 440 due to it no been an "entry level" bmw.

engine sound coud be easily addres with aftermarket mods, you can find plenty of info in the forums, i went with vrsf catless downpipe and awe catback.

the 240 overall is a smaller car, and this was very important to me at least as it is my daily driver an for city parking is very appreciate, im comming from a golf r so....

i dont know where u from but at least here you can get a pre lci 240 for the same price as a 435 from the same year so that was a no-brainer for me.

[Ron Jeffries]

I wanted xIce on mine but I also wanted to buy from my dealer, because a) I like to pay top dollar and b) I wanted them to store the off-season wheels and tires for me, and that was the penalty. They configured Contis and they are just fine in the winter.

[bthomas518]

Originally Posted by dradernh

I like Nokians. These are winters in 225/45-17 shipped out of Michigan by the vendor I use: https://www.tiresbyweb.com/tbw_tires...Nokian%20Tires

Nokian Hakkapeliitta is the best snow tire money can buy, IMO. Michelin X-Ice are not even close.

We moved to SoCal from upstate NY 7 years ago, fortunate enough to just run Michelin PS4S year round now. Used to have nasty winters, and those Hakkapeliitta's made my E90 manual RWD as useful as my wife's Subaru in the snow. Amazing tire.

[Finn Germai-Yaz]

Why are you guys still talking about tires?

I picked up the 240i last week. Haven't really drove it around yet. I think the HK sound system is decent. The exhaust on sport mode crackles a little. I think a AWE full exhaust will mimic the MPSSK on on the 440i.