09-04-2020, 12:51 AM | #1 |
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M240i Integral Audio F-22 Soundstage Upgrade
A long story but some might it find useful as I started with suggestions from this forum.
My 2018 M240i came with the OEM HK system. I went on a 1000-mile trip soon after purchase. The OEM sound was too “shrill” and listening eventually became uncomfortable. Upon returning, I started searching for how improve the sound in the BMW. I had a 2013 MINI that I installed an Integral Audio full soundstage system in the day I picked it up in 2013 so was pretty spoiled when it came to tunes in the car. I loved the Integral Audio system in the MINI enough to head straight to their website to upgrade the BMW but in 2018 no F22 soundstage option was available so continued searching. My first priority is always no wire splicing or car cutting/drilling, and second is complete stealth. One of the suggestions on this forum was the German Etons and disconnect the center channel. I purchased the Etons via eBay directly from a German audio store. They arrived quickly via DHL and were a simple “plug and play” affair. The Etons were much smother but I didn’t like the way the center channel delete left a hole in the front soundstage. I then added the Eton center midrange/tweeter and sound was fuller but midrange was a still a bit subdued. Plus, the sound from all five speakers, although pleasant, was somewhat “surround” sounding. The low frequency bass was also a bit lacking. The Eton upgrade was a definite improvement over the OEM HK but the joy faded as time went on. Next I added an Audiofrog G10D4 subwoofer (wired at 2ohms) in a MusicarNW F22 sub enclosure powered by an Alpine PDR-M65. The Alpine fit under the trunk floor vertically and attached with VHB tape. A TechnicPNP 676hk-674-add-a-sub-harness supplied the signal, easy to install and completely plug and play. The sub sounded tight and covered the low-end inadequacies. I was happy with that system for a while but over time noticed the mids were really a bit too muffled. I recently discovered that Integral Audio now has an F22 DSP kit available and just could not resist the temptation to upgrade to full DSP soundstage. It was expensive but I already had a lot of faith in Integral Audio since I thought the same thing when purchasing the MINI system in 2013 and never regretted that purchase. Still love the MINI system after 8 years. OK, after placing the order, thought I must be crazy given the upgrades already done but there was no turning back. As soon as the Integral Audio F22 Soundstage kit arrived I went to work. The kit was comprehensive, install was very straightforward and completely plug and play, absolutely no cutting, drilling or splicing. The DSP amp came fully programmed and calibrated by Integral Audio for the F22 and fit in the OEM amp slot nicely. Well, any apprehension I had over making this upgrade decision vanished as soon as it came on! Soooo nice now! What BMW should have put in this car to start with. Sat in the car the first night for a couple of hours just listening to Apple Lossless tracks via an iPod Classic Gen 5. Vocals, strings, horns, piano, cymbals, clapping, finger snapping.... you name it... absolutely crystal clear! And with proper timing, excellent separation and perfect front facing soundstage. The first track that happened to come up on shuffle was Carole King singing "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow", an old recording from 1971 and WOW...Where Joni Mitchell and James Taylor come in on backup vocals (at 1:02 & 1:49), their individual voices can be easily discerned while singing in harmony....just stunning clarity!! I listen to classic rock, acoustic, new wave, alternative, ballads, blues, all sound so good in the car that I sit in the garage and listen with a battery charger attached. In the MINI it was a no brainer to upgrade to the Integral Audio system from stock, but in the BMW, I had already put time and effort into upgrading with the Etons and was relatively happy with the sound. I took the leap of faith to the next level solely based upon confidence in my previous Integral Audio experience. And anyone (myself included) gets replies to pre-sales inquiries and post sale questions directly from the president, Kevin Bennett. His dedication to excellence is evident in the components, engineering and Kevin’s personal dedication to customer satisfaction. I am so glad I upgraded to this exceptionally well-engineered soundstage and am supremely happy with the sound in my M240i now! Last edited by Jeff Jordan; 10-12-2020 at 10:58 AM.. Reason: misspelled words |
09-04-2020, 08:38 AM | #2 |
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I'm assuming the Eton center speaker you went with was the Eton B100XCN?
If so, was it direct plug and play with no modifications? How do you address the OEM center tweeter and wiring? |
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09-05-2020, 09:19 AM | #4 |
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Just asking - did you adjust the "tone" settings for radio and multimedia sources such that there was more bass and less treble? The H-K in my 228i M-sport seems fine to me, but maybe your hearing is better.
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09-05-2020, 11:03 AM | #5 | |
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I'm sure the type of music you enjoy plays a big part. I like Blues and 60-70 rock at normal listening volumes (where you can converse w/ your passenger while the music is playing). If one likes Rap or hip-hop with pounding bass, I fully understand the need for more bass or a modified sound system. Every car I order, always has the upgraded stereo option box checked and, to my ear, they all sound pretty good. |
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09-05-2020, 12:00 PM | #6 | |
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Drives: 15 F80 M3, 22 G01 X3 30i
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09-25-2020, 11:38 PM | #7 | |
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I just finished upgrading to the B100Ws in the front, and the B100XCN in the center. My first impression was that the B100XCN is too loud and noticable, compared to the stock center channel that was muted and indistinguishable in my experience. Curious of your thoughts. Glad you found the right system! |
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10-12-2020, 11:29 AM | #9 |
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That is a very good question, Kevin Bennett would know the answer if you email Integral Audio. I have not had any system update since installing the Integral Audio Soundstage kit but did have the mandatory DME recall when I had just the TechnicPNP 676hk-674-add-a-sub-harness installed for the subwoofer. I was surprised when the flash failed but it was a full car SW reflash. I removed just the TechnicPNP OEM amp harness, reconnected the OEM amp and left all the other sub amp wiring intact. BMW then performed the flash with no problem and I put the harness back.
I saved the factory amp just in case I every need to put it back for this very reason but not sure if needed or not for a system update. Hopefully the M240i will not need another dealer complete re-flash but if it does, I will just disconnect the Integral Audio amp power lead and OEM connector, then re-connect the OEM amp. I've had the trunk apart enough times to do it in 15 minutes now... Last edited by Jeff Jordan; 10-13-2020 at 10:28 PM.. Reason: add "remove power" |
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10-13-2020, 09:14 PM | #11 |
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Hi,
Here is the link. And the president of Integral Audio, Kevin Bennett, is an incredibly knowledgeable and talented audio engineer that passionately stands behind his products! https://integralaudio.com/soundstage...ies-coupe.html |
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10-13-2020, 11:59 PM | #12 | |
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10-14-2020, 09:10 AM | #13 |
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You don't! You need to reinstall the factory amp if/when the car goes to the dealer for a software update.
Last edited by MarcoZandrini; 10-17-2020 at 10:23 AM.. |
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10-14-2020, 04:57 PM | #14 |
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Hi Tropik Thunder
Tweeters are silk, center channel remains but with a modified acoustic profile for fill. AMP/DSP unit is an ARC PS8-50 made for Integral Audio. Integral loads a custom DSP map engineered to interface the F22 Head Unit, tailored to cabin acoustics and Integral speaker/crossover components so the amp/DSP/speakers are all plug and play ready for a perfect soundstage install right out of the box. The ARC PS8-50 is a top shelf component, specs can be found on ARC website: https://www.arcaudio.com/store?p=183072 ARC PS8-50 CAR.HiFi product review: https://www.arcaudio.com/sites/defau...S8_50_engl.pdf Amp/DSP with Integral custom engineering/mapping this alone is about a $2,000 value. Add to that speaker/crossover design and fabrication, the actual cost of the speakers/crossovers/harnesses and acoustics testing and $2600 is a good value. I am not an expert but have installed a custom stereo in almost every car I've owned since the 1970's and from that experience know how hard it is to get an outstanding soundstage result. The journey in my original post was about how difficult it is to create flawless vehicle sound yourself with sourced individual components that must be perfectly married together. I came across Integral Audio Back in January of 2013 while waiting for my MINI to be built/delivered and knew the OEM sound system was inadequate so was researching components on the web. The NAM forum spoke so highly of Kevin Bennett, Integral Audio, and the excellent sound from their MINI audio package that I took a look...it was well designed and completely stealth but I thought the Integral Audio soundstage package was way too expensive at $2400. Researching sourcing my own set-up, eventually realized the value of a completely engineered end to end solution right out of the box was worth the price and reluctantly pulled the trigger about a week before the MINI was delivered. The boxes arrived a day before the MINI and I laid out everything. I picked up the car, drove straight home and stayed up till 4 AM doing the install, every piece, part, nut, bolt, tape, wire was included...and the sound was fantastic. It will be 8 years in January, still own the MINI, and STILL love cranking the Integral Audio Soundstage kit. Hands down it is the best mod done to the MINI, have never regretted that purchase, never tired of the sound and couldn’t imagine owning the car without it. I called the M240i audio a "journey" because each incremental improvement I made over the original HK made the sound better but the joy only lasted until the next flaw was too present to ignore. I had already sunk over $1200 and went for the Integral Audio package because of the MINI experience, knowing first hand the dedication of Integral Audio, especially the president, Kevin Bennet, to provide the BEST engineered system that can be purchased at a reasonable price. The only regret is the Integral F22 package wasn’t available in 2018…. I think it is an excellent value at $2600! Especially the part where you can just enjoy incredible sound! But to each their own journey and opinion, audio is a personal thing…. I don't really do any social media and joined the board just to share my arrival at audio bliss. The post is just a thank you and pay-back for all the valuable and useful information gained here from others along the way.... Last edited by Jeff Jordan; 10-14-2020 at 11:03 PM.. |
10-14-2020, 05:31 PM | #15 | |
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10-15-2020, 10:03 AM | #16 | |
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First, thanks to Jeff for sharing. He forwarded me this thread and said folks had some questions that needed answers. We don't currently have an active Bimmerpost sponsorship (forums just haven't been that productive for us), so I'll keep it to just answers for now.
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We've actually updated the product to include a pigtail harness that allows easy re-connection of the factory amp to the CAN bus for updates (Jeff I owe you this pigtail!).
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10-15-2020, 10:15 AM | #17 | ||
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10-15-2020, 10:43 AM | #18 |
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Yes, it does
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10-20-2020, 09:05 AM | #20 | |
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No, no rear speakers. Officially, at least. This is why: https://integralaudio.com/blog/the-e...rear-speakers/ I say "officially" because we are starting to soften on this position. Why? As my wife says, "do you want to be right, or do you want to be happy?" Some folks are absolutely convinced they need rear speakers. If they want to give us more $$ for something that isn't going to add much noticeable benefit, I'd rather not lose the sale. The rears may not help much, but they definitely don't hurt. Additionally, in some vehicles - especially some of the older models we have Soundstage's for - the OEM rears are damaged or otherwise not working properly. Replacing the rears now gets all the work done upfront and gets you a bullet-proof system for as long as you own the vehicle.
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04-14-2021, 08:45 AM | #21 |
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Hey Everyone,
I just posted this review in the M2 Nav & Audio forum but wanted to repost here as I found this thread extremely helpful when trying to make a decision. I also think theres not enough traffic around these guys, so the little bump here might help! Good riddance to that trash stock hifi system! A solid year or so was spent deliberating between options as I was unsure of how much I wanted to be financially invested upgrading the audio in this vehicle, impacting my options considerably. Though the more I read - and the more I drove - the more I knew I wanted to do this right, and never have to think about it again. A quick side about me: I work in Film/Tv doing sound design & compositions. I consider myself knowledgeable about acoustics & speaker design and I have worked with building and modifying studio monitors in the past. I remain continually impressed & humbled by the expertise of some of you DIYers, so I’ll try to speak to what I know & let you all make up your mind about some of the points I may not have addressed. So - I had narrowed my choices down to a Match Up 7 Amp with a set of focal speakers and Integral Audio’s SoundstageDSP for the bmw 2 Series. I own a pair of focal monitors which I use in my home studio - and LOVE them. Huge supporter and fan of that brand, so I was pretty excited about their bmw specific products. From what I had been reading on this forum, the biggest improvements to my system were going to come from an amp upgrade by supplying more power to the drivers and getting more bass out of the under-seats. This, along with finding a decent set of speakers to match, seemed like the upgrade I was looking for. I didn’t question it much until I thought about how many folks were still toying with their DSP/EQ’s post-upgrade. DSP is powerful but really complex, you can quickly run down a very deep rabbit hole and get lost in settings. If so many people are still searching for the correct settings, that says to me that something isn’t right. After doing some more research, I read about Integral’s tuning process. They claimed that their upgrades are tuned to the vehicle, but based on my experience I know the devil is in the details, and claiming is not the same as doing. Yet everything I saw about Integral Audio’s process meshed with what I know to be true from my studio monitor work. At this point, I was starting to get excited about what Integral Audio had to offer but the price point was a solid $1K north of what I originally set out to spend. After seeing all that went into their system, from wiring harnesses to adapters, to even mirror sail trim with tweeter mounts… (seriously who else is doing that)… I realized how much more I’d have to spend on installation if I went with the focal/bimmertech route. Ultimately, the price isn’t really that different and I thought the overall value was going to be worth it. Now install was easy & left no trace of vehicle modification. No loose wires, no sign of any changes to the interior - all the parts had fabricated adapters and mounts that integrated seamlessly. The installation instructions are incredibly comprehensive and took me about 6 hours to complete. Kevin Bennett, president of the company, was extremely accessible for every step of the process. He even offered to be available for Facetime during my installation, should any questions arise. Here I am, post-installation and I am VERY HAPPY. Audio is tricky because you just don’t know how good something can sound until you experience it and with this system, I ended up with an upgrade that accomplished far more than I had expected to be possible. This exceeded my expectations by a long shot. So my favorite parts? The soundstage is wonderfully detailed. Without moving my head or shifting in my seat, I feel front and center of a lush, rich, full & balanced stage which leaves me totally immersed in the music. It sounds right for just about every genre. When I play my mixes on the system, they sound exactly like how I intended them from rock to techno. No frilly curves boosting unnecessary frequencies to compensate for a weakness elsewhere in the system. As I said, I can’t be happier with how this turned out & I encourage everyone to give them some consideration. Website: https://integralaudio.com/soundstage...ies-coupe.html |
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05-18-2021, 06:41 AM | #22 |
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I fail to understand the lack of fine tuning via user input, from frequency response, to speaker timing, etc., as an audiophile, I can tell you that no two ears are the same! I get the "tuned" by experts and understand how it may apply to the majority of what might be the customer base. It's keeps things simple... But for those who really have a discerning ear, none of these systems allow for that individualized tweaking
I've read through it all, and it appears the system fills in the missing pieces, bass upgrade and signal processing. For a premium that covers a few quick connectors as well. I do not understand the leaving of the stock rears as mixing frequency response has to be an issue, no specs are given on the stock and subsequent replacement units either, let alone how they're matched. All important in my opinion. I'm sure just with the signal processing the sound stage is 100% improved but still mystified as to the lack of adjustability. I really want to do this and upgrade my audio, I'm just not sold on the magic of allowing it all to be preconfigured and leaving no user input. All of my vehicles have had upgraded audio, all done by me, and all have that tweaking which allows for the perfect sound stage for "my" ears! Including spacial positioning... as we all don't sit in the same spot! Not critical as I've not installed this, of course, just questioning the overall completeness of it. I may very well take the risk and partake the system, invest in letting go control and giving it a try. But my experience makes me feel that I won't be happy without that control. |
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