08-08-2019, 10:51 PM | #67 |
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Then I'm guessing you've never owned a manual Honda/Acura.
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2017 M240i/ ZF8 Pure Drivetrain Solutions Stage 1 & torque converter/xHP/ DAW Ultra Flow/ DS2/ Nostrum injectors/ E40 Doug Newton tuned/ ER DP/ Remus axle back/ BMS intake/ FTP CP/ M Perf LSD
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08-09-2019, 06:49 AM | #68 |
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Or a Datsun 710.
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2017 M240i: 25.9K, 28.9 mpg, MT, Sunroof Delete, 3,432#, EB, Leather, Driving Assistance Package, Heated Front Seats | Sold: E12 530i, E24 M635CSi, E39 520i, E30 325is, E36 M3 (2)
TC Kline Coilovers; H&R Front Bar; Wavetrac; Al Subframe Bushings; 18X9/9½ ARC-8s; 255/35-18 PS4S (4); Dinan Elite V2 & CAI; MPerf Orange BBK; Schroth Quick Fit Pro; Full PPF |
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08-09-2019, 03:20 PM | #69 |
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Many don't realise the difference in gearing between the 8AT and 6MT.
The 6Mt drives like a NA V8 car in terms of powerband. On track, or around town, you are shifting MUCH less than the 8AT, with the MT. For example: In my area, it's mainly single lane roads, and 60km/h in town (max, mostly 50km/h). This is basically a quick 1st gear pull, if anything, around town. 2nd gear in the 6MT goes a bit over 120km/h, so that's impound speeds, already. I can pass anyone on the 80km/h highways in 3rd gear, never have to power into 4th as 3rd easily gets you up to 180km/h, which is over double to average posted speed, so never needed. My point is, is that the 6MT can be much more enjoyable to drive, even if you're doing all of the work. On track, sometimes I only have one section where I get into 4th, so it's 2-3-2-3-2-3-4-3-2-3 lol, barely ever have my two hands off of the wheel, almost never have to shift mid turn (if you have the appropriate right apex speed). After a launch, these cars are basically identical in acceleration. The 8AT shifts faster, especially on the 1-4th vs the MT 1-3, but then the MT 3rd gear always catches up to the 8AT car. Have done this several times with other BMW's, and some newer Audi's like the '19 S4. Pull them every time at the top of 3rd, and into 4th. Once you're up there, auto means F all.. It's very easy to jump into an 8AT and say "wow I could never shift this fast, or blip this good", but that wears off quickly, for me. For a DD, I'm 100% pro torque converter auto, for my 2nd part-time car, I enjoy MT or full dual clutch setup.
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08-09-2019, 05:31 PM | #70 |
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^Good points and I agree.
I'd also note that the 6MT is WAY more dependent on you revving out the rpms/gears to get max acceleration. With the auto, you can be a bit lazier with which gear you're in as the gearing is so much deeper, especially 1 through 4. There's more turbo lag with the 6MT and I couldn't perceive much with the auto. This is to be expected given the nature of an auto. On full throttle shifts and in Sport+/DSC Off modes, the turbo lag in the 6MT is significantly reduced, but still way more present than the auto. When I test drove the M235 8AT and going full throttle in Sport+ and letting the car shift itself, it felt almost CVT-like in that the gearing was so tight and the shifts basically seamless. You can hear the shifts, but the shift shock is very minimal. In manual mode though, there's a lot more shift shock which I prefer, but it felt slower doing it that way and some shifts seemed excessively hard.
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08-10-2019, 04:10 PM | #71 |
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soooo I get the experience part (I want a manual) but wouldn't an auto with RWD and add LSD be the best set up ? On street and track ?
I'm finding some amazing deals on used 17-18's with low mileage, and almost 20% off for a new 19, all AT. Tough deciding between that and manual RWD w/o LSD. Daily driver (mostly, have older vert 330 I'll drive some too). So many mixed reviews on LSD or no. |
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08-10-2019, 04:52 PM | #72 | |
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08-10-2019, 05:06 PM | #73 |
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Quick update:
I picked up the car on Friday (8/9) and currently driving it back home to NJ today (8/10). I will take better pics later after I do all my cosmetic modifications, but here's the new baby! I'm not a fan of white cars, but the mineral white looks too perfect on this car P.S. I'll be adding the M-performance LSD sometime next week.
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08-10-2019, 05:21 PM | #74 | |
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I want to order a more basic MT 240, and add LSD. I know myself, I'll being heading to Summit Point for BMW weekends |
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08-10-2019, 07:23 PM | #76 | |
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08-10-2019, 08:11 PM | #77 | ||
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08-10-2019, 10:28 PM | #78 | |
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You could peer into the front wheel wells and look at the springs. The stock springs are black and most aftermarket springs are red, blue, yellow, or silver. |
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08-11-2019, 02:38 PM | #79 | ||
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08-12-2019, 12:04 AM | #80 |
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Guys, a low HP/low torque Japanese sports car like the Miata or S2000 and a high torque machine like the M240i are completely different animals with totally different sets of engineering challenges/goals. I personally think the shift quality of the M240i is as good as it gets and as good as I need it to be for trouble-free, reliable, and enjoyable row-your-own fun. I've driven the S2000 and the latest Miata. They have great shift actions, but feel more delicate and "toy-like" in nature. The M240i feels "clunkier" for lack of a better description, but it's superbly accurate and reliable. Again, I think it's the only MT car I've driven where I have never experienced a mis-shift or crunched a 2nd gear. I'll take it all day over smoother feeling, but less reliable and less consistent gear boxes.
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09-29-2019, 04:25 AM | #81 | |
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10-01-2019, 06:11 AM | #82 |
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10-09-2019, 07:31 PM | #83 |
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6MT RWD allllll day long. I live in St. John's Newfoundland Canada. Notorious for bad weather. With the proper rubber it's no problem. In regards to learning on the car, you'll beat it for a few days by the end of the week you'll be fine. Change the trans oil after if you're that concerned. My first car that I had from 5km on the odo, although not a BMW, bought brand new, not only did I learn on it, my 2 brothers, 1 friend, and 2 cousins. It went 250000km before the clutch went. Preventative maintenance.
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10-09-2019, 09:24 PM | #84 |
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Ignore all the 6MT haters here. Yes, the 8 speed ZF is amazing. I drove the ZF 240i 3-4x before deciding to pick up the 17 m240i RWD 6 MT last week and let me tell you it is the easiest manual to drive ever. I learnt manual the first night we picked up the car. The car even auto rev matches on downshifts for you. My friend has a manual GT3 and he himself told me he did not expect the 6MT in this car to be this refined and easy to drive.
BTW I live in Calgary, Canada and probably get the most snow out of all ppl in this thread and have had no problems with the previous RWD BMW's I've dailied in the snow. Get good tires and you're set, enjoy!
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10-09-2019, 10:01 PM | #85 |
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Drove the 240i auto and clicked over to Sport+ and "manual" very impressive. Then I drove a 16' 235i MT, and the rest is history.
The most amazing auto and fastest...will NEVER replace switching gears |
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10-10-2019, 12:18 AM | #86 |
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To hop on the supportive bandwagon,
the 6MT in the m240 is literally one of the easiest clutch/shifter combo's I've ever driven, and the added fun-factor that RWD gives lead me to decide that it would be my perfect first car (so I got it!) I have driven many different sports cars in the class (dct and manual), and I long deliberated between getting the auto or 4WD versions (even the soft top), and am very satisfied and relieved that I went with the much more sensible option. I have let 6 different women try their hand at learning/trying manual, and only 1 has actually managed to stall the car (put into a stressful situation), it's almost impossible to stall unless you just let out the clutch with no gas input. It's a sporty car, that feels best when it's being used properly. If you really wanted just the straight line performance, or winter safety of this class of vehicle, I would wholly recommend an RS3 instead. But for (true) drivers like yourself that "just want to enjoy the car and driving experience", then you HAVE to get the 6MT RWD or you'll regret it. |
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10-10-2019, 06:32 AM | #87 |
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So I guess that makes us ZF8 automatic drivers losers at best.
I loved driving my 325 MT for a dozen years and I hope to love driving my current 235x Auto for at least as long. Each is enjoyable in its own way. There is no one best vehicle, even for people who want to enjoy the car and the driving experience. I don't HAVE to do anything! |
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10-16-2019, 01:00 PM | #88 | |
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