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      12-15-2013, 11:44 AM   #1
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Anyone considering Golf R?

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I am. It will depend on what BMW is able to do with the steering. Manual transmission semi-practical coupes seem to be in short supply these days. In fact, I think the rear of the two is ugly enough to move me closer to the R. AWD with the ability to direct 100% of the power to the rear wheels seems like an awesome combo.
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      12-15-2013, 12:17 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rupes
I am. It will depend on what BMW is able to do with the steering. Manual transmission semi-practical coupes seem to be in short supply these days. In fact, I think the rear of the two is ugly enough to move me closer to the R. AWD with the ability to direct 100% of the power to the rear wheels seems like an awesome combo.
VW has always dropped the ball IMO on the golf R in the US. It's a fantastic car but they always bring it into the market too late. They need to release it in the US at the same time that they do in Europe. By the time it always arrives in the US it's old tech and has become overpriced
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      12-15-2013, 12:26 PM   #3
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Kinda like the 1 or 2 series being about four or five years behind when they're released here?
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      12-15-2013, 12:39 PM   #4
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Definitely interested, like the smaller size. From what I have read on VWVortex it's likely there will be only a year delay in the R's release in NA this time and it's coming out in Europe early next year. Should be around 10k less than a well-equipped M235i in Canada, in the ballpark of a 228i with the sport package, but with a much better power/weight ratio. Not clear if a manual will be offered in NA yet - may be DCT only.
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      12-15-2013, 05:35 PM   #5
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If they offer an automatic version in the states this time, I'm definitely interested. Otherwise, I'll take a pass in favor of 228 or 2015 Mustang.
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      12-15-2013, 06:25 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devon K
Definitely interested, like the smaller size. From what I have read on VWVortex it's likely there will be only a year delay in the R's release in NA this time and it's coming out in Europe early next year. Should be around 10k less than a well-equipped M235i in Canada, in the ballpark of a 228i with the sport package, but with a much better power/weight ratio. Not clear if a manual will be offered in NA yet - may be DCT only.
The MK6 R was only available in the states as a 6 SPD. I would be shocked if they didn't at least offer it this time. My understanding was both would be offered, but the A3/S3 would be auto only.
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      12-15-2013, 07:01 PM   #7
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I'd consider it for price only.

In Australia a Golf R is $55k, A45, $75k and M235i $82k.

Styling isn't too bad but I'd pick the completely barking mad A45 if I wasn't keen on buying a bimmer.
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      12-15-2013, 08:57 PM   #8
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If you're a BMW/RWD or rear biased AWD lover, you'll probably be disappointed with the R. I was. I had one for a year (a '12) and loved it around town but on the track (Watkins Glen) it just didn't compare. At the end of the day it was a front-drive biased car and despite Haldex tweeks, it remained a front-drive biased car. Careful how you interpret "100% transfer to the rear" under certain conditions. In reality it's a 50/50 split but it still felt like FWD. The new one might be better but the new chassis on which it's based and VW's 4Motion (Haldex) can only do so much. Long story short.....you'll not be able to appreciate the difference unless you track your car so if the track isn't on your list of fun stuff to do, you'll like it just fine.
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      12-16-2013, 12:35 AM   #9
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Scirocco R would be great, but that isn't happening.
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      12-16-2013, 10:20 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark's M View Post
If you're a BMW/RWD or rear biased AWD lover, you'll probably be disappointed with the R. I was. I had one for a year (a '12) and loved it around town but on the track (Watkins Glen) it just didn't compare. At the end of the day it was a front-drive biased car and despite Haldex tweeks, it remained a front-drive biased car. Careful how you interpret "100% transfer to the rear" under certain conditions. In reality it's a 50/50 split but it still felt like FWD.
There is no way of knowing at this point if any of these characteristics are going to carry over to the new model, it's a new Haldex design, and it's the first to allow 100% RWD. AWD does not seem to function too badly on track in the GTR, the Gallardo, the Evo, or the Audi R10 so there is some chance it'll be fine. Here's hoping it is as big an advance over the old model as the new GTI is over the Mk6.
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      12-16-2013, 10:36 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devon K View Post
There is no way of knowing at this point if any of these characteristics are going to carry over to the new model, it's a new Haldex design, and it's the first to allow 100% RWD. AWD does not seem to function too badly on track in the GTR, the Gallardo, the Evo, or the Audi R10 so there is some chance it'll be fine. Here's hoping it is as big an advance over the old model as the new GTI is over the Mk6.
All of those cars are using a full time awd system with electronically limited slip differentials too. While the Mk6 R I drove was much closer to neutral than the Mk4 R32, it still was clearly a fwd car that had the ability to send up to 90% of the power to the back once slip was detected. The rear drive shafts on the R are about as big as a wood pencil, I can't imagine they intended them to be receiving much power for significant periods of time. Maybe the 7 will be hugely different, but it's not like Audi/VW is really known for oversteering monsters, Gallardo in R8 clothes aside.
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      12-16-2013, 02:05 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rupes View Post
I am. It will depend on what BMW is able to do with the steering. Manual transmission semi-practical coupes seem to be in short supply these days. In fact, I think the rear of the two is ugly enough to move me closer to the R. AWD with the ability to direct 100% of the power to the rear wheels seems like an awesome combo.
I am for sure. I have been since I first heard about it. Just can't wait till it's here. The 228i just doesn't compare IMO, especially with adding all the MSport options; taking the car to around $40k, which is what the Golf R will be around. However, the Golf R's performance is going to surpass the 228i. It's putting up M235i numbers along with a better transmission (DCT) than both 2 series cars (ZF 8). If the M235i came with a DCT, I would more than likely lean more to it.

For those complaining about the Golf R's current AWD system, this upcoming Golf R is not going to use the same. It's definitely getting upgraded. Here is the best info I've found about it:
http://www.vwvortex.com/news/volkswa...d-information/
OP if you haven't already, you should check out this article.

It's Golf R or M2 for me. Obviously M2 would be my choice and the better option, but we have to wait and see what price tag BMW puts on it. Hoping I would be able to get one for no more than $50k out the door (not talking MSRP).
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      12-16-2013, 02:07 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer4life24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rupes View Post
I am. It will depend on what BMW is able to do with the steering. Manual transmission semi-practical coupes seem to be in short supply these days. In fact, I think the rear of the two is ugly enough to move me closer to the R. AWD with the ability to direct 100% of the power to the rear wheels seems like an awesome combo.
I am for sure. I have been since I first heard about it. Just can't wait till it's here. The 228i just doesn't compare IMO, especially with adding all the MSport options; taking the car to around $40k, which is what the Golf R will be around. However, the Golf R's performance is going to surpass the 228i. It's putting up M235i numbers along with a better transmission (DCT) than both 2 series cars (ZF 8). If the M235i came with a DCT, I would more than likely lean more to it.

For those complaining about the Golf R's current AWD system, this upcoming Golf R is not going to use the same. It's definitely getting upgraded. Here is the best info I've found about it:
http://www.vwvortex.com/news/volkswa...d-information/
OP if you haven't already, you should check out this article.

It's Golf R or M2 for me. Obviously M2 would be my choice and the better option, but we have to wait and see what price tag BMW puts on it. Hoping I would be able to get one for no more than $50k out the door (not talking MSRP).
M2 and Golf R will be no comparison I'm sure.

Expect to pay mid $50k for a base M2. That's just me assuming. We shall see in a few years.
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      12-16-2013, 04:21 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmer4life24 View Post
I am for sure. I have been since I first heard about it. Just can't wait till it's here. The 228i just doesn't compare IMO, especially with adding all the MSport options; taking the car to around $40k, which is what the Golf R will be around. However, the Golf R's performance is going to surpass the 228i. It's putting up M235i numbers along with a better transmission (DCT) than both 2 series cars (ZF 8). If the M235i came with a DCT, I would more than likely lean more to it.

For those complaining about the Golf R's current AWD system, this upcoming Golf R is not going to use the same. It's definitely getting upgraded. Here is the best info I've found about it:
http://www.vwvortex.com/news/volkswa...d-information/
OP if you haven't already, you should check out this article.

It's Golf R or M2 for me. Obviously M2 would be my choice and the better option, but we have to wait and see what price tag BMW puts on it. Hoping I would be able to get one for no more than $50k out the door (not talking MSRP).
Great read, I hadn't seen that before, and didn't want the article to end!
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      12-16-2013, 04:36 PM   #15
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I am now.
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      12-16-2013, 07:46 PM   #16
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Forget about golf R, how about the performance packed mk7 GTI?

It's getting RAVE reviews and goes on sale this spring In the US.

Man, I just might do a four door GTI to save some coin. We shall see.
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      12-16-2013, 08:56 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jzcrna
Forget about golf R, how about the performance packed mk7 GTI?

It's getting RAVE reviews and goes on sale this spring In the US.

Man, I just might do a four door GTI to save some coin. We shall see.
We're discussing the Mk7 R, based on the new GTI but with 290hp and awd.
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      12-16-2013, 08:57 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jzcrna
Forget about golf R, how about the performance packed mk7 GTI?

It's getting RAVE reviews and goes on sale this spring In the US.

Man, I just might do a four door GTI to save some coin. We shall see.
But FWD. No thanks. The R is worth the extra wait IMO.
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      12-16-2013, 10:58 PM   #19
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How reliable are VWs now?

My first car was a golf gti but that was like 17 years ago. 5speed and it was a blast to drive. Alot of xxx happen in the backseat lol. My dad had a jetta and that was a POS.

It was such pain to change the oil filters...are they still like that?
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      12-16-2013, 11:47 PM   #20
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Unless VW changes the new R significantly from the MkVI, the M235i will be the more enjoyable and higher performance car. The biggest downfall with the current R is inability to turn off traction control. They gotta fix that and make it 60/40 RWD bias. Do that with the increase in power and it will be awesome.

The new MkVII GTI with performance pack is going to kick ass as well but won't have the power:weight ratio that most of us are used to. When my wife's X1 lease is up I'm pretty sure she'll get a PPack GTI with DSG. It's supposed to be a revelation in performance FWD driving dynamics.
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      12-17-2013, 01:32 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Transfer View Post
Unless VW changes the new R significantly from the MkVI, the M235i will be the more enjoyable and higher performance car. The biggest downfall with the current R is inability to turn off traction control. They gotta fix that and make it 60/40 RWD bias. Do that with the increase in power and it will be awesome.

The new MkVII GTI with performance pack is going to kick ass as well but won't have the power:weight ratio that most of us are used to. When my wife's X1 lease is up I'm pretty sure she'll get a PPack GTI with DSG. It's supposed to be a revelation in performance FWD driving dynamics.
MK7 R will have 3 options of traction control: ESC (standard), ESC Sport (one touch button), and ESC Off (holding the button). So yes you will be able to turn traction off.

Still waiting on word about the haldex ratio. 60/40 RWD bias does sound pretty fun for it though.
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      12-17-2013, 10:23 AM   #22
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Guys, this is what I mean regarding the "100%" power to the rear wheels capability not being what it seems to imply. Post 84 (quoted below) is from the Haldex Comp. Controller thread in VW Vortex. The reply (in red) is from HPA Motorsports who make the Haldex controller. The Haldex on the incoming 2015 R may be different but it'd be a huge undertaking to engineer a "true" 100% on-demand bias to the rear.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...ler-for-Golf-R

Quote Originally Posted by j.a.R.:

So, vw claims about the golf R awd, "This highly evolved four-wheel-drive system is always engaged. Sensors detect which tires have more traction, and automatically send extra power to those tires.The system is able to direct nearly 100 percent of available torque to the rear wheels for optimal traction on more challenging surfaces. " (pulled directly from vw sales website.) First, is this true? Second , does your controller still allow my golf R to become almost 100% rear wheel drive or is always 50/50?


100 percent of available torque = 50:50 as there is a mechanical relationship through the front Diff. the rate at which the all wheel drive is engaged is now immediate with our controller instead of gradual.
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