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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum BMW 2 Series (F22) Forum BMW 2 Series Coupe and Cabriolet (F22/F23) General Forum Does opting for the 6-Speed manual effect 2-Series value?

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      10-09-2014, 06:30 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BradF View Post
Nothing against the 2, but I've decided I really want a 128i, 6MT, Sport Package. I've been looking for three months now. There are plenty of private seller and CPO 128i's around - virtually all are autos.

I went to a dealer last weekend that just hours earlier had posted a CPO with a manual (and sport) on their website. When I arrived the car was on a test drive, and two others were waiting to see it. It sold instantly, and the SA told me that they could sell that car at least 10 times over, and that they very often get calls requesting E82's with 6MT, and (oddly) more requests for the 128 than the 135.

An acquaintance works at a bay area dealership, and when asked if they would keep an eye out for a 128i 6MT as a lease return to be CPO'ed, he said, "get in line". What are my chances of finding one? He replied, "go rub a lamp"..."or maybe find a private party seller on the internet".

There is exactly one 128i coupe 6MT on eBay as I write this (and just a few more 135’s), and an Auto Trader search will find more – but low mileage newer 6MT cars (if available) are asking prices that seem to push the bounds of reason. Do a national search on BMW's CPO car locater, and you'll find just 3 CPO 128i 6MT's and only 1 with sport. M Sport? Forget it. But, there are hundreds with the Steptronic.

Does the 6MT mean higher value? On some of the performance models it likely will. As some have pointed out, on other more luxury-oriented models it will probably be a detriment. My neighbor still has his very nice, low mileage E53 X5 with the very rare MT - he's tried a few times to sell it, but as someone once said, "it's the nicest horse in the glue factory". So, he's decided to keep it forever.

I had an '08 328i, 6MT with Sport that took forever to get rid of because 95% of the potential buyers couldn't drive a stick and/or HAD to have an auto which is why I thought that finding a 128i 6MT would be simple and cheap. As it happens, I'm wrong. E82 with a 6MT is a very sought after combination to begin with, and there were probably far fewer configured that way than with the Steptronic- making the search that much more difficult.

I can appreciate BMW's smaller engine / turbocharging strategy (albeit reluctantly) and my long term hope is that they will continue to offer the MT in as many models as possible well into the future, but the list of automakers no longer offering the MT is growing, leaving me fearful that BMW isn't far behind. Enjoy them while you can.
That's a great choice...I had a 135i and it wasn't so reliable. My brother has a 128i sport 6mt that's had basically no issues in 100k miles..other than him treating it like crap.

I searched around for an 09 128i stick a little while back because I liked the idea of having a cheap, reliable fun car but there aren't any
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      10-10-2014, 05:34 PM   #24
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There are two key things to consider:
  1. How much will you get for your car?
  2. How much time and effort will it take to find a buyer?

Resale Value

According to KBB, the resale value of an '09 128i Sport w/ 60K miles is $14,132 whether you select automatic or manual. So, at least for Southern California, you shouldn't expect much difference in what you get for the car if you sell it in about five years. Of course, there's always the possibility that you find a buyer who is particularly desperate for a manual and yours is the only one around, but I wouldn't count on it.

Time/Effort To Sell

For almost all cars, manuals will have both lower supply and lower demand (i.e., fewer cars available and fewer buyers looking for them). This means that the chance of a prospective buyer being geographically close to you are smaller if you're trying to sell a manual. So, despite some of the anecdotes of manuals flying off a dealer's lot, it's pretty hard to predict how long it will take you to sell your car. If you live in a less populated area, you will probably have to cast your net wider and wait longer. If you live in a dense urban area with lots of enthusiasts, you may have an easier time.

Of course, if you go the trade-in route, you will almost certainly get less for the car, but you will also not have to work as hard (unless the dealer simply doesn't want your car--which may happen if it's significantly older that five years).
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      10-10-2014, 06:03 PM   #25
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It's all about having fun with your car. If you enjoy a manual... a manual it should be.
I wouldn't worry too much about resale value.

I was told by dealers the same thing... a manual isn't worth much today. However, if you find a bimmer person - they will buy a manual. I got an extra $1000 for having a manual vs automatic by finding my old E46 a good home and someone who appreciates a manual.
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      10-10-2014, 07:50 PM   #26
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BMW have an app they use, they put in your car vin and mileage and it gives them a price BMW will pay
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      10-10-2014, 08:10 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by danimal View Post
For almost all cars, manuals will have both lower supply and lower demand (i.e., fewer cars available and fewer buyers looking for them). This means that the chance of a prospective buyer being geographically close to you are smaller if you're trying to sell a manual.
Indeed.

At one time all cars were manual. Now something like only 9% of new cars are manual. Fundamentally, most folks don't want them and the data supports that.

Sadly, as more folks try to text and drive or enjoy a cup of Starbucks while driving, I expect this sliding trend to continue. Kinda tricky to answer a cell call while your heel/toe-ing between 4th and 2nd in a corner.

You have to remember the little world we have here is very skewed and is filled with rabid drivers. These are blokes who give up creature comforts like air condoning vents for oil temp and turbo boost gauges. :thump:
In short…this list is NOT your typical BMW shopper, but rather a small, enthusiastic subset of them.

Will you have less potential buyers of a MT when you're ready to sell? Of course…the numbers above support that. BUT, the MT buyers will be more maniacal about having that MT. You shouldn't have too hard of a time to locate a banshee that likes rowing gears when you want to sell. Plus the MT on the 2 comes with pretty good accolades so far.

Me…I prefer an AT due to a bad left knee and hideous LA traffic. Plus my AT shifts like heaven with the paddles and is faster and gets better MPG.

What should you do?

Get the one that you enjoy driving the most!

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      10-10-2014, 09:14 PM   #28
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If there was a big difference then it would be reflected in residual value when they lease these. As it is it's the same % whether it's a manual or auto so don't sweat it.
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      10-11-2014, 05:31 AM   #29
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Buy what you like and drive the machine. IF you are thinking resale before you buy or order-- Get something else or keep what you have. Production line cars depreciate. Some more than others.

I buy to drive and enjoy. I will deal with the resale later on. Its not even a consideration to begin with. Especially buying new as the depreciation is so large its not a worry. It just is...so to speak.
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      10-11-2014, 05:45 AM   #30
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I find it strange individuals think about getting rid of there new pride and joy before even buying it!! . IMHO going with your heart is always more pleasurable than head, and that would be life in general

Last edited by worktolivelife; 10-11-2014 at 05:58 AM..
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      10-11-2014, 09:10 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worktolivelife View Post
I find it strange individuals think about getting rid of there new pride and joy before even buying it!! . IMHO going with your heart is always more pleasurable than head, and that would be life in general
And the 2 series absolutely falls more in the passion car camp..

OP - get what the hell will make you happiest and enjoy the snot out of it..

Let that be your guide
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      10-11-2014, 03:03 PM   #32
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There's no way in hell I'd trade the last five years of 6MT driving bliss for five years of driving the car as an automatic just for a higher resale value. Fact is though that 6MT is cheaper to maintain long term and given the rarity of this type and package of car now it only makes sense to keep it for the long term which even further reinforces my transmission choice (who cares about resale value if you own the car 10 years?). If I suddenly want an automatic I'll buy a used Honda and drive it as a beater while the 1er rests in the garage waiting for non-commuting fun.
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      10-12-2014, 07:31 PM   #33
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I think the 6MT will make the car more valuable. This is an enthusiasts car. Compare E36, E46, and E90s with MT vs. Auto. Since enthusiasts tend to buy used, MT is worth more.
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      10-12-2014, 07:41 PM   #34
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I haven't read the thread, I could be repeating others'. If choosing the Sports Auto diminishes your enjoyment of the car during your ownership period, I doubt if the actual difference in resale value at end of ownership would make up for it. Config the car you want to own and drive, not the one the next buyer wants to buy and drive.
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      10-13-2014, 11:49 AM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaffa12 View Post
I haven't read the thread, I could be repeating others'. If choosing the Sports Auto diminishes your enjoyment of the car during your ownership period, I doubt if the actual difference in resale value at end of ownership would make up for it. Config the car you want to own and drive, not the one the next buyer wants to buy and drive.
+1 who cares about the 'next' driver lol!
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      10-13-2014, 12:15 PM   #36
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1) get what you want, you only live once, yadda yadda

2) in the used M3 market, manuals get $3k-$5k more than their auto counterparts. Indeed, look at Enthusiast Auto, they don't even take automatics, and they sell their cars for really high prices.
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      10-14-2014, 09:03 AM   #37
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It depends on when you try to sell your car. If you try to sell it in the next couple of years, your target buyer may be a rich housewife who is looking for a fun car to drive to the country club. Hence, she will want an automatic most likely. If you wait 6-10 years to sell it privately, your target buyer will probably be a driving enthusiast who will only consider buying a manual. When I look at older BMWs or Porsches, a manual is a requirement. Then again, I wouldn't buy an automatic transmission BMW ever again. Made that mistake once and never again. If BMW stops offering manual transmissions, I will leave the brand.
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      10-22-2014, 01:47 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scrape1 View Post
I think it would very much depend on whether you find the right buyer. The audience for MT cars is indeed lower, but if somebody is looking specifically for an MT M Sport configured car, they may very well be willing to pay a premium because these cars are going to be tough to find with fewer of them being built. So patience is going to be key. My guess is trade in value for MT will be lower, though.


Good point. Thats what i would say. Trade in would be waaay less than private sale. You will probably be able to find a guy looking for a used MT in good shape. Buy it for YOU.
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      10-22-2014, 02:39 PM   #39
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Not at all.
But it might Affect it.
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      10-22-2014, 02:59 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavpilot2k View Post
Not at all.
But it might Affect it.
I was going to give you a major for knowing the difference, but then I saw the improper use of capitalization. So, only and a
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      10-22-2014, 03:10 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
I was going to give you a major for knowing the difference, but then I saw the improper use of capitalization. So, only and a
Touché.
Although the cap was for emphasis (which was probably unnecessary after I underlined it).
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      10-22-2014, 04:57 PM   #42
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I think the answer is in how the total car is built. If you have the heated everything and all the bells and whistles, a manual may not help. But if you build a "performance build". A auto hurts!

I ordered my M235 not only with manual but sans sunroof!!! Look at how rare slick top e36 or e46 card are and you will understand.

I also agree with the poster that said to look at E30 thru e46 cars. You can hardly give away an auto in those cars! Heck even SMG is a kiss of death to re-sale.

Go manual and enjoy!

(This from a guy that paid extra for a beautiful MANUAL performance built 08 328 touring, so take it with a grain of salt!$
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      10-22-2014, 06:03 PM   #43
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I agree with the others who have stated a manual might be easier to sell and you may even get more for it. I have sold a number of cars privately and the buyers always tell me that they were really interested in my car due to the manual. Of course once they come to see it, the low mileage and condition probably helped them decide. I recently sold my C6 Corvette, and most of those cars are autos and the buyers tend to fit the automatic demographic. It took me two days and I got within a few hundred of my asking price. The hardest time I ever hard selling a car was an automatic Toyota Corolla that I used as a winter car one season in MA. The reason was it was in just average condition. While there are a lot of buyers for Toyotas, there are also always a lot for sale, so there is a lot of competition. A low production manual in a sea of automatics is one way to stand out.
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      10-24-2014, 01:02 AM   #44
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Coming from a track instructor, I believe the track enthusiast (people who will pay asking price) desire for a f22 2 series after production ends will be in the following order:

M2 manual
M2 DCT
228i track package manual
M235i manual
M235i auto
M235xi auto
M235xi manual
228i track auto
228xi auto
And the least desirable f22 will of course be a standard 228i auto.

There will be lots of m235is and few 228i track manuals, which are just as fast with a $500 tune but weigh less, and are therefor more fun around corners. The m235xi auto is the fastest f22 around a track until M2 comes - but it's a bit boring.
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