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      05-01-2014, 08:40 AM   #287
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The engine of Alpina B4 is based on the N55 one too. What's not good with it?
Curious to see if the next RS3 will be on par with Golf R400 as the S3 is with Golf R. A lot of great models in the near future
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      05-01-2014, 09:00 AM   #288
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The new engine for M2 will be a real gem. It is different from the N55 as we know it currently and similar to S55 in certain respects. Best of both worlds.
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      05-01-2014, 09:01 AM   #289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by riM3
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3
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Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
It won't cannibalize the M3/M4 because by the time it arrives on the market.

Both will be around two years old and heading for the next progressive step.
This is an important piece of information.
Comp pack?
This means they don't have time and personnel to tune S engine due to X9 and 9 series but yet they want to capture sales. Once those two models are developed the M2 LCI will get S engine and other tweaks. This is the one I am waiting for. My guess only. This is what happens when you have gazillion models.
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      05-01-2014, 09:22 AM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3
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Originally Posted by nachob View Post
Single turbo models have better throttle response.
Where did you get that from ?
bigger turbos have more lag. two smaller ones would have better response right?
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      05-01-2014, 09:29 AM   #291
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They really need to put a detuned S55 instead of a N55. the N55 blows after 360. I would worrie about reliability. Even tunners are are replacing the cranks rods and pistons on the M235i just to get 400 +. If Bmw puts the N55 into the M2 it will be the worst m car ever. The m2 also needs a serious diet, it can't weigh as much as the m235.
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      05-01-2014, 09:38 AM   #292
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Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
The S55 used the N55 as a a starting point. It has a new block, oil pan, crank shaft, rods, pistons, head, turbos, intercooler, etc... There is not much left in common with the N55 except the bore, stroke and cylinder spacing.
pretty much what i was pointing out!
thank you
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      05-01-2014, 09:58 AM   #293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
bigger turbos have more lag. two smaller ones would have better response right?
Usually, yes, it takes less exhaust to spool them up quicker. Downside, is less final boost. That is why they use two small ones on N54.

Also, someone asked where did I get that. Car and Driver tested N54 and N55 side by side and they found quicker throttle response. My butt meter confirms it. I jumped from my 2011 1M to friend's 2011 335i and throttle response quicker. I think CD article was around 2010. The single turbo uses two exhaust scrolls instead of 1 like older turbo so you have a smaller exhaust pass-through which maintains exhaust velocity. Older turbos had all 4,6,or 8 cylinders feeding a single exhaust scroll. That is why the call the BMW turbos Twin-Turbo. It's a single turbo with twin scrolls power the compression impeller. Great idea.
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      05-01-2014, 10:49 AM   #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nachob
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
bigger turbos have more lag. two smaller ones would have better response right?
Usually, yes, it takes less exhaust to spool them up quicker. Downside, is less final boost. That is why they use two small ones on N54.

Also, someone asked where did I get that. Car and Driver tested N54 and N55 side by side and they found quicker throttle response. My butt meter confirms it. I jumped from my 2011 1M to friend's 2011 335i and throttle response quicker. I think CD article was around 2010. The single turbo uses two exhaust scrolls instead of 1 like older turbo so you have a smaller exhaust pass-through which maintains exhaust velocity. Older turbos had all 4,6,or 8 cylinders feeding a single exhaust scroll. That is why the call the BMW turbos Twin-Turbo. It's a single turbo with twin scrolls power the compression impeller. Great idea.
if a 335i has good response, the 1m coupe i would have to say suffers from some shitty turbo lag. i always thought this wasnt the case. this is why i love the m3 and its awesome engine. hope the new m2/3/4 have addressed this.
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      05-01-2014, 10:55 AM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
if a 335i has good response, the 1m coupe i would have to say suffers from some shitty turbo lag. i always thought this wasnt the case. this is why i love the m3 and its awesome engine. hope the new m2/3/4 have addressed this.
I wouldn't call it shitty. I have driven those type of turbo lag cars. The 1M is actually pretty good BUT the throttle response is slightly quicker on the N55. The two turbo setup lets them get more power easily because you have small turbos for only three cylinders. The single turbo has to feed all six so there is the potential that if they increase the size to make more boost, it also will have more lag. Personally, I prefer NA motors and would give up a few horsepower for quicker more linear throttle response but most people just want the big number. With all that said, the 1M is such a bitchin' car that you can easily overlook a little bit of lag.


Automobile Magazine Comparison

Page 2 Quote: "On the street, after driving N54 and N55 cars back to back, it's definitely safe to say that the N55 suffers from even less turbo lag than the N54 did. And that engine set the benchmark."



http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews...5is_dyno_test/

Last edited by nachob; 05-01-2014 at 11:09 AM..
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      05-01-2014, 10:58 AM   #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j23a45m View Post
You do know that the new m3/4 is using pretty much a N55 just with 2 turbo's right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by j23a45m View Post
pretty much what i was pointing out!
thank you
Not really.

You said that the S55 is an N55 with two turbos. It is not.

Last edited by CanAutM3; 05-01-2014 at 03:12 PM..
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      05-01-2014, 11:02 AM   #297
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Originally Posted by riM3 View Post
Comp pack?
Comp pack or some sort of engine LCI as we saw on the E36 M3 (3.0L -> 3.2L).

Last edited by CanAutM3; 05-01-2014 at 03:15 PM..
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      05-01-2014, 11:03 AM   #298
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowSaloonM3 View Post
bigger turbos have more lag. two smaller ones would have better response right?
That is my understanding too.
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      05-01-2014, 11:09 AM   #299
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Everyone's talking about increasing the power, and throwing a tune on it. I really couldn't care less to be honest. I'm perfectly happy with an N55 (and we don't even know what upgrades or what they'll do with cooling system).

Orange/Cloth/6MT
LED headlights if available during LCI
Comp Pack if it becomes available.

That's it.

The key word here is make it as light as possible. With 380hp, I'm more than happy with that. Would be the perfect companion for my E92 M3. It really is time to start saving up.
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      05-01-2014, 12:01 PM   #300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by W/// View Post
Everyone's talking about increasing the power, and throwing a tune on it. I really couldn't care less to be honest. I'm perfectly happy with an N55 (and we don't even know what upgrades or what they'll do with cooling system).

Orange/Cloth/6MT
LED headlights if available during LCI
Comp Pack if it becomes available.

That's it.

The key word here is make it as light as possible. With 380hp, I'm more than happy with that. Would be the perfect companion for my E92 M3. It really is time to start saving up.
+1
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      05-01-2014, 12:04 PM   #301
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MEH. the 1M is a waaaay more desirable car than the M3 of that time.......proof that tradition does not equate to the final product.

tradition only matters if you're stuck in the past...
on what facts are you basing the argument that its more desirable?
cuz I cant think of any
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      05-01-2014, 12:08 PM   #302
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Originally Posted by Blipit_ View Post
Not so sure of that.

The 1M doesn't suffer from boxster-itis.
the 1m was a stop gap model rushed to production, produced in small numbers to generate some hype for this model
so it was never a threat to the m3

this one will sell in larger numbers, so I think it is a bit of a threat
especially that they basically use the same engine
yeah I know s55, but s55 is basically an N55
some of us fall for the marketing hype, others don't
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      05-01-2014, 12:33 PM   #303
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Those 1M prices won't be without depreciation any longer I suppose.
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      05-01-2014, 01:12 PM   #304
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CanAutM3 View Post
Comp pack or some sort of engine LCI as we saw on the E46 M3 (3.0L -> 3.2L).
E46 M3 had from the beginning a 3.2 litre engine through the whole cycle of the model. From 343BHP to 360BHP (CSL)


I think you mean E36 M3: E36 came first with 286BHP 3.0 and later on (LCI) the 3.2 litre (SMG1 gearbox) 321BHP (which I back then testdrove as one of the first worldwide in Germany, I was working at a BMW dealership back then))

Cheers
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      05-01-2014, 01:40 PM   #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpinweiss 335i View Post
I'm all for xDrive ///M cars. M2, M3, M4, M5, M6 ... why not! AWD is the future of performance. You can only put down so much power to 2 wheels, before the nannies kick in and kill the party.


As an option of course, not standard. Just like DCT/MT. Not all of us are drifting hooligans.
I don't see the M2 , M3 and M4 receiving xDrive. That is a whole different philosophy and it contrasts with the new direction on lightweight application.

The M5 G80? Well there is two garages one contains the new M5 embodying a new lightweight philosophy with Carbon load bearing structure and body panels.
The other garage has the same car but features the xDrive system and is slightly heavier... It all comes down to choice... Lightweight RWD or XDrive?

You cannot have both... And that will be the choice...RWD or XDrive. And possibly no manual.

It was interesting at Beijing to sit in a customer Q&A with BMW M. And the Chinese requesting the next M5 to be more harder than the current car in both character and design.
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      05-01-2014, 02:11 PM   #306
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
I don't see the M2 , M3 and M4 receiving xDrive. That is a whole different philosophy and it contrasts with the new direction on lightweight application.

The M5 G80? Well there is two garages one contains the new M5 embodying a new lightweight philosophy with Carbon load bearing structure and body panels.
The other garage has the same car but features the xDrive system and is slightly heavier... It all comes down to choice... Lightweight RWD or XDrive?

You cannot have both... And that will be the choice...RWD or XDrive. And possibly no manual.

It was interesting at Beijing to sit in a customer Q&A with BMW M. And the Chinese requesting the next M5 to be more harder than the current car in both character and design.
This is along that lines of what a few of us were guessing a few pages back - Xdrive in the bigger M cars and not available in the smaller ones...makes sense to me, especially if BMW's focus is going to be on weight reduction moving forward.

You can have a helleva car with ~400BHP if it weighs less than previous models...imagine the E92 M3 with the same type BHP numbers, but 3 or 400 pounds lighter...who cares about AWD in such a scenario???
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      05-01-2014, 02:12 PM   #307
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I will find a way to buy this no matter what!
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      05-01-2014, 02:14 PM   #308
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Many great comments. Best news to me is the upgraded N55 6 cylinder and targeted hp. Looking forward to reduced weight, the wide arches, etc!
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