[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

This, all day long. Mine is still looking new 3 summers later, with just basic leather cleaner and occasional "leather conditioner", even though I don't think it does much aside from re-scent the interior (which I don't mind, keeps it smelling 'new')

VLR works really well too and it's only one product to keep. Use it on all interior surfaces on all my cars (all have leather) and they all look great. Pretty cheap too.

[9t2hoo]

What is VLR? You've got me curious. By the way, I've rarely used leather conditioner on my Dakota leather. It doesn't seem to matter.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by 9t2hoo

What is VLR? You've got me curious. By the way, I've rarely used leather conditioner on my Dakota leather. It doesn't seem to matter.

Mothers product - Vinyl Leather Rubber. It's a cleaner / conditioner that's good on basically everything and costs $7-8

[Maynard]

I went with the sensatec because it felt better than the Dakota - much less slippery, and softer. I hated the idea of not getting leather in such a nice car, until I actually compared them; even at the same price I'd stick with the sensatec. Haven't logged many miles sitting on Dakota, but it feels just as hot/sticky (to me), and seems to hold heat worse if it sits in the sun (but supposedly with a UV rejecting layer that keeps it from heating up as much?).

[CAMOETO]

The leather in our cars is not bad at all for a $40k-$50k car. It's better than the Dakota leather in my e84 x1, and the same as the Dakota leather in the F3x 3/4. Yes, Dakota leather is not fancy and not all Dakota leather created equal, but it's not bad at all and much better than the leather offered on cheap American cars, Volkswagen, etc.

Regarding Dakota vs. Sensatec, I had a 228i with Sensatec on a long-term rental, and would definitely NOT pick it over Dakota. It felt miserable on hot days. Sticky, rubbery, and plasticky.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by CAMOETO

The leather in our cars is not bad at all for a $40k-$50k car. It's better than the Dakota leather in my e84 x1, and the same as the Dakota leather in the F3x 3/4. Yes, Dakota leather is not fancy and not all Dakota leather created equal, but it's not bad at all and much better than the leather offered on cheap American cars, Volkswagen, etc.

Regarding Dakota vs. Sensatec, I had a 228i with Sensatec on a long-term rental, and would definitely NOT pick it over Dakota. It felt miserable on hot days. Sticky, rubbery, and plasticky.

The only time I'd opt for sensatec is if you insist on light colored convertible interior. That shit gets dirty fast, so oyster sensatec would be easier to hose down than leather. Otherwise leather FTW.

[Denk]

What really sucks is that the M2 shares the same entry level leather. That car should have the nicer hide.

[9t2hoo]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Mothers product - Vinyl Leather Rubber. It's a cleaner / conditioner that's good on basically everything and costs $7-8

Thanks!

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by Denk

What really sucks is that the M2 shares the same entry level leather. That car should have the nicer hide.

Then the buyers will cry @ the MSRP price point. "You want Nappa? Buy an M3/4", that's what BMW is saying.

I wouldn't mind the option, though, don't get me wrong. It's just where auto makers seem to be going with their "tiered" grades of leather/finishing touches in order to meet the price point of the prospective buyer(s), within its respective class. We simply won't see Nappa in sub $40k cars, unless you buy a Hyundai/Kia? Not sure..

VW/Audi do this same thing from one chassis/trim level to the other, it's really frustrating when trying to buy the "perfect" $40-50k compact sports luxury car.. Eg: I want a sporty compact "luxury" Audi with Nappa leather. Oh look, that A3 is nice, no Nappa... Wait the S3 is even better, still no Nappa. Ohh low and behold the $70k Nappa equipped RS3 sedan, NOW we can finally settle? No shot, it's no longer appealing at the price point..

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Then the buyers will cry @ the MSRP price point. "You want Nappa? Buy an M3/4", that's what BMW is saying.

I was thinking the same thing. It's not a bespoke car, it's a mass market vehicle. Find something that's a better all-around package south of $60K (in the case of the M2) and buy it. Hell, buy 2.

Speaking as an M235 owner (on my second one with a deposit down on a 3rd if they bring the GC) if BMW is going to pinch some pennies I am perfectly fine if it's cosmetic stuff vs mechanical. If they did everything we all bitched about - better leather, HK stereo that isn't shit, etc. etc. the car would cost $75K and we'd all be bitching about not liking our $50K S3s which we would be forced to get instead to stay within budget.

Don't get me wrong I love my M235, but I love it a lot more at $50K than I would at $75K.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Don't get me wrong I love my M235, but I love it a lot more at $50K than I would at $75K.

Exactly

Valid reason for a fellow F87 owner to be a bit cheesed, I mean at a "measly" $80k (cdn) that is..

[B58togo]

Originally Posted by Denk

What really sucks is that the M2 shares the same entry level leather. That car should have the nicer hide.

Well if you say it should, then it probably should. There will have to be a trade off though, to keep the price the same. Should BMW marketing add Nappa leather and skip the LSD? Or how about add Nappa and skip the M3/4 brakes and suspension bits; just sell it with 240i suspension. Then there's those fancy 19" forged alloys. Maybe they should go......

[Denk]

Originally Posted by B58togo

Well if you say it should, then it probably should. There will have to be a trade off though, to keep the price the same. Should BMW marketing add Nappa leather and skip the LSD? Or how about add Nappa and skip the M3/4 brakes and suspension bits; just sell it with 240i suspension. Then there's those fancy 19" forged alloys. Maybe they should go......

You forgot the CF roof.

[BEM-S4]

All things considered, for each car in the 2 lineup 230/240/M2 I think they got it right. Personally if they gave me a BOM target and said what would you do for $X I'd have made most of the same choices.

The cars each do what they're supposed to do remarkably well for what the MSRP turned out to be.

[M235ForNow]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

All things considered, for each car in the 2 lineup 230/240/M2 I think they got it right. Personally if they gave me a BOM target and said what would you do for $X I'd have made most of the same choices.

The cars each do what they're supposed to do remarkably well for what the MSRP turned out to be.

What would be even more pleasant for me, and it's cheaper than leather, is a high quality fabric seat covering. Doesn't get hot in the sun, doesn't get freezing cold in the snow. Grips well and looks good. But it's not "premium" so none for the US.

[Maynard]

It says they still care about real drivers cars that they put performance over leather feel; but a sign they are slipping into luxo-style markets that they don't even offer the cloth option. Can you just swap in seats from a 4/5-series, or are there all kinds of other fit issues?

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Maynard

It says they still care about real drivers cars that they put performance over leather feel; but a sign they are slipping into luxo-style markets that they don't even offer the cloth option. Can you just swap in seats from a 4/5-series, or are there all kinds of other fit issues?

Call IND if you really want to go down this path, but from what I can tell it's neither cheap nor easy.

Also what are you going to do with the rear? Personally I'd go insane with mismatched interior.

The upside of the shitty leather is it's pretty indestructible. Sold my coupe with 30k on it and looked literally brand new.

[B58togo]

Originally Posted by Maynard

It says they still care about real drivers cars that they put performance over leather feel; but a sign they are slipping into luxo-style markets that they don't even offer the cloth option. Can you just swap in seats from a 4/5-series, or are there all kinds of other fit issues?

IIRC, someone put M3/M4 seats in a 2 Series. To each their own. I'm happy with the basic structure of the car. I did Dinan springs/bump stops, Apex EC-7's, CF mirror caps, IND reflectors, BMS exhaust tips and light tint and the rest is go-fast mods from here on out. Catless DP and then a Pure Stage 1 turbo should compliment the JB4 nicely.

[mjposner]

"To each their own" Exactly. I owned a 235i for six months ands was just turned off by the interior. Great driving car, but I am getting too old to have to deal with inferior interior design. As for the S3 disses, my friends 2015 S3 has a much nicer interior. So while I am not sure a new M4 at 90k is 30k better than a new M240i, a used cpo 70k M4 maybe.

[CAMOETO]

Originally Posted by mjposner

"To each their own" Exactly. I owned a 235i for six months ands was just turned off by the interior. Great driving car, but I am getting too old to have to deal with inferior interior design. As for the S3 disses, my friends 2015 S3 has a much nicer interior. So while I am not sure a new M4 at 90k is 30k better than a new M240i, a used cpo 70k M4 maybe.

Well, as they say - opinions are like a-holes, everybody has one. To me the only thing about the A3 interior that is nicer than the m240i are the seats. Everything else feels cheap, and the overall design theme is too simplistic. Those circular vents are definitely an odd choice as well.

[B58togo]

I just can't do flat bottom steering wheels. They're just gimmicky. One of the major turn offs of the Golf R for me.

[CAMOETO]

Originally Posted by B58togo

I just can't do flat bottom steering wheels. They're just gimmicky. One of the major turn offs of the Golf R for me.

If anything, I like Golf R interior better than S3 (minus the seats).