[Devon K]

I went back and forth a few times sitting in both the A3 Sportline and the M235i at the Toronto show, and I definitely preferred the interior of the 235 - not just aesthetically but also for the better visibility. The hood line is lower, and the top of the windshield a bit higher on the Bimmer, so there is less of a bunker-slit forward view. In addition you can (just) see the lip of the spoiler looking out the back so for those of us in Canada who refuse to take a sunroof and so cannot get a backup camera or parking sensors due to the bundled options packaging it's great news that you can see past the rear window to the end of the car.

Subjectively the A3 has much more of a sitting-in-a-bathtub feel which I personally loathe (and found in a lot of cars I sat in at the show).

[Devon K]

Originally Posted by ecaedus

seems like the S3 and the Golf R won't have the multi port fuel injection feature for their motors, at least that's the case in the US. horsepower and efficiency will go down...i've been following the S3 and the R for quite some time, there's a big thread in VWvortex raging on about how AoA screwed them over, for me this means both these cars are out of the question. low engine tech, down on power, inefficient, part time Haldex and cost nearly as much as the M235i? no thanks...

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthrea...-Pricing/page6

Does the N55 have dual injection? If not (and I haven't seen it mentioned anywhere) isn't it susceptible to the same problems?

Edit: Looking at the N55 training manual it's clear it doesn't have a dual injection system - are scummed-up valves showing up on the N55s out there now?

[BMWDAD]

I have been looking to replace my 08 335i coupe for awhile now...............

1. redesigned 2015 audi tt (Geneva show in March)
2. BMW m235i
3. CPO cayman
4. redesigned Z if it comes soon enough
5. Mustang

[Red Bread]

Why would the R/S3 not receive the same fuel injection system as the GTI? Now that the engine in the R is based on the same motor as the GTI (EA888), unlike the previous generations, and the US GTI will have dual mode injection, it doesn't make sense to leave it off. Of course we're talking about VAG here. This would certainly cause me to cancel my order if true.

And to the previous post, yes, the N55 (and N20) are only DI, the intake valves do not get any fuel flow over them and need to be physically cleaned. Our N54 was showing significant buildup at 43k miles when we sold it. We leased our current car with the N55 for just that reason too, it can be BMW's problem.

[buumer]

From autocar's review of S3

Unfortunately for Ingolstadt, its BMW colleagues down the road have just produced a gem of a driver’s car called the M235i, and while it falls two doors short of the Audi’s four, it provides a distinctly superior dynamic experience with its driftable chassis and usefully more connected steering. It’s a direct competitor, and a better one.

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/...t-drive-review

[superpenguin]

Originally Posted by Devon K

Subjectively the A3 has much more of a sitting-in-a-bathtub feel which I personally loathe (and found in a lot of cars I sat in at the show).

Can you explain this more?

[basiluf]

high beltline low seating position, imo.

[superpenguin]

Originally Posted by basiluf

high beltline low seating position, imo.

and see for us tall guys, that's extremely hard to come by. In most cars, I feel like I'm sitting on top of the car, not in it. Even my M3 barely sits low enough. In the 228i I can sit a good 2-3" lower

[ASAP]

The A3/S3 interiors are absolutely awful and not fitting of the audi name.

[Devon K]

Originally Posted by basiluf

high beltline low seating position, imo.

Mostly the former, I don't think it's the seating position that has dropped so much as beltlines have crept up and up, which is why cars keep needing bigger and bigger wheels to look good because their sides are so bloody tall now. When combined with a low greenhouse the outward visibility suffers terribly.

[bimmerfile]

I was going to give the S3 (cabrio version) serious consideration (in addition to the M235i cabrio) as a replacement for my 1er cabrio later this fall or early next year.
But the latest road S3 test by Autocar doesn't sound like the S3 compares favourably to the M235i.
In summary they say: ']Unfortunately for Ingolstadt, its BMW colleagues down the road have just produced a gem of a driver’s car called the M235i, and while it falls two doors short of the Audi’s four, it provides a distinctly superior dynamic experience with its driftable chassis and usefully more connected steering. It’s a direct competitor, and a better one"..

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/...t-drive-review

[rca06Mcoupe]

I stopped by the local Audi dealer today, after missing the A3 launch event last night.

Based on what I saw of the A3, I don't want to rule out the S3 just yet. I had plenty of head and legroom and I am 6'5.

Trunk space is generous compared to my M Coupe (lol). The trunk space is adequate.

The doors closed with the sound of a more expensive, heavier car, certainly with a better firmer sound than my M Coupe or e46M3.

I am not a fan of the pop-up Nav screen, but I didn't find the interior as objectionable/cheap looking as some folks here who saw the A3 at the auto shows. Spartan though.

Black leather seats were comfortable. Exterior black, interior trim gray, but did not feel like a cave - car was outside and sunny day - maybe a factor.

Did not give it a test drive, since I assume it would drive differently than S3. However, my site lines from the driver's seat were good.

I just don't like the front grill of any current Audi. I thought rest of the car looked sharper than the other big Audi's on the lot.

If the Gran Coupe 4 door was available in either 228 or 235, I'd pick the BMW.

[jmr986]

Thanks RCA for the overview. I got an invite also but couldn't make it. I've been waiting for the S3 but now with xdrive coming for the 235 it could get interesting.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by jmr986

Thanks RCA for the overview. I got an invite also but couldn't make it. I've been waiting for the S3 but now with xdrive coming for the 235 it could get interesting.

S3 is based on FWD architecture so is biased that way. Xdrive should be much better since doesn't share the same inherent disadvantage.

[MaximumG]

I recently test drove the new A3 2.0 quattro. I actually did a back-to-back test drive along with a M235i and a 228i M Sport (w/o Variable Sport Steering) to compare the A3 against them. It was actually 4 test drives, first A3, then M235i, then 228i, and then back to the same A3 demo. The Audi salesman was super nice.

What I found was that I had more "feel" through the steering wheel in the A3 than both 2 series. (FYI, I was doing normal driving the whole time, and didn't push the cars at all.) That actually bugged me a bit, because I have a M235i ED on the way. BUT, I think I've figured out:

I was comfortable with the way the A3 steers because it has the same steering feel as the electric power steering in my girlfriend's 2013 A4 (the B8 A4 switched to EPS with the 2013 refresh). What I came to realize, is that the A3 doesn't necessarily have more steering "feel", but rather the whole cabin has more road sensation, including the steering wheel. Its cabin isn't as insulated/isolated/refined as the 2 series'. I know this because when I drive the 2013 A4, I feel the same vibrations (road unevenness) through the steering wheel as through the door handle. That is NOT the same as steering feedback when pushing a car at its limits, it's just cabin vibrations. I would imagine if I were to push the A3 at the limit, I wouldn't necessarily have more feedback (whether wheels are gripping or slipping) from the steering wheel. Now, I'll probably never be able to take a A3/S3 and a M235i to the test tracks to find out how communicative the steering really is. BUT here are some reviews comparing the S3's steering to the M235i's steering:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/audi/s3...on-2014-review

http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/...t-drive-review

I have to say though, the whole subject of steering feels is HIGHLY subjective. You'll just have to test drive the cars yourselves. The steering on the M235i is VERY different from my E46s'. The cabin is more tranquil, the steering wheel is a lot thicker and well-padded, much like the 1M's, very different than a E46 330i's or an M3's even. Although I haven't had that much chance behind the wheel of the 2 series, I think it's nicely weighted in comfort or sport. I will grow to love it when I get my car in May. It always take time to get used to a new car, new steering feel, just like how I had to get used to the EPS in my girlfriend's A4. After all, EPS is the future.

My ONLY gripe is that why does BMW have to develop a new EPS for the F80/82? Will THAT EPS be the future, and eventually replace the current non-M EPS for all models? I know electric/hydraulic steering feel depends on a LOT of factors, but why have to resort to building a new EPS from the ground up? On the second thought, the M235i Racing in VLN has the same EPS as the normal M235i, although retuned by BMW Motorsport. It probably means the EPS in M235i is pretty good already then?

[xbook]

Simply put, none...