[wjones14]

I'm driving myself crazy going back and forth between these two cars. A year ago, I was almost certain my next car would be a 2015 Mustang GT. I had been planning on it for about two years, ever since the Mustang redesign was announced. Then, on Dec 5 2013, Ford revealed the first prototypes of the car with a lot of fanfare. I was not really in love with the exterior. And that was when my first doubts started creeping in.

The history is that I ordered my current '05 Mustang GT in Dec 2004 and took delivery in Mar 2005. This was my 3rd Mustang GT, having previously owned a '95 and an '87. Prior to that, I had owned 3 Camaro Z28s, a '65 Corvette 396, and a '71 Olds 4-4-2 W-30 - all manual transmission V8 cars - so obviously I'm a muscle car addict. In 2007 I went to my first track day at Lime Rock Park, and since then have done 1 track day each year (Loudon, NJMP, Watkins Glen (twice), Lime Rock again, and Thompson), and love them.

For the first 8 years, the '05 Mustang was a daily driver year 'round, but a year and a half ago, I bought my daughter's 2003 Mini, and now that has become the economical daily driver and winter beater, while the Mustang only comes out in nice weather. I like it that way, and hope to continue doing that.

Anyway, between the Dec 5th reveal and now, I've followed the Mustang news daily, and learned virtually everything there is to know about it. A couple weeks ago, I finally saw one in person at the local Ford dealer, and it was pretty sexy looking - better in person than in pictures - and unmistakably still a Mustang. A bigger, heavier car, but still a Mustang. I test drove it too, the V8 5.0 GT, but with no Performance Package. I didn't get the opportunity to push it much around corners, but I did floor the gas pedal in 2nd gear, and the power is just brutal. It's ridiculous that a $35,000 car can be that fast. Obviously a lot quicker than mine. Not only that, the interior is more high tech and refined than ever - I couldn't even figure out how to turn on the heat!

As far as BMW, I have never owned one, but a lifelong friend has 3 of them (plus a BMW motorcycle), and has long been singing their praises to me. I have driven both his 1995 M3 4-door, and his 2002 S54 M Roadster. The Roadster was the nicest overall car I had ever driven, until I test drove an M235i...

I drove the M235i about an hour after test driving the 2015 Mustang, so it was a great back-to-back comparison. It was the xDrive automatic, and as dumb as this may sound, I honestly don't know how to properly drive an automatic, so I didn't touch the paddles or the gearshift lever once it was in gear. It was amazing though. The salesman took me to a twisty backroad and told me to push it, so I did, and it was composed over the bumps and turns like no car I have ever driven. And I thought somehow I would miss the V8 torque, but this car actually accelerates harder than my current Mustang without a doubt. My current car has many shortcomings, but acceleration isn't one of them.

After test driving both cars back to back, I liked the M235i better overall. It's smaller, more nimble, more refined, more elite, and just more a pure driver's car than the Mustang. I think the Mustang is sexy and more "in-your-face," while the BMW is classy but almost boring looking. I've seen two magazine tests now that show the 2015 Mustang is faster on road courses, at least at Willow Springs and the Motown Mile - but like I said, I only do one track day a year, and ultimate track speed is not the end-all factor for me. So after reading every review I could find on both cars and learning as much as possible, and then driving both of them myself, I came to the conclusion that I really wanted to move into something more refined and elite, and I was planning on ordering an Alpine White 6-speed with red leather, Technology Package, and Driver Assistance Package.

But here's the problem. Every time I think I'm convinced, I read or hear something that puts doubt into my mind. This week, it was the results of Road and Track's Performance Car of the Year. Two things bother me about that article:

1. The Mustang was in the Top 3 - with a Ferrari and Porsche. Enough said.
2. The M235i got some odd comments:

"The M235i commits perhaps an opposite fault: It's not vicious enough. Webster comments: "Filtered," and Krewson notes: "Power, sure. Engagement, no." That said, it's the equivalent of an L-39 Albatros for track-day drivers: fast enough to keep up with traffic, comfortable enough for the drive home, with plenty of depth to explore."

I don't really understand the "Engagement, no" comment, and that's one of the reasons for this long-winded post... What does that mean, and why would they say it's "filtered?"

There was one other review I read that I was a bit puzzled by - it was this statement:

"At the end of the day, the BMW M235i is an entertainer, but not necessarily in the way you’d expect. Those seeking a portal to the BMW coupes of the past, where you downshifted into second just to send the rear sliding, will be disappointed. As you’ve probably guessed by now, this is the worst part of the car."

Those negative bits aside, I did see the Motor Trend Head2Head with the M235i versus the CLA45 AMG. I love Randy Pobst, and when he said it was the best handling BMW in the past 10 years, I totally believe him.

So it's literally one day where I'm sold on the M235i, and then the next I'm reconsidering the tried-and-true Mustang GT. And I honestly can't decide...

[midwest 340xi 6sp]

Meh...

Only opinion that matters is yours. Car rags will always have varying opinions...

Go with your heart and don't forget about the wallet too.

I'm about 6 mos out from putting my order in for M235 xi myself...

[xtremcarl]

If I were you I would test drive the cars back to back again and see which more makes you smile more. It sounds like your looking for a fun to drive car not just the fastest on the track. Everyone is going to have their views and that's just it, their views. Decide which car you like more and go for it. Both are good cars so you won't go wrong either way. It sounds like your life me and read and see everything you can before making a decision and that can sometimes just muddy what your own thoughts are. Maybe try a rating system with categories and give the cars scores and see where it comes out. If your happy with the one that scores the highest go with that one. But if you are deep down wanting the other one you will find out at that point when you are not happy with how the scores came out.

[ska///235i]

[abp689]

I really prefer to buy American and would discount some of the 235 benefits. I have driven the 235 several times but have only sat in the GT.

The GT styling, price, and power is great. However, the backseats are worthless and a real deal killer.

[Killramos]

Originally Posted by abp689

I really prefer to buy American and would discount some of the 235 benefits. I have driven the 235 several times but have only sat in the GT.

The GT styling, price, and power is great. However, the backseats are worthless and a real deal killer.

Have you seen the back of an m235i? Much worse than a mustang.

[mteele]

You said it yourself, you enjoyed driving the BMW more in back to back test drives. In my opinion thats all you need to know. Forget what the talking heads say for right now.

[whoosh]

How does a car win PCOTY?

It displays the most potent mix of emotion, performance, and value—in that order.

performance - objective
emotion - subjective
value - subjective
"most potent mix" - subjective measure of 2/3's subjective criteria

I wouldn't put very much weight into the placement of these cars in the article. If you want to buy based on track times, buy the fastest car in your budget. For those driving their cars in the real world rather than being worried about 1-2 seconds on track, buy what you like.

As for the "Engagement, no" comment, again subjective. But you also have to wonder what car was driven before and after the editor drove that car. Did he go from the Ferrari to the BMW to the Porsche? I think anyone would find the BMW lacking engagement in that situation. My S2000 is far more engaging than my M235i, but there's no way I'm going to daily drive the Honda.

[Wheelwright]

Originally Posted by Killramos

Have you seen the back of an m235i? Much worse than a mustang.

Wrong: M235i has significantly more rear headroom because it is a "classic" coupe not a fastback. Maybe Mustang has more legroom but it is less important.

[Amessforone]

Honestly as many posts have already pointed out, it really boils down to your experience and how you feel about the car. I really don't like reading auto magazines when it comes to reviews because in most cases they are full of opinions that may not always apply. A great example is how I read a review recently (after buying my 228i) that stated the Audi A3 was a better overall package. I remembered vaguely seeing the car in person and it seemed cheap to me (an upscale VW GLI not a true Audi). I don't feel that at all with the 2 series. Of course these are my own personal opinions. Take your time, I'm sure you would absolutely love the M235i. It's a fantastic car!

[Transfer]

Sounds like you need to try flogging an E92 M3.

[crqflier]

Originally Posted by Transfer

Sounds like you need to try flogging an E92 M3.

I was thinking the exact same thing. CPO e92m. Same price range as m235i. But be careful, if you're struggling with your decision now, this may make your head explode - or make it a no brainer....

[ORIGIN M.]

Resale value alone is a Ford killer.

Buy the BMW you will not regret it.

[Delnari]

Test drive a Camero SS and compare the emotions of it to the Mustang. Not a pretty car inside or out, but beats the Mustang in driver fun and performance.

[doberzus]

I'm at ~4500ft elevation, so sea level guys can take my experience with a grain of salt.

Think of any fast NA car, and up here it's slow(C6 Z06's run 12.8's at 110 at BEST w/out DR.) Superchargers are affected as well.

I wanted a muscle car really badly for my next vehicle. Recently test drove a 580hp Camaro ZL1... Man what a let down. Felt slow. Shit build quality, hated the clutch, massive blind spots. what a let down.

Next day test drove a M235XDrive, "felt" like a damn rocket! Fit and finish was a lot nicer than he Camaro. Seemed to pull harder and was overall better for what I am after. The sounds winner is the Camaro hands down, thing sounded mean!

Had a deposit for ED in May for a base F80 M3 changed it to a M235XDrive with the M performance goodies. Mostly because of the reviews of M3/M4 owners who can't put power down from 1st-3rd(hence AWD 235) That's another story lol.

[Cyberdemon]

Forget what journalists are going to write - for every journalist that thinks it's the best car of all time (which for the M235 has been many) there's going to be one guy who's mad it's not an E46 M3.

I think my wife described "BMW-Joy" best when 2 years later she described to a stranger that the only other time she had ever seen me so happy was the day I picked up my car.

If it doesn't put a shit eating grin on your face you shouldn't be driving it.

[AWcoupe]

I was in your position just a month ago. As a long time Ford fanatic I bought my first BMW, a 2009 328xi coupe, 3 years ago as a CPO vehicle. Great riding, braking car. The best I've ever owned. Decent performance but not what I've been used to as a V8 rear wheel drive owner my whole life. This is probably why I kept my 2002 Mustang GT 5 speed manual that I bought brand new back in 2001.
When the CPO expired back in early October, I decided that I wanted to move on from the 2009. The new 'Stang and the M235 were really the only cars on my radar. I loved the X-drive in the '09 and I think that with the winters that we've been having recently, I was already biased towards the BMW. Then I drove the 235 and had a similar experience as you. Great engine with great V8 like torque, amazing 8 speed auto trans, and of course, that world renowned BMW handling. A huge performance increase over the 328xi. I was sold. Never drove the Mustang. Maybe someday I'll get into a 5.0, but for now, I still have my '02 GT to rip around in when I need to row some gears.
Some people may disagree, but as I've passed through the mid-life stage, I feel a lot more comfortable stepping out of a nice classy BMW then a perceived "boy racer" Mustang. I honestly don't really care about perceptions per se, but that is always in the back of my mind when I'm out in the 2002. I know, I probably need to lie down on some shrink's couch to discuss.
You can't go wrong in either car from a performance stand point. I only have about 575 miles on the 235, so I'm still breaking in the engine as per BMW's recommended 1200 mile break in procedure. They want you to keep the tach under 4500, which is hard to do, but I'm trying to be a good boy. Even with that limitation, the car pulls hard up to that RPM, with no noticeable turbo lag. Instant power.
I also think the car is a real head turner in the looks department, so win win for me. It's hard to go wrong with Alpine White on the coral red leather!
Tough decision for sure, but I'm not disappointed with the M235. With x-drive! Pick one up.

[BEAR-AvHistory]

Try reading this years C&D Lightning laps comments. The Mustang should be a better bang for the performance buck but the M235 is very competent car.

http://www.caranddriver.com/features...p-2014-feature

[Shawnski]

The one thing that has held me back from daily driving a Mustang is refinement. Something that BMW always had. I no longer think that is the case with the new Mustang. It is now possible to have an American car with the refinement of a BMW; good site lines and driving position, firm brake feel, excellent transmissions, and linear throttle response, things that make you a better driver. Once my 335 lease is up I will buy a new Mustang for the first time since 1999.

Resale value has never been a problem with a Mustang compared to BMW. Loved my 1 Series, but I think the new Mustang has the entry level BMWs beat on paper and in the flesh.

[BLK235iNJ]

Dudes two totally different cars. If you like fast boats with poor visibility and tons of bulky ness do the mustang. If you like quick athletic fits like a glove feel go with the bmw. I have a modified 13 gt and I have not touched it since the 2 series arrived. I don't see the 15 being that drastic of a change with the same wheelbase and length. It's funny to see the same WHEEL HOP problem on the 15...same sh!t happened on my 03 svt cobra. Wheel hop SUCKS.

I was also stuck between the 2 cars I'm glad I went with bmw. And this is my first bmw. I will say that you can make the big girl extremely fast with all the mods out there. If that's your thing go with the mustang.

[jeremicium]

Great color combo AWcoupe!

[Cyberdemon]

I like both cars, the Ford is never going to be a refined as the BMW but it's also not as expensive. A fully loaded GT Automatic with all the trimmings will barely get you to the starting price of an M235i, and as soon as you add the stuff you want to the M235i you're very quickly cresting the $50k mark.

A nicely loaded Ecoboost will run you into the mid $30k point, at which point you're getting a 228i without any options.

So you ultimately have to ask yourself what the refinement is worth it to your wallet.

The Mustang is a great go fast bargain and it finally has the design to be taken more seriously.

The E92 M3 option is a great suggestion but you need to be willing to accept the maintenance costs of an M car vs something that comes with a warranty.