05-03-2015, 08:03 PM | #67 | |
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the xDrive as a power transmission cannot vary torque sent to independent wheels... if you want to believe that applying the brakes to vary torque is good enough cause the torque to the ground from one wheel to the other is different, then great... Also all this you are saying is still not even for the regular xDrive anyway... regular xdrive doesn't do this torque vectoring thing... And again anything you find only shows regular xDrive only changes torque front to rear. I might have not know that the specific xdrive in some M model would apply the brake... so what? The main purpose about the xDrive is how it distributes power not if some specific version can apply brake to fake it can't sent different amount of torque to each wheel I'm just saying I've never seen an actual xDrive vehicle with an LSD... all you did where make assumptions about part numbers... Do you now any actual xdrive car with LSD ? |
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05-03-2015, 09:07 PM | #69 | |
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RWD will be faster if traction is not an issue ie after cars are moving cause it's lighter and the drivetrain loss of awd is slightly higher than rwd Both cars have same power, so as long as you can put the power down with the RWD, then it will be faster |
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05-03-2015, 10:09 PM | #70 |
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The m235i was designed as a rwd car, rwd cars is what bmw do. M235i is the better car overall end of story!
Since OP is a redlight warrior, just get the xdrive you just wanted people to agree with you and validate your reasoning to get the xdrive version. As 0-62 difference is minimal, not noticeable at all, some have shown rwd is actually faster, but you don't care, at the end of the day you just want to show your mates on a brochure that your car does 0-62 in xx time. Rather than getting the better car
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05-04-2015, 04:07 AM | #71 | |||||
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I can only assume you're not reading the references, because ....
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So, tell me, if it doesn't vary power to the ground by wheel, what earthly use is any open differential AWD system? Quote:
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The reference was for overall 3-series and 5-series. It was a BMW press document describing how standard xDrive works, and had nothing to do with any M model. Again, you clearly know little about how the systems work and aren't reading the references. Quote:
Assuming you're asking "know of personally", no. So what? I don't personally know of any red ones, any with Dinan stage 1, any with automatic headlights, and so on. BMWUSA says they sell them. My CA says they sell them. Either of those trumps you, considering your limited credibility on this subject at the moment. But that provides an easy solution as well. You don't believe the BMWUSA website? Fine, call your CA and ask him.
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Prior 40 years: 67 BelAir wagon / 68 LeMans Tempest / 70 Mustang Mach 1 / 72 El Dorado / 78 Corvette / 81 Subaru GL wagon 4WD / 83 s10 Blazer 4x4 / 85 Bronco 4x4 / 96 Bronco 4x4 / 04 Passat 4mo / 09 BMW 335xi Last edited by Zooks527; 05-04-2015 at 05:18 AM.. |
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05-04-2015, 05:22 AM | #72 | ||
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The Mickey Thompson's are radials AND not SLICKS as some keep saying . I doubt AWD is going to see any better 60ft than 1.6 with drag radials since the stock tires were not spinning in the first place .Thus the only advantage from AWD off the line is already cancelled by the 330ft. Yes. I was running more boost and I already admitted I was making more power,but that is really only evident on the back half of the track....but even with the same power,the AWD is going to trap lower(hence will be slower) given its heavier weight....simple law of physics. |
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05-04-2015, 08:06 AM | #73 | |
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Apples to Apples, awd wins. Also, drag radials are not meant for daily driving. |
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05-04-2015, 09:02 AM | #74 | |
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Just buy the X drive already so this flame war can die and us RWD enthusiasts can go back to our uncontrollable power slides. Next up on the rehashed forum argument agenda: Snow tires vs AWD? 8AT vs 6MT? EBII vs every other blue?
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05-04-2015, 11:28 AM | #75 | |
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But you can't so AWD is quicker....only by a couple of 10ths which doesnt really matter but it is quicker. |
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05-04-2015, 11:58 AM | #76 | |
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In reality, your reaction time will probably be longer than the 0-60 delta. But in order to gain back that 10th of a second you are saddling the car with more weight. So 100% of the time the car will be heavier which impacts everything else (braking, turning, top end, fuel economy, etc) for what, 2/10ths of a second? You'll be paying away those 200ms every time you stop at the gas pump and you have less horsepower getting to the wheels. In reality the 235 doesn't have so much power that a sticky set of rubber, reasonable driver and LSD couldn't get it to hook up damn quick, especially in some place like Florida where the tires are going to be hot year round. Those of us in the cold north have the disadvantage of tires being cold which does not help things hooking up and AWD makes a bigger difference. So that's the big question do you sacrifice everything else for something that has a minimal impact on the real time things take? If the OP's answer is yes, 0-60 or bust then he's made up his mind and the discussion is over.
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05-04-2015, 12:31 PM | #77 | |
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Don't be silly. I'm not asking a specific red or white or whatever... I'm asking ANY XDRIVE CAR WITH LSD. The link you posted says LSD is not available for xDrive models... Looks like you didn't even bother to select a vehicle and try I guess you don't know it all either... |
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05-04-2015, 12:53 PM | #78 | |
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These are radials with thread.They wear faster but if your car makes so much torque that may be the only tire that is going to keep you from spinning And you realize 0-60 is different from time to 60 ft right? The few calculators that try and use time slips to calculate 0-60 use 1/8 th time and speed. According to the calculator my 0-60 was 3.3 seconds while the X drive was 3.5 http://www.wallaceracing.com/0-60_equation.php See RWD wins again |
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05-04-2015, 01:12 PM | #79 | |
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Do the same thing in a 2 series. Select an M235xi, you know, the car we've been talking about. Surprise, there it is! And if you go back to post #62, you'll find exactly the same image from the last time I did this.
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05-04-2015, 03:20 PM | #80 |
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Wait, maybe i get rwd. I wanna fishtail on turns.
Back in the day...... Toyota Supras ruled. RWD Current day...... Nissan GTR's rule. AWD Wonder why ? Is the GTR's awd same as BMW's xdrive ? Also, the power a stock 235 makes moght be ok with rwd, but at 400whp & 450wtrque, i would tend to think awd rules, no ? |
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05-04-2015, 03:30 PM | #81 | |
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M235i: Weight distribution, front/rear -– Automatic Transmission52.2/47.8 % Weight distribution, front/rear – Manual Transmission51.9/48.1 % M235Xi: Weight distribution, front/rear -– Automatic Transmission53.5/46.5 % 228i: Weight distribution, front/rear – Automatic transmission 50.8/49.2% Weight distribution, front/rear – Manual transmission50.4/49.6 % 228Xi: Weight distribution, front/rear – Automatic transmission 50.7/49.3% |
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05-04-2015, 03:32 PM | #82 |
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ALL new BMW's come with run-flat tires that includes summer tires and all season tires.
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05-04-2015, 03:38 PM | #83 | |
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Put those same sticky tires on the AWD and it will get out of the hole even faster than the RWD with same sticky tires. There is no disputing that AWD puts the power to forward motion more evenly and thus quicker. Now, at higher speed AWD has more friction and thus isn't as efficient so as speed increases AWD loses it's out of the hole advantage. Also, certain AWD designs do add handling performance such as in Audi's and Subaru's as they are designed to perform best as AWD. BMW's tend to be better performers in their standard RWD design, and that's the beauty of a RWD BMW. Sliding the rear around in corners may be fun, but it's not always the fastest or most efficient way to get best of fastest time on a track. |
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05-04-2015, 03:40 PM | #84 |
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05-04-2015, 03:44 PM | #85 |
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05-04-2015, 03:49 PM | #86 | |
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In other forms of racing Audi and it's AWD dominate for a reason. AWD is not just for safety when it comes to performance on the track and racing, and some AWD's translate this to non track driving as well. I love the driving feel of RWD and that's why I choose RWD BMW's. But I've had AWD and those are also fun in a different way. There is a driving technique adjustment that needs to be made when performance driving an AWD compared to RWD or FWD. They can all be fun in different ways. Which one prefers is personal choice. |
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05-04-2015, 03:51 PM | #87 | |
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BMW did this years ago as a weight saving measure, they don't include spares and jacks. Perhaps in other countries they may provide this but not in the US. I see you are in the UK, and I believe in the Euro market there is a "mobility kit" or some such, no such thing in the US market, which is what I am referring to. CORRECTION: Non RFT summer tires are available as an option in the US. I am open to being corrected on this, but I'd need to see the proof. Last edited by RPM90; 05-04-2015 at 04:13 PM.. |
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05-04-2015, 03:55 PM | #88 | ||
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