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      07-23-2014, 12:34 PM   #111
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I think the mustang is too big based on the pics/specs and I drive one that is a tad smaller and it feels like a boat. Now based on driving a 13 Mustang (modded and probably quicker than a 15) and a 14 235i (Stock) I'd pick the 235i hands down. Much better throttle response (I hope they fix this in the 15) the torque band is much better on the BMW and that's comparing it against the 13GT and BOSS 302 (I hope they change this in the 15). The visibility sucks in the 13 (Hood feels long and I feel like I"m dragging 5 feet of plastic in the rear). The traction sucks on the 13 (I hope this is not the case with the 15). On the Mustangs the downforce doesn't exist so at 110mph + the car floats. Not the case with the BMW.

Modding was not much cheaper- $450 CAI, $550 Axle Back exhaust, $500 flash/tune, $275 HR springs. I'm seeing similar for BMW outside of Dinan and the exhaust for the bmw seems to be a tad more expensive.

I disagree with the statement about the materials. I touched the 15 and I must say the quality is NOT up to par with the BMW.

My experience with the s550- I was on mustang6g hourly 12/7 I couldn't wait to see the car. I excitedly went to the NY auto show thinking I was going to fall in love with the s550. I'm 5 Mustangs in and I've always believed the hype regarding the next model. Unfortunately after seeing it in person I was let down (forget the specs you can make anything go fast). I then wandered around and spotted the M3 and M4. Not being a BMW fan I went over to check them out. M3/4 were pricey and they seemed on the large side and then I saw the 235i. The minute I sat in the car it felt right. The size, the driver position, the size of the steering wheel, the quality of the material. I went to drive one and I couldn't believe the balance the car had. I can't stop driving it. Up to date and 5 mustangs later I have yet to get that feeling from a Mustang.

I currently also have a 13 SHO with the eco-boost 6cyl. It's not very cheap to mod and the engine is OK. Quality of the interior is OK. I feel my opinion is coming across neutral being that I was a Ford/American car fan and buyer throughout most of my adult life.

I personally do not see how these 2 brands are even compared. Ford is picking the low hanging fruit to pitch their cars against BMW. M3/4 are expensive and they perform well... so lets go build a mustang that performs close to it and hope people switch over based only on specs/performance. If you compare anything other than performance Ford is not in the same league as BMW. It's like comparing a automatic seiko to a rolex because they have the same time drift.

Last edited by BLK235iNJ; 07-23-2014 at 12:50 PM..
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      07-23-2014, 01:07 PM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BLK235iNJ View Post
I think the mustang is too big based on the pics/specs and I drive one that is a tad smaller and it feels like a boat. Now based on driving a 13 Mustang (modded and probably quicker than a 15) and a 14 235i (Stock) I'd pick the 235i hands down. Much better throttle response (I hope they fix this in the 15) the torque band is much better on the BMW and that's comparing it against the 13GT and BOSS 302 (I hope they change this in the 15). The visibility sucks in the 13 (Hood feels long and I feel like I"m dragging 5 feet of plastic in the rear). The traction sucks on the 13 (I hope this is not the case with the 15). On the Mustangs the downforce doesn't exist so at 110mph + the car floats. Not the case with the BMW.

Modding was not much cheaper- $450 CAI, $550 Axle Back exhaust, $500 flash/tune, $275 HR springs. I'm seeing similar for BMW outside of Dinan and the exhaust for the bmw seems to be a tad more expensive.

I disagree with the statement about the materials. I touched the 15 and I must say the quality is NOT up to par with the BMW.

My experience with the s550- I was on mustang6g hourly 12/7 I couldn't wait to see the car. I excitedly went to the NY auto show thinking I was going to fall in love with the s550. I'm 5 Mustangs in and I've always believed the hype regarding the next model. Unfortunately after seeing it in person I was let down (forget the specs you can make anything go fast). I then wandered around and spotted the M3 and M4. Not being a BMW fan I went over to check them out. M3/4 were pricey and they seemed on the large side and then I saw the 235i. The minute I sat in the car it felt right. The size, the driver position, the size of the steering wheel, the quality of the material. I went to drive one and I couldn't believe the balance the car had. I can't stop driving it. Up to date and 5 mustangs later I have yet to get that feeling from a Mustang.

I currently also have a 13 SHO with the eco-boost 6cyl. It's not very cheap to mod and the engine is OK. Quality of the interior is OK. I feel my opinion is coming across neutral being that I was a Ford/American car fan and buyer throughout most of my adult life.

I personally do not see how these 2 brands are even compared. Ford is picking the low hanging fruit to pitch their cars against BMW. M3/4 are expensive and they perform well... so lets go build a mustang that performs close to it and hope people switch over based only on specs/performance. If you compare anything other than performance Ford is not in the same league as BMW. It's like comparing a automatic seiko to a rolex because they have the same time drift.
HEY! None of what you say is relevant, don't you understand!? The S550 changes EVERYTHING based on the paper specs tw3rkn has given here. Nothing, not even the fact that you sat in the car (and tw3rkn hasn't even smelled one) means anything.
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      07-23-2014, 01:17 PM   #113
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperzulu View Post
HEY! None of what you say is relevant, don't you understand!? The S550 changes EVERYTHING based on the paper specs tw3rkn has given here. Nothing, not even the fact that you sat in the car (and tw3rkn hasn't even smelled one) means anything.
You're really quite awful at trolling. And in post #86 w3rkn admits to having seen and poked/prodded but not sat in one.

Also if I remember the NYC auto show they had several s550's on display, but none that you could sit in, i remember being rather upset about that.
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      07-23-2014, 01:51 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by Ritz42 View Post
You're really quite awful at trolling. And in post #86 w3rkn admits to having seen and poked/prodded but not sat in one.

Also if I remember the NYC auto show they had several s550's on display, but none that you could sit in, i remember being rather upset about that.
Trolling would be me going to a mustang forum and saying how the interior of the new mustang looks pretty bad compared to BMW. Oh wait...

BLK235iNJ has mentioned several times how he's in a much better position to argue the merits of the Mustang (in my opinion) than tw3rkn and every single time, tw3rkn has dismissed him, saying that the points he makes have no validity since the new car is all new and cannot be compared to Mustangs of yester year. Truth is, the Mustangs of yester year are ALL anyone can use to argue the merits of the future, aside from what has actually been seen in person at car shows, as the car has not yet been released.

Paper specs mean dick. BMW puts out specs and when the car comes out, those specs are shown to be completely underrated. The same can't be said of other manufacturers, but the point is that we know what the M235i brings to the table and it makes no sense to make this thread now based on vapors.
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      07-23-2014, 02:08 PM   #115
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How long are we going to argue for when is the damn car going to be out?

Is it still q4 this year?
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      07-23-2014, 03:13 PM   #116
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Can we please now start a Camaro thread since apparently the potential Mustang owners think they have something special but the Mustang is being outsold by a 6 year old Camaro that looks like a Transformer. I think a 2.3 liter Mustang will get spanked by a 228 auto since the Car rags have done as low as 0-60 in 5.0 with a 228 auto. Does it really matter, if you want a big ass monster car the size of 5 series get a Camaro, Mustang or Challenger. My E93 was too big so I went for the M235 which is much smaller, I wouldn't consider a 4 series due to size and its baby compared to the Mustang or Camaro.
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      07-23-2014, 03:24 PM   #117
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The 228 is a little monster... I just autocrossed it at a BMW event. It was very fun and quick.
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      07-23-2014, 03:41 PM   #118
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Hyper.. You are just incredibly lost.

I didn't come here suggesting the Mustang is better, it is just that YOU are unable to defend that position, given the virtues you've seen. I don't see you posting any 235i specs or pics to bolster your rants.

I'm not a BMW outsider, and attacking me won't make your 2-series any quicker, or better. You are the troll, ranting without a point, or focus.


BLK-NJ.. The interior at the winter shows were pre-production materials, fyi.
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      07-23-2014, 03:41 PM   #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mmmmm235i View Post
I have always seen mustang as compromising luxury/tech/interior quality for raw performance. If you only care about going fast then buy the mustang. Most people and certainly those who buy BMW are looking for a balance of luxury and performance.
Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!
Johnny, let's get this contestant a set of steak knives!

Completely agree. They're on completely different levels:

Success
American Car Success: Do 1 or 2 things well. Typically "affordable" and "acceleration". See Camaro, Mustang, Challenger, etc.

German Car Failure: Doing only 5 or 6 things well. Acceleration, Styling, Cornering, Luxury, Braking, Resale Value, MPG, Technology, Comfort, etc. Don't do 1 thing well, do everything well.

Design
American: Machete-style. Grab a 40-year-old name, glue it on a car. To make it faster, drop an enormous motor in it. To make it pollute less, bolt on an enormous smog pump. Rehash as many models as you can, quickly/cheaply. See "Dart", "Malibu", "Challenger", "Charger", "Barracuda", "Impala", "Camaro".

German: Scalpel-style. Continually improve existing products using pain-staking design to make incremental changes that keep the car relevant over decades. See "911", "3 series", etc.

Over decades, BMW was giving us the iconic 2002, M3 and others. Ford at those same times was releasing the exploding Pinto and sad Taurus SHO.

Sorry if this is so blunt. I would love American cars to take their rightful place among the best that Europe and Asia have to offer. I think it's great that Corvette has finally upgraded their interiors to be on par with their foreign competitors. I would love nothing better than to see Ford score a hit with this Mustang. But track numbers and fat tires aren't going to get my eyebrow raised. That will take a number of years seeing consistent attention to excellent design and quality. Then I'd love to take another look.

BTW…you'd better get this fixed too if you want me to get excited:

http://www.cnbc.com/id/101444215

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      07-23-2014, 03:53 PM   #120
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Sorry, that^ isn't about a 235i vs Mustang, you are just Ford bashing.

Secondly, that is the second time someone used that link.. I guess the only 2 cars people can buy are the Tesla and 235i.. ??


I hope Ford shuffles some Stangs to the euros so they too can feel the quality of the materials used, so they can decide themselves & ask why BMW is charging an extra $17k.

I think what u meant to say is "in the past..."
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      07-23-2014, 04:44 PM   #121
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Again, the bashing continues. An easy way to sum the situation up would be to say that you have different cars for different people. If your preferences lean toward minimal performance compromise and a raw driving experience, get the Mustang. If you'd like to have something that's far more well-rounded with more creature comforts, better interior materials, a softer driving experience, and have it all wrapped in a more mature design, get the 2er.

I'll tell you this: coming from an E92 335i, I'll be avoiding F/I for as along as I can and stick with a RWD, V8-powered, moderately-sized 2+2 with an LSD out back and three pedals at my feet. Those are my preferences, but I'm not going to bash BMW and resort to biased remarks. I could say that they look boring and cookie cutter-esque, are way too heavy for their size and have too much sound insulation, or for some bizarre marketing reason have open rear ends despite packing 300+ bhp. I could say that M235i drivers have egos the size of watermelons and think their car is a rare gem when we'll see a million nearly identical looking 228is on the road which anyone with a decent income could lease (when you hear the "Mustang's a dime a dozen" schtick). Or that I've had a nightmare track record of reliability with my car and all BMWs must he shoddy as a result. All of that is ridiculous, but it sounds like the same kind of crap I just read now.
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      07-23-2014, 05:42 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w3rkn View Post
Hyper.. You are just incredibly lost.

I didn't come here suggesting the Mustang is better, it is just that YOU are unable to defend that position, given the virtues you've seen. I don't see you posting any 235i specs or pics to bolster your rants.

I'm not a BMW outsider, and attacking me won't make your 2-series any quicker, or better. You are the troll, ranting without a point, or focus.


BLK-NJ.. The interior at the winter shows were pre-production materials, fyi.
I'm not actually lost at all. I'm not going to try to defend the 2 series because I couldn't give three craps about the new Mustang. As I said, I think it looks like poo and I would not drive one. If this were a conversation about the new Corvette, maybe I would have something to say about it, but you would get no arguments from me on that one. I think that car looks insanely good and if I could get away with driving a 2 seater, that and the Cayman S might have given the M235i some serious competition for what car I would be buying in the future.

My gripe is with the fact that we JUST had this thread! And it was a bigger pile of poo than how the new Mustang looks. It didn't generate any good discussions and this one was doomed to be the same. So your insistance on creating it is what I am going on about. Just because some new specs were put out doesn't mean this thread will suddenly generate a good discussion. It's a waste of space. You should have read the other thread, realized your plans to create discussion were not going to happen and rethought your plans to create this one. Instead, you did not of that and created this stupid thread anyway.

You don't put a Tiffany's in the middle of the ghetto. You don't create this thread on 2addicts.com - either of those things have proven to be illogical. I'll be the bum busting out the windows of your department store. Cheers!
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      07-23-2014, 06:03 PM   #123
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Someone should just close this thread. Or everyone should ignore it. That's what I'm doing.
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      07-23-2014, 06:10 PM   #124
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Before I give this particular post a definite farewell, I would like to point others to the OP's previous post history. He's an obvious troll with never anything good to say about BMWs yet he/she owns a 135i. How pathetic.
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      07-23-2014, 07:37 PM   #125
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Resorting to ad hominems now...
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      07-23-2014, 07:50 PM   #126
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This has to be the most troll-feeding thread I've legit EVER seen on the 2-series forums. What a shame.

Stop. Feeding. The. Trolls.

In the very FIRST place, and at best, this whole thread is a

In the second place, why is this thread just full of people speaking their minds and being attacked if they don't agree the Mustang is on par with the m235i, and vice versa? I don't agree that Ford makes comparable vehicles in ANY category because of their company history, so I would never consider a mustang on par with any BMW. Does that make me wrong and you right? No, neither, but it's my opinion. You don't get to tell me I'm wrong, because it's an opinion. Anything outside of that is trolling, and should be reported as such.
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      07-23-2014, 09:57 PM   #127
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While I stand by what I said in my previous post, I will agree that I was being immature by making this an issue of a person's character vs. discussing legit car issues. Post deleted.
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      07-23-2014, 10:03 PM   #128
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Why is this thread still going?
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      07-23-2014, 10:10 PM   #129
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I have to agree with the earlier comment about different cars for different people. While I really like the BMW, it does tend to drive like you're in a vault. In comparison, my mustang scares the crap out of people and I have to drown out the noise with my even louder stereo. I am considering a 2er, but I'm a car guy through and through. I just love cars and can see why people select one over another. Sometimes what I want or need also changes, which causes a sea change in car selection. At the end of the day, I don't think it's odd to cross shop these cars because you find out really quickly what you do and don't like in each of them and that helps you make the best purchase for you.
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      07-23-2014, 11:05 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hyperzulu View Post
I'm not actually lost at all. I'm not going to try to defend the 2 series because I couldn't give three craps about the new Mustang. As I said, I think it looks like poo and I would not drive one. If this were a conversation about the new Corvette, maybe I would have something to say about it, but you would get no arguments from me on that one. I think that car looks insanely good and if I could get away with driving a 2 seater, that and the Cayman S might have given the M235i some serious competition for what car I would be buying in the future.

My gripe is with the fact that we JUST had this thread! And it was a bigger pile of poo than how the new Mustang looks. It didn't generate any good discussions and this one was doomed to be the same. So your insistance on creating it is what I am going on about. Just because some new specs were put out doesn't mean this thread will suddenly generate a good discussion. It's a waste of space. You should have read the other thread, realized your plans to create discussion were not going to happen and rethought your plans to create this one. Instead, you did not of that and created this stupid thread anyway.

You don't put a Tiffany's in the middle of the ghetto. You don't create this thread on 2addicts.com - either of those things have proven to be illogical. I'll be the bum busting out the windows of your department store. Cheers!
Yes, you are an extremely lost individual...


Matter-of-fact, you very first sentence... illustrates you are not here because of the TOPIC, but to troll. As you do not wish to discuss 235 vs Mustang.

So ANYTHING you say is moot & irrelevant. Coincidentally, Nobody cares about your feelings kid, you have to learn to deal with them, yourself. I charge $120/hour..



Here is some free therapy:
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      07-23-2014, 11:16 PM   #131
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I like the car but it sucks that they made it so big (I miss the foxbody dimensions and weight). Hopefully the interior I saw in April is improved along with the plastic trim on the exterior(windows/back panel/mirrors). I'm definitely going to drive this car when it comes out.

in the end all that matters is the owner loving his car.


Quote:
Originally Posted by w3rkn View Post
Yes, you are an extremely lost individual...


Matter-of-fact, you very first sentence... illustrates you are not here because of the TOPIC, but to troll. As you do not wish to discuss 235 vs Mustang.

So ANYTHING you say is moot & irrelevant. Coincidentally, Nobody cares about your feelings kid, you have to learn to deal with them, yourself. I charge $120/hour..



Here is some free therapy:
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      07-24-2014, 12:14 AM   #132
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Originally Posted by w3rkn View Post
So ANYTHING you say is moot & irrelevant. Coincidentally, Nobody cares about your feelings kid, you have to learn to deal with them, yourself. I charge $120/hour
They say the biggest nutcases make the best shrinks, so you must be freaking Freud, but I'm going to pass.
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