[qnet]

Originally Posted by Viffermike

To a point, he is. But bryan_f22 is taking one of the arguments against the M2 as a DD and bringing it to a logical conclusion; It's a car that has performance limits that can only be truly appreciated by someone with good fast-driving skills on a closed track.

If one doesn't have those skills, even that performance difference can't be realized and appreciated, so why bother with an M2 as a DD? Because some people want things that have higher limits than they themselves do. If I'm an average bass guitar player, does that mean I should only play an average bass -- even if I can afford that five-figure custom-made Fedora, or a vintage late-50s Fender Precision? Hell no. I want that P-Bass!

(An aside: I'm a proponent of more extensive training for the licensing of potentially deadly machines, including cars, motorcycles, and firearms. Basically, I feel one needs to prove safe and competent operation before owning one for public safety reasons. But I get why such training doesn't exist in the U.S. ... and, so, we have Mustang Cars & Coffee jokes for days.)

I can't argue against the points you've made, and I like the guitar player analogy. I suppose I opened myself up for criticism by mentioning my feelings about the HPDE (which I did enjoy).

[WolfGTI]

I get it - but to that point - you telling the dealer that you hold him personally responsible makes you come across as a proverbial d-bag. I do hope your friend uses her money to hone her driving skills so that she can really enjoy her car.

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Trust me, I tried. I really really tried. There's only so much you can do when someone is an adult, has more money than they know what to do with, and the only person they really listen to about such things just died (hence the cash windfall and car buying spree).

I spent countless hours trying to convince her to start out with something like a Cayman, TTS literally anything else to learn on.

It's not like I was buying it as a gift or she was my kid or something. There is only so much anyone car do sometimes people need to learn themselves the hard way.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by WolfGTI

I get it - but to that point - you telling the dealer that you hold him personally responsible makes you come across as a proverbial d-bag. I do hope your friend uses her money to hone her driving skills so that she can really enjoy her car.

Easy there tough guy. Before you start throwing names around you need to appreciate the fact that you 1. Have zero idea what my relationship with the dealer is like and 2. Have no context for the conversation. Nor did I provide any information about either so taken in a vacuum I can, I suppose, understand the remark. That said you basically told me I was derelict in some imagined responsibility you believe I neglected then assumed I was being a jerk to my dealer buddy. Neither are the case.

Our goal in the 2 day course was to put the fear of god into her and have a professional really show her how her new toy could very easily become a deadly weapon and inspire a heightened awareness of danger and prompt her to really take it seriously and spend a LOT of time and money on professional instruction.

[DF]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

I insisted my p-car dealer pay for a 2-day intense driving course for my friend before selling her a GT3 RS. She's 25 and new to high performance cars. Told him I'd hold him personally responsible if something happened to her.

I hope he showed her how to text and clip the apex at the same time :-)

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by DF

I hope he showed her how to text and clip the apex at the same time :-)

Come on, the kids are snap chatting these days. We installed a proclip mount on the roll cage so she can live stream via her iPad Pro. Obstructs her vision but small price to pay for always-on social media. A young lady must have her priorities straight

[WolfGTI]

Not being a tough guy - you stated that you told a dealer you will hold them personally responsible if anything happened to someone who is buying a very high performance car with no driver training and no experience with cars that offer that level of performance.

Based on that statement I said what I did. It doesn't make you a d-bag in real life. I laud your pushing your friend to really get trained for that car - I hope she becomes a better driver and enjoys the car.

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Easy there tough guy. Before you start throwing names around you need to appreciate the fact that you 1. Have zero idea what my relationship with the dealer is like and 2. Have no context for the conversation. Nor did I provide any information about either so taken in a vacuum I can, I suppose, understand the remark. That said you basically told me I was derelict in some imagined responsibility you believe I neglected then assumed I was being a jerk to my dealer buddy. Neither are the case.

Our goal in the 2 day course was to put the fear of god into her and have a professional really show her how her new toy could very easily become a deadly weapon and inspire a heightened awareness of danger and prompt her to really take it seriously and spend a LOT of time and money on professional instruction.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by WolfGTI

Not being a tough guy - you stated that you told a dealer you will hold them personally responsible if anything happened to someone who is buying a very high performance car with no driver training and no experience with cars that offer that level of performance.

Based on that statement I said what I did. It doesn't make you a d-bag in real life. I laud your pushing your friend to really get trained for that car - I hope she becomes a better driver and enjoys the car.

It can be next to impossible to explain some things to someone when they don't know what they don't know. I've driven all sorts of things from a Miata to an F40 and everything in between. I don't understand all the per second per second vectors physics bullshit well enough to give you a technical argument, but there are inherent design aspects of a 911 that make it a bitch to control if you don't know what you are doing. Even tried to get her into an R8 which in my mind is a LOT easier to not kill yourself in.

Sorry for thread jacking!

[Maynard]

Getting her to a 2 day school probably puts her at the 1%ile for pre-delivery training, so you have gone well above and beyond. I would fall right out of my chair in shock if ANY of the major high end sports car manufacturers really made a full on commitment to require this level of training to buy their products - too busy scrabbling for market share with the true d-bags out there who want status symbols. Hell, these days they don't even stick to the 'does your check clear' test (since you can lease most of them).

I keep hoping that they will move to incremental lockouts for performance - kind of like extended valet-key, where you only get 200HP and 90mph until you show you can manage more. Then the poseurs can pose, and the spoiled kiddies can sneak out in daddy's cool car, without launching a car through somebody's living room doing 120 on a city street.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Maynard

Getting her to a 2 day school probably puts her at the 1%ile for pre-delivery training, so you have gone well above and beyond. I would fall right out of my chair in shock if ANY of the major high end sports car manufacturers really made a full on commitment to require this level of training to buy their products - too busy scrabbling for market share with the true d-bags out there who want status symbols. Hell, these days they don't even stick to the 'does your check clear' test (since you can lease most of them).

I keep hoping that they will move to incremental lockouts for performance - kind of like extended valet-key, where you only get 200HP and 90mph until you show you can manage more. Then the poseurs can pose, and the spoiled kiddies can sneak out in daddy's cool car, without launching a car through somebody's living room doing 120 on a city street.

Once I go stage 2 on my M235 this weekend I'm going to talk to Dinan. Probably a long shot but I'd LOVE IT if my spare key could be somehow linked to valet mode for when GF has to borrow car or whatever.

[bryan_G01]

Get her involved in the Porsche club HPDE's.
After a year she will be a fairly decent driver. They have an excellent program.

As far as the Dinan tune, use the app and set it to 0 when you get out of the car.
Not valet mode, but its stock mode.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by bryan_f22

Get her involved in the Porsche club HPDE's.
After a year she will be a fairly decent driver. They have an excellent program.

As far as the Dinan tune, use the app and set it to 0 when you get out of the car.
Not valet mode, but its stock mode.

I thought they had valet mode no? I'm actually talking w them about adding some functionality so it's only juiced up when I'm in the car w my phone and the Bluetooth app or a BT keychain dongle or something.

[bryan_G01]

i don't remember. Ripped Dinan off along time ago.
Check the app.

[ark3]

So... No noticeable difference in steering feel between the M235i and the M2? That's the one thing that caught my eye about the M2, especially when the Motor Trend folks said there was such an improvement. I like my M235i as a daily driver but I would enjoy more steering feel. I don't need more power or aggressive looks or automatic rev-matching.

[bryan_G01]

i highly doubt there is any difference between steering to be honest. The suspension was stiffer so that helped, but its not noticeable.

from Mtrack Days...

[bcjbmwm3]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

I have not because I need AWD and I've already softened up my M235 by going down to 17s with bigger tires since the roads by me are crap. Going Dinan Stage 2 on that instead to get the performance bump.

That said in a few years I'd consider keeping my current convertible and adding an M2 GC to the stable. Would be a better compliment than another 2-door. Have a deposit down at the dealer to ensure I get the first one if they build it.

AWD is one of the main reasons i havent changed either. Plus i have already added the dinan s3 kit to my car. I spent good amount of money on the car and 445 hp is plenty.

Though I would consider the M2 CS.

[qnet]

Originally Posted by bryan_f22

i highly doubt there is any difference between steering to be honest. The suspension was stiffer so that helped, but its not noticeable.

from Mtrack Days...

byan_f22, you sound just like the instructor I had at my HPDE at Road Atlanta.

[bryan_G01]

Originally Posted by qnet

byan_f22, you sound just like the instructor I had at my HPDE at Road Atlanta.

thats my goal for next 2 years... instructor, win lotto, and get a ride with PWC


and why do ppl think they have 445hp with anything Dinan makes, its just not true!

I was stage 3, its not even 370.

Heres same track, in my m235 lapping the grid:

[Rayscott]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

It's also amazing how much difference the wind screen makes. Windows up with that installed you can actually drive with the heat on down to about 50 degrees and it's pleasant. Run the risk of looking like "that guy" but that's a different issue.

I have done that a few times. Toasty warm and I can see clear blue sky. Who cares if I look that "that guy"

[USA-RET]

Ever notice how these topics tend to go off the rails by page 2?

[MBimmer]

Originally Posted by USA-RET

Ever notice how these topics tend to go off the rails by page 2?

I am bringing the thread back to life since I just traded my M235i for an M2. It honestly does feel special, at least to me. The interior with the alcantara, aggressive body, break feel is more sensitive, and it sure does seem to pull smoother.

[Kolyan2k]

Originally Posted by B_Rice

Yeah stock suspension. If I decide keep the car I'd go with some KWs

Btw. KW makes plug and play EDC suspension upgrade for M235i

[qnet]

Originally Posted by MBimmer

I am bringing the thread back to life since I just traded my M235i for an M2. It honestly does feel special, at least to me. The interior with the alcantara, aggressive body, break feel is more sensitive, and it sure does seem to pull smoother.

I'm not that big of a fan of the alcantara but, I don't dislike it. I test drove a M2 and just drove it normally, and it didn't feel any different from my M235i, other than the brakes. The brakes are something I really noticed.

Did you have any mods on your M235i?