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      03-23-2017, 02:42 PM   #1
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The Car (Transmission) Kicks 2 Seconds After Coming to a Full-Stop

Hi Everyone,

New member here. I'm glad to be a part of this family.

I live in Istanbul so we get European models and since the taxes on vehicles are really high here I had to go for a small engine for my F22, I got the 218i Coupe. Unfortunately I have a small problem with it and I would like to hear your ideas on. Approximately 2 months after getting the car, I started to experience some kicks (like someone rear ended me) after coming to a complete stop when the vehicle is in Drive and the mode is either Comfort or Eco Pro with start stop function disabled. After a cold start with there seems to be no issues but driving for 7-9 mins will start to cause the kick. They are light at first but may get aggressive after. I brought this to the attention of my dealer but been ignored couple of times and given answers like; it's the AC compressor coming on etc. when the AC wasn't even being used I've been told it was completely 'normal'. They reseted the adaptation values for the transmission 3 times with no luck. After some persuasion I got them to book an inspection session since there were no visible errors or any error codes. They took the car for a week and gave me a loaner. When I went to pick the car up, I have been told that its caused by lack of power from the 3 cylinder engine, which to me makes absolutely no sense. I had a test car for a week before I decided to purchase the car, it was fine, I went to have a 1-1 training course with the same vehicle type in Germany at BMW Driving Experience (which I would recommend to anyone, absolute fun, great people), the car I had my lessons in was fine, I have 2 friends who own the exact same car, no issues so this can't be the 'lack of power' that they claim it is and even if that was true then why would BMW put this engine on every car series from 1 to 4? With dissatisfaction I contacted BMW Germany directly and informed them by email on the situation. During this period I went to another Service Partner, after doing a small test drive the mechanic told me that this behaviour wasn't normal. Since the car is brand new and there is no new software available we reinstalled the current one, after driving it for 2 weeks without any problems the car started to do the kicks again yesterday. To my luck a service manager called me today and told me that he is calling from BMW Turkey. After recapping the situation we agreed to have the car inspected by their staff at this second service partner as the meeting place. I'm now waiting on details for the time and date of the appointment.

I personally think this is a software related problem since the issue can't be replicated in Sport mode or transmission in Sport/Manual mode. From the kicks I've been experiencing narrowed the problem o either vehicle shifting into neutral after coming to a stop (NIC) or the transmission downshifts from 2 to 1 a little late as the car starts to rattle little bit before the kick as in a manual where the rpm is to low for the current gear. What are your takes on this, any tips before the appointment?

Best,
Omer

Last edited by omera60; 05-02-2017 at 12:09 AM..
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      03-23-2017, 02:59 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omera60 View Post
Hi Everyone,

New member here. I'm glad to be a part of this family.

From the kicks I've been experiencing narrowed the problem o either vehicle shifting into neutral after coming to a stop (NIC) or the transmission downshifts from 2 to 1 a little late as the car starts to rattle little bit before the kick as in a manual where the rpm is to low for the current gear. What are your takes on this, any tips before the appointment?

Best,
Omer
First off, welcome! I am pretty new here myself. The first issue I see is that you have an automatic! If you get "kick" in a manual, you're just a bad driver

But in all seriousness, that's a bummer, especially in a new car. Hopefully you can get some input on the forum, and/or BMW can help you out. Best of luck!
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      03-23-2017, 03:21 PM   #3
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It's not the Auto Start-Stop? Try disabling that - it would explain why it doesn't happen in Sport mode.
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      03-23-2017, 06:24 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ianp622 View Post
It's not the Auto Start-Stop? Try disabling that - it would explain why it doesn't happen in Sport mode.
That's what I was thinking. Sounds like auto-start is kicking in. Do you have a small half moon shaped button above the start button? If so push it (light should stay in) and give that a try.
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      03-23-2017, 11:00 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by aelarson View Post
First off, welcome! I am pretty new here myself. The first issue I see is that you have an automatic! If you get "kick" in a manual, you're just a bad driver

But in all seriousness, that's a bummer, especially in a new car. Hopefully you can get some input on the forum, and/or BMW can help you out. Best of luck!
LOL, I had a manual before this one, it's really hard when you live in the city which has the 7th worst traffic in the World at any given time of the day and auto is standard equipment here. Thanks for the wish though

Quote:
Originally Posted by ianp622 View Post
It's not the Auto Start-Stop? Try disabling that - it would explain why it doesn't happen in Sport mode.
Quote:
Originally Posted by xantdieselx View Post
That's what I was thinking. Sounds like auto-start is kicking in. Do you have a small half moon shaped button above the start button? If so push it (light should stay in) and give that a try.
I forgot to tell you, I always turn off the start stop button, I feel like it takes lifetime out of the engine and the components. But when the kick starts to happen and gets worse, it exactly feels like the start stop function kicking in (no pun intended) but is off as always.

Last edited by omera60; 04-30-2017 at 03:27 PM..
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      03-24-2017, 10:19 AM   #6
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It's probably the Trunk Monkey:

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      03-24-2017, 10:33 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by 3.0L View Post
It's probably the Trunk Monkey:


I definitely need one, the way people drive and treat you on the roads in this country is unbelievable

So, today I started to experience some really hard kicks. So strong that I thought I might have left a piece of the drivetrain on the road. At this exact moment I received a call from the second service that I went. They brought 2 218i's to test if my condition occurs in them as well. I've been told small 'kick' like feelings can occur from time to time as the car switches into neutral and this is what they were experiencing as well. I told what was happening and asked them if I can come to do a test drive with them, to my luck, they were free. I went there and the mech just jumped in the car without stopping. We did a test drive and he told me that this is far worse then what he told me he was experiencing with those other cars. We also had a small discussion on the previous findings and I told him that even if the engine being underpowered theory is true, then this problem should go away once I turn on the AC in the car which rises the rpm level and he agreed that this should be the case however since this doesn't work it probably is something with the software. I'm still waiting to hear from the BMW Turkey on the date though.

Anyone got any ideas what it may be? If so, please feel free to post them, no idea is crazy at this point really...

Best,
Omer
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      03-24-2017, 11:40 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omera60 View Post
Good one , I had a manual before this one, it's really hard when you live in the city which has the 7th worst traffic in the World at any given time of the day and auto is standard equipment here. Thanks for the wish though.
Old joke...just trying to have a little fun, not hating on your car or driving ability. Very understandable to have an auto with heavy traffic.

Do you think the idle on your car is low and it's bogging itself down? Does the car kick only when your'e completely stopped, or does it kick when you accelerate too?
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      03-24-2017, 12:02 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by aelarson View Post
Old joke...just trying to have a little fun, not hating on your car or driving ability. Very understandable to have an auto with heavy traffic.

Do you think the idle on your car is low and it's bogging itself down? Does the car kick only when your'e completely stopped, or does it kick when you accelerate too?
No, I really like your joke, I get it, sorry if I used the wrong smilies

Only when the car comes to a complete stop after driving it for 4-9 mins. After that point whenever I come to a complete stop it starts banging down, the harshness of the bangs vary from one stop to another. I don't believe what they told me is true since it makes no sense, there are no other factors that support this theory of theirs... I understand that It's really hard to narrow it down to reproduce the problem however since it's always present people do see it happening.

I personally think its software related since this doesn't happen in any other mode then Comfort and ECO PRO with the transmission in Drive. When they wiped the adaptive values for the transmission the problem did go away until the car set the new values (approx. 2 days to 1 week). After doing a full reinstall of the software to the car it took longer (2 weeks) but as of Wednesday the problem is back. I use the car in heavy traffic a lot but this happens even if the road is clear. Believe me it's really irritating especially in bumper to bumper traffic as overtime I move and come to a stop it happens. What really gets to my nerve is that the dealer/service ignored it and told me its normal and then came up with this theory (then why say normal at first). The owner of the dealer is a really good friend of ours and my fathers customer. While they say this on the other hand a complete stranger that I went to by recommendation realises the problem and tries to help as far as they can...

Last edited by omera60; 04-30-2017 at 03:28 PM..
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      03-24-2017, 12:05 PM   #10
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Trunk Monkey should be banned, or at least with an NSFW warning - unsafe because I've now spent half an hour watching them, and convincing my coworkers that I found something this funny in the medical charts I was supposed to be reviewing is not gonna happen. This one speaks to all of us sweating the potential ticket for no front plate:
.

But on subject - this sounds like it is involving transmission (or tranny control software), unless you are actually hearing the engine cut out and back on. That might explain the selective appearance in certain driving modes. If it is valve body (or the modern equivalent) it might not throw a code if the electronics are OK, but the valves are malfunctioning. Another wild card might be if the 'hill hold' was activating randomly, but DK why it would happen during this phase of driving. Have you tried evoking the 'kick' while somebody is outside the car to try to tell if it is activating brakes, cutting out engine, etc? Either way, I'd try to get a loaner until they figure it out - they will be a little more motivated to get it done if you are putting miles on their car, and you won't be beating up on your new car - this sounds like it is hard on the driveline.
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      03-24-2017, 12:09 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by omera60 View Post
I personally think its software related since this doesn't happen in any other mode then Comfort and in Drive. When they wiped the adaptive values for the transmission the problem did go away until the car set the new values (approx. 2 days to 1 week). After doing a full reinstall of the software to the car it took longer (2 weeks) but as of Wednesday the problem is back. I use the car in heavy traffic a lot but this happens even if the road is clear.
That's so odd, I'm sure it's pretty frustrating! Hopefully BMW can get that figured out for you!
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      03-24-2017, 03:50 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Maynard View Post
Trunk Monkey should be banned, or at least with an NSFW warning - unsafe because I've now spent half an hour watching them, and convincing my coworkers that I found something this funny in the medical charts I was supposed to be reviewing is not gonna happen. This one speaks to all of us sweating the potential ticket for no front plate:
.

But on subject - this sounds like it is involving transmission (or tranny control software), unless you are actually hearing the engine cut out and back on. That might explain the selective appearance in certain driving modes. If it is valve body (or the modern equivalent) it might not throw a code if the electronics are OK, but the valves are malfunctioning. Another wild card might be if the 'hill hold' was activating randomly, but DK why it would happen during this phase of driving. Have you tried evoking the 'kick' while somebody is outside the car to try to tell if it is activating brakes, cutting out engine, etc? Either way, I'd try to get a loaner until they figure it out - they will be a little more motivated to get it done if you are putting miles on their car, and you won't be beating up on your new car - this sounds like it is hard on the driveline.
The engine seems to be fine, steady rpm (just below 1000, somewhere there can't remember the exact value but its in normal range). When the kick/bang happens if it is hard it can be confused with auto start-stop function but as said earlier, I don't use it and I observed the engine when this type of kick happened, every parameter seems ok so I don't think it's the engine. I don't know the valve body, can I check that myself? The car doesn't kick/bang while I'm on a hill both upwards and downwards and believe me Istanbul has some really steep hills almost everywhere. Hill hold can be plausible but I can I check that? I haven't tried to evoke it with someone on the outside but my observation is that when you come to a stop its fine, little rattle as if in a manual where the rpm is too low relative to the engaged gear, then the kick happens, back of the car is lifted as in a manual again where you are doing a hill start and then decide to let the throttle go and the back rises upward. This rise can sometimes be quite erratic, this is what I exactly mean when I use 'kick' by the way. I think the car goes to neutral to save fuel however what I can't figure out is why does it happen so erratically and why is it silk smooth sometimes. There is an acceptable margin as the other cars demonstrated this is sometimes in the range but most of the time far above the range. This is the first 2016 218i I've driven, the once before this I used for testing etc was 2014-2015. I asked for a loaner for the exact same reason, then I have some cards in my hand as well... I've been told 'its safe to drive like this, don't worry', but I got them to write this down in a official paper and sign it, you know, just in case my drivetrain ends up on the road someday...
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      03-24-2017, 05:01 PM   #13
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Not anything simple or familiar to me. Dealer should have the tech support to really sort it out, but they may need to be consulting with a service center. Best wishes, and post back what the answer turns out to be.
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      03-25-2017, 02:45 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Maynard View Post
Not anything simple or familiar to me. Dealer should have the tech support to really sort it out, but they may need to be consulting with a service center. Best wishes, and post back what the answer turns out to be.
Thanks, I wrote a really nice email to BMW Germany and they arranged a session with their senior mechanics, I'm still waiting on the date though. I hope we can sort it out, I'll post everything through the process so that people can follow and if they are experiencing the same issue this can be a guide to them of some sort.
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      03-27-2017, 02:04 AM   #15
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A bit off topic but wanted to let you guys know. Someone tried to break into the car last night. They smashed the passenger side window and leaned in by pressing my moms X3's driver door which was next to it. He/she tired to steal the iDrive unit. I have the NBT evo version. They removed the front center AC to get access to it and removed the control unit, to my luck one of my neighbors couldn't sleep and heared the glass smash and called the cops. The thief was scared when he shouted at him and ran away without anything. Thanks to him it seems I only need the window changed. Cops chased him but no luck. Crime scene investigation came in the morning to take pictures and get my info. I'm now taking it to the station for them to get finger prints, in the mean time I'm making a copy of the camera footage of the garage between 4.50 and 5.10 morning to hand it to the police. The car will be towed to the service to get repaired by the insurance company. The kick issue will be on the shelf for sometime, just to let you know.

Best,
Omer
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      03-27-2017, 07:05 AM   #16
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Sorry to hear about the break in. Extremely frustrating. As I was reading your problem descriptions I was wondering if you had tried shifting into neutral and coasting to the stop. This way you isolate the engine and transmission. If you see a RPM jump then you know the problem is originating there if not you have isolated it to the transmission or at least narrowed it down to a smaller set of variables. Good luck.
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      03-28-2017, 02:32 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by Cumberlandjames View Post
Sorry to hear about the break in. Extremely frustrating. As I was reading your problem descriptions I was wondering if you had tried shifting into neutral and coasting to the stop. This way you isolate the engine and transmission. If you see a RPM jump then you know the problem is originating there if not you have isolated it to the transmission or at least narrowed it down to a smaller set of variables. Good luck.
Thank you, it's a loss of time, that's what really made me frustrated yesterday. I had to devote my whole day to this, the police, service, insurance and their coordination. For now everything seems to be settled, I've been told that if the service has everything in their storage, it will take 3-4 days but if they need to order stuff it can be up to 3 weeks . I'm also retrofitting the alarm system which should help prevent further attempts. I now have a loaner from the insurance company which would make them pressure the service to do their job in time.

I will try to shift to neutral before coming to a stop as soon as I have the car back, thank you for the suggestion, I'll let you know if there is any news regarding this diagnostic process.

Also an update on my appointment, I've been contacted by BMW Turkey and told that the team is in Germany this week for training and will be back before saturday. If I get the car back in the mean time, they will be seeing me on 3rd of April or that week.
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      03-29-2017, 12:41 AM   #18
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Morning guys (or afternoon depending on where you are),

So I talked to the service today, it seems that they need parts ordered from the factory, the middle section cover, glass and some door interior mechanisms needs to be changed however what stuck me is that I've been told the leather has been damaged by the shattered glass pieces which caused scars and needs replacing. I've heared some horror stories about this like the leather being loose and not up to the factory standards once fitted, what are your takes on this? They got approval from the insurance company to carry out the repairs but since they need to order the parts it will take 3 weeks to finish the repairs The worst part is since it's a insurance involved repair, the insurance company lends the loaner, usually what they give is one segment below your car, in this case a Volkswagen, Audi, Opel etc but they gave me a Hyundai i20 which is to be honest just a plastic junk. ah, well I'll ask my dad to lend me his Z4M Coupe

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      03-29-2017, 12:27 PM   #19
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I don't know if insurance over there works like it does in the states, but here you can wait to do the repair work at your convenience. For the seats that might be a good idea (wait a few years, until they have more wear on them). If not, you might want to consult with a good upholstery shop, they can tell you how hard it is to get it right. I know that for older cars, just replacing the upholstery can sometimes look terrible (either it isn't an exact pattern, or the rest of the seat has shifted and settled, so it is just baggy).

And I'm in shock about how good the police support is for a break in - any place I have lived, you would be lucky to have them fingerprinting a crime scene if it involved less than a murder or serious felony - back in Cleveland they would not even come out to take the report for property crimes, you had to come in to the station and fill them out yourself.
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      03-29-2017, 02:59 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by Maynard View Post
I don't know if insurance over there works like it does in the states, but here you can wait to do the repair work at your convenience. For the seats that might be a good idea (wait a few years, until they have more wear on them). If not, you might want to consult with a good upholstery shop, they can tell you how hard it is to get it right. I know that for older cars, just replacing the upholstery can sometimes look terrible (either it isn't an exact pattern, or the rest of the seat has shifted and settled, so it is just baggy).

And I'm in shock about how good the police support is for a break in - any place I have lived, you would be lucky to have them fingerprinting a crime scene if it involved less than a murder or serious felony - back in Cleveland they would not even come out to take the report for property crimes, you had to come in to the station and fill them out yourself.
Unfortunately it doesn't, once you open a insurance claim case here the company wants it closed as soon as possible and it's also illegal to do so, once opened all must be completed. I've been reassured by the service and couple of my upholstery guys who do our classics interior from ground up or repair them for years. Classics are can turn out really bad as you said, that's why I was afraid. Both sides told me independently that since the car is new (not even a year old) and it's on the right seat which is not used a lot, it should fit perfectly. Only the cushion part needs changing, the rest is fine. Fingers crossed it works...

The laws are there but if the officer is lazy, he/she will do their best to avoid paperwork, but if you have knowledge of the Law like I do (Law student), then they will follow procedures word by word. The one on the scene for example was really good, he tried his best etc, once I went up to the station the officer there was incredibly lazy. He tried to make me give up my mind on the forensic stuff but I pushed hard and made a little threat that if he doesn't do it I'll talk to his supervisor, that's how I made him to do it. As I said, it's actually standard procedure but some of them really hate paperwork. I'm also in shock that the police don't help you on these matters in the states.

Last edited by omera60; 03-29-2017 at 03:08 PM..
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      03-29-2017, 03:42 PM   #21
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Good for you to push them. Here it is much the same, if you push, they do more. But still very little usually happens in theft cases, unless they get lucky. Good luck with all of this, hope it turns out well and in time to be driving for the nice weather.
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      04-13-2017, 01:05 AM   #22
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Hi everyone,

Small update. So while my car is waiting for its parts from Germany I was able to meet with the technical delegate (that's what they call themselves). We had a small talk and made a test drive. He told me that this kicks, small and big doesn't matter, shouldn't happen at all. He said that it's probably software related. Last August he went to Izmir (another city in Turkey) to review a same issue with a 316d which is also a 3 Cylinder engine. In conclusion he made a report to BMW AG on this and got a reply that they will probably fix it in the next patch which was due March 2017. After the test we went to the workshop to connect the car to the computer. It did show that there were 2 patches to my current software. Both of these patches were for the transmission but he wasn't sure if these were the ones that was for my issue but nevertheless he did apply them and we went for another test drive but since the adaptation values were reset there was no issue present. He told me that if the issue comes back to contact him so he can make a report to BMW. Unfortunately the issue did return this morning and I contacted him so he will open a case on my behalf. This issue affects all the 3 Cylinder engines so it's a widespread one. The small problem is that Turkey is the biggest market for these engines because the taxes are so high and the only other market they sell this much is Austria so it may be a while before they roll out another update...

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