[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by OpenAir

Hey Dylan86

What is the "Perf. Edition" option to your 235? Never seen that before.

The "Performance Edition" was a limited run for 2015 and is 1 of 50 brought to Canada/NA. It basically included all of the M performance bolt-ons from the factory like the front splitter, black kidney grills, carbon mirror caps, carbon rear trunk spoiler, rear lower valance, M performance exhaust, 19" etc..

D

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by aerostar

M240i xDrive will most likely be slightly faster in a straight line.

Quicker 0-60, not faster. The M240i xDrive will definitely not be faster.

Faster = Higher velocity.

Quicker = Greater rate of acceleration.

In the 1/4 mile, it will be close. Once you start tuning, I'd give the edge to the M240i, based on what we've seen from the B58 so far.

Originally Posted by Mo@BMWofFairfax

It doesn't even matter what happens at a race track because 95% of them won't even see one. It's funny how everyone talks about performance on a track when they won't even go anywhere near one. Shoot, they'll probably use less than 10% of the cars REAL potential. They're going to be driven every day to and from work and to car meets. They are going to be driven stop light to stop light.

Even if you're not at the track, it's undeniable that there is a difference in the way an M2 drives versus and M240i. If you can't feel it, no hard feelings; I know I can though. Just like I could feel the difference between my E92 M3 and a 335i, 135i, and M235i, all of which I drove back to back with my M3. The chassis tuning on an M-car delivers a different driving experience. Even at 3/10ths, you can feel the difference. Every input feels different on an M-car.

It all comes down to an individual's priority. I'm not saying everyone should buy an M2. I'm just pointing out that all the talk about how racetrack performance is irrelevant is bullshit, because the same things that make a car better on a racetrack are desirable to a certain kind of buyer. Then again, they're undesirable to other kinds of buyers. That's why BMW makes both kinds of cars, and that's why it's silly to suggest that either are extraneous.

[aerostar]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

Quicker 0-60, not faster. The M240i xDrive will definitely not be faster.

Faster = Higher velocity.

Quicker = Greater rate of acceleration.

In the 1/4 mile, it will be close. Once you start tuning, I'd give the edge to the M240i, based on what we've seen from the B58 so far.



Even if you're not at the track, it's undeniable that there is a difference in the way an M2 drives versus and M240i. If you can't feel it, no hard feelings; I know I can though. Just like I could feel the difference between my E92 M3 and a 335i, 135i, and M235i, all of which I drove back to back with my M3. The chassis tuning on an M-car delivers a different driving experience. Even at 3/10ths, you can feel the difference. Every input feels different on an M-car.

It all comes down to an individual's priority. I'm not saying everyone should buy an M2. I'm just pointing out that all the talk about how racetrack performance is irrelevant is bullshit, because the same things that make a car better on a racetrack are desirable to a certain kind of buyer. Then again, they're undesirable to other kinds of buyers. That's why BMW makes both kinds of cars, and that's why it's silly to suggest that either are extraneous.

Can't tell if you're being serious about faster vs. quicker.

Synonyms Expand
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
1. fleet, expeditious. Quick, fast, swift, rapid describe speedy tempo. Quick applies particularly to something practically instantaneous, an action or reaction, perhaps, of very brief duration: to give a quick look around; to take a quick walk. Fast and swift refer to actions, movements, etc., that continue for a time, and usually to those that are uninterrupted; when used

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by aerostar

Can't tell if you're being serious about faster vs. quicker.

Synonyms Expand
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
1. fleet, expeditious. Quick, fast, swift, rapid describe speedy tempo. Quick applies particularly to something practically instantaneous, an action or reaction, perhaps, of very brief duration: to give a quick look around; to take a quick walk. Fast and swift refer to actions, movements, etc., that continue for a time, and usually to those that are uninterrupted; when used

In an automotive context, it makes a difference. It's like handling vs roadholding. Of course, if you don't care about the distinction, that's fine with me.

[wdeerfield]

and like always, im sure the price increases as well.

[kdog26372]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

So buy an M240i. No one is saying you shouldn't.

Thanks, very helpful. I already own a tuned M235, I'm not in the market for anything right now.

[goj]

Interesting all numbers say 335hp but the data on the sheet says 250kW/340hp for the m240i.

[Mywifes335]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

In an automotive context, it makes a difference. It's like handling vs roadholding. Of course, if you don't care about the distinction, that's fine with me.

Semantics. Some people view quick as acceleration and fast as top speed. Although in general vernacular, it's interchangeable.

Just to clear it up. More hp and tq contributes to quicker acceleration and a higher top speed. Ceteris Paribus.

This debate is so moot. Just wait for the car to come out and see what kind of times it posts. I think it's safe to assume any 240i variant will perform better in a straight line than the like 235i predecessor.

[Tomahawk]

Originally Posted by RacerDad

My decision to purchase a 2016 M235i vs a 2017 M240i is the same as yours. This is my first new BMW and I was concerned about the reliability of a fairly new engine. I was also concerned about the reduction of the warranty for 2017. This car will serve as my daily driver and occasional HPDE car. Reliability is a major requirement for me.

This is the third reference to warranty change for 2017. Nothing has changed with the warranty. The maintenance plan changed.

[M-Pilot]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

So basically a tuned M240 will be faster than a stock M2 or is the plan to eventually put this engine into future M2s if they continue production?

Even a stock M240i might be as fast or faster than M2 on a straight line. 340i has 320hp claimed on paper but on dyno it puts down around 330whp stock. Considering M2's recent dyno runs and M240i's 335hp on paper, I wouldn't be surprised if M240i is quicker on a drag race. However, I would still prefer M2 since it's the total package although M240i with LSD is a pretty damn good alternative to M2.

[firedown31]

Originally Posted by Tomahawk

This is the third reference to warranty change for 2017. Nothing has changed with the warranty. The maintenance plan changed.

Thanks you. That was bothering me more than the "fanboy" bitch fest for 5 pages. The WARRANTY is still 4 years for 2017s, you get the same amount of protection on that new m240 engine.

[OpenAir]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

The "Performance Edition" was a limited run for 2015 and is 1 of 50 brought to Canada/NA. It basically included all of the M performance bolt-ons from the factory like the front splitter, black kidney grills, carbon mirror caps, carbon rear trunk spoiler, rear lower valance, M performance exhaust, 19" etc..

D

Sweet, that's the first I've heard of it! All the fun toys right from the factory! Don't want to know how much that cost....ouch!

[sgmpw]

Tried searching this to no avail - can anyone confirm if the M240i will offer the optional Limited Slip Differential (eDiff?) that appears to have been offered pre 2015 but disappeared afterwards. Perhaps because the M2 was coming.

[aerostar]

Originally Posted by sgmpw

Tried searching this to no avail - can anyone confirm if the M240i will offer the optional Limited Slip Differential (eDiff?) that appears to have been offered pre 2015 but disappeared afterwards. Perhaps because the M2 was coming.

It's gone from a traditional ordering standpoint. I believe you can still buy the part from BMW later and have it installed by a dealer for like $250.

[hinckley]

Originally Posted by DeaconBlues

I'd hate to see BMW restrict manuals to the high-performance models alone.

This is exactly the problem that I have with BMW and xDrive. BMW won't offer MTs or true M suspensions with xDrive because they seem to consider AWD to be a foul weather system. Audi (especially in their S models) and Porsche have engineered their AWDs as performance systems that also provide foul weather traction.

I was driving BMWs since the 80s, and I still consider myself a BMW guy. But I left the brand five years ago because of the total sh*t handling of their xDrive cars. I'd love to get back to BMW, but please give me a sport-oriented xDrive system with MT.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by OpenAir

Sweet, that's the first I've heard of it! All the fun toys right from the factory! Don't want to know how much that cost....ouch!

Actually, quite the contrary!

I went in to lease a base white 6spd w/ lumbar, MPE and LSD upgrade which is about $51k CDN before taxes. That same day this car was coming off of a 1yr executive lease from a dealer staff member, and I was told I could have it for $49k, hmmm.
At the time I had no idea either what a "Performance Edition" 235i was, then I did some homework. After speaking with BMW Canada, they confirmed the VIN was associated to the 50 units that came to port as "Performance Edition" vehicles and I decided then that the purchase was worth it to me. This car was sold for $64k (before taxes) and had all of the goodies on it, so I decided to purchase it as opposed to leasing a base. I didn't want a sunroof initially (because racekar) but I'm glad I have one with all of the sun we've been getting here, and being a black car. I could do without crash sensors etc, but I'll live with it. Got it with just over 10k on the clock, and have put about 5k on it since March. Love the car, wouldn't change much. No disappointments or regrets whatsoever.

D

[kdog26372]

Originally Posted by hinckley

This is exactly the problem that I have with BMW and xDrive. BMW won't offer MTs or true M suspensions with xDrive because they seem to consider AWD to be a foul weather system. Audi (especially in their S models) and Porsche have engineered their AWDs as performance systems that also provide foul weather traction.

I was driving BMWs since the 80s, and I still consider myself a BMW guy. But I left the brand five years ago because of the total sh*t handling of their xDrive cars. I'd love to get back to BMW, but please give me a sport-oriented xDrive system with MT.

The suspension, tires and ride height are all the same in the xdrive version of the M235i as the RWD version. In other models when you opt for xdrive you do in fact get different suspension and ride height, not so for the 2 series. I've had a tuned 135i w/RWD and now a tuned M235 with xdrive and I've got no complaints on the suspension, in fact the 235 drives much better than the bouncy 135i and I've got zero traction issues from stop and powering out of corners. If you turn off the traction control the AWD is pretty fun around corners, in a controlled way. I had LSD on the 135i as well, I thought that car was pretty useless post tune prior to the LSD as the traction control kicked in all the time.

In terms of manual vs auto, it's strictly a preference of some to have manual, but Ferrari gave up on manual a few years back and all new cars are quicker with the auto vs the stick. Audi and Mercedes don't offer manual in the S3 or CLA45 either and that's the 2 series competition. If you are basing BMW AWD suspension and driving characteristics simply on a former 335 or 535 then it's going to be way off as this doesn't represent the M235 or now the 240i AWD suspension. I've driven the S3 and it is slower and less sporty when compared to the AWD M235i and the CLA45 is an extra $10k similarly equipped and if you don't use launch control it's kinda a dog from a stop and has bad transmission tune that lags horribly.

[goj]

Originally Posted by aerostar

It's gone from a traditional ordering standpoint. I believe you can still buy the part from BMW later and have it installed by a dealer for like $250.

Or as a port installed accessory for just the price of the diff

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

Semantics. Some people view quick as acceleration and fast as top speed. Although in general vernacular, it's interchangeable..

That's exactly what I said.

This isn't the general vernacular; it's a car forum. I would assume that since we're all here spending our time talking about cars we like, we have a common interest in being able to communicate (accurately) what we're trying to say about automotive performance, yeah? People can choose to be informed and not take offense to clarification, or they can choose to remain ignorant in order to preserve their fragile self-confidence. Or they can take the third option and provide some cogent basis for why they feel it should be otherwise. Personally, I prefer the latter, because it leads to the most interesting conversations.

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

Just to clear it up. More hp and tq contributes to quicker acceleration and a higher top speed. Ceteris Paribus.

I know it got a little back-and-forth, but did you read the original post I was responding too? I'll quote it below:

Originally Posted by aerostar

M240i xDrive will most likely be slightly faster in a straight line.

Just to clear it up, my point was that the M240i xDrive will likely be quicker 0-60 because it has AWD, but not faster in top speed, because the M2 has more HP and torque. Mutatis mutandis.

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

This debate is so moot. Just wait for the car to come out and see what kind of times it posts. I think it's safe to assume any 240i variant will perform better in a straight line than the like 235i predecessor.

What's moot is any comparison to the M235i, because no one in the conversation I was responding to made any reference to it.

[boostm3]

Originally Posted by cntzl

Even a stock M240i might be as fast or faster than M2 on a straight line. 340i has 320hp claimed on paper but on dyno it puts down around 330whp stock. Considering M2's recent dyno runs and M240i's 335hp on paper, I wouldn't be surprised if M240i is quicker on a drag race. However, I would still prefer M2 since it's the total package although M240i with LSD is a pretty damn good alternative to M2.

Even without the LSD, I think the adaptive suspension that comes with the M240 (assuming its still part of the pkg) is a big win for cars that are more street cars and less track cars, which probably applies to most forum members.

[Mywifes335]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

That's exactly what I said.

This isn't the general vernacular; it's a car forum. I would assume that since we're all here spending our time talking about cars we like, we have a common interest in being able to communicate (accurately) what we're trying to say about automotive performance, yeah? People can choose to be informed and not take offense to clarification, or they can choose to remain ignorant in order to preserve their fragile self-confidence. Or they can take the third option and provide some cogent basis for why they feel it should be otherwise. Personally, I prefer the latter, because it leads to the most interesting conversations.


I know it got a little back-and-forth, but did you read the original post I was responding too? I'll quote it below:



Just to clear it up, my point was that the M240i xDrive will likely be quicker 0-60 because it has AWD, but not faster in top speed, because the M2 has more HP and torque. Mutatis mutandis.



What's moot is any comparison to the M235i, because no one in the conversation I was responding to made any reference to it.

Touché. Although I think we fundamentally agree.

My comment regarding the M240i vs M235i, or any definitive speculation regarding the performance of the M240i in this thread (not the specific conversation you're citing) is moot.

Yes, I did read the original post you were responding to.

As such, despite this being an automotive forum, I've learned that it's virtually impossible to expect the lowest common denominator (anybody whom has a BMW) to exhibit absolute language congruence. Vita progreditur.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by Mywifes335

Touché. Although I think we fundamentally agree.

Indeed, we do.