[Pparana]

Having owned a m235 and a c 450 amg at the same time (wife's) , the Amg was nicely done up on the inside, made nice sounds, but was garbage on driving experience.

Merc is a pushy pig at the limits, stock 235 needs some help, but is much more agile and connected. You can drive the bmw at 10/10ths and it will be controllable, just understeers. merc was a 7/10ths car unless in a straight line, you can not place the car consistently on apex at 10/10ths. More of a mini muscle car than a sports sedan.

If you actually like driving get a bmw, if you don't get the Benz, I assure you the Benz will look dated and old in a few years.

Benz lasted 6 months before traded in for a Lexus. Benz was in dealer 6 times, told wife if it has no feel, mine as well be dependable, so Lexus it was.

Bmw is so easily modded, huge community of information. Def. the easiest cheapest car to individualize.

[wtfbrah]

Originally Posted by Pparana

Having owned a m235 and a c 450 amg at the same time (wife's) , the Amg was nicely done up on the inside, made nice sounds, but was garbage on driving experience.

Merc is a pushy pig at the limits, stock 235 needs some help, but is much more agile and connected. You can drive the bmw at 10/10ths and it will be controllable, just understeers. merc was a 7/10ths car unless in a straight line, you can not place the car consistently on apex at 10/10ths. More of a mini muscle car than a sports sedan.

If you actually like driving get a bmw, if you don't get the Benz, I assure you the Benz will look dated and old in a few years.

Benz lasted 6 months before traded in for a Lexus. Benz was in dealer 6 times, told wife if it has no feel, mine as well be dependable, so Lexus it was.

Bmw is so easily modded, huge community of information. Def. the easiest cheapest car to individualize.

Thanks, that's really helpful input.

Although I am looking at the xDrive M240 (I live at the very tip top of a fairly long and steep hill and it can slow a good amount in southern Ohio, and it will be my only car), so I'm not sure how much that affects the superiority of the driving dynamics.

[Pparana]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

Thanks, that's really helpful input.

Although I am looking at the xDrive M240 (I live at the very tip top of a fairly long and steep hill and it can slow a good amount in southern Ohio, and it will be my only car), so I'm not sure how much that affects the superiority of the driving dynamics.

Snow tires, grew up in Buffalo NY, driving on snow and ice is a blast! Only thing I miss.

If you need a reliable/ only car I would not get the Benz. Could have just been ours, but we have had 2 be in the past 4 years, a 13 gl and the 450, both had many issues in build quality. I am done with that brand.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

In the end, the M240i is probably the right car for me. It made me laugh when I drove it, what more can you ask of a car?

It sounds like it made a lasting impression, the same happened to me when cross shopping with the Golf R. To me, not many cars can do that these days...

Also, the looks of this car will last quite some time in my opinion. It still retains a lot of the old school BMW heritage, but has all of the sleek sharp edges and modern tech surrounding it to keep it relevant, without taking it over the top. All the more reason to have a nice long PAID OFF ownership

D

[wtfbrah]

Originally Posted by Pparana

Snow tires, grew up in Buffalo NY, driving on snow and ice is a blast! Only thing I miss.

Yeah...

I've heard as much. Only thing is, I've only driven the xDrive M235i. Here in Cinci it's difficult to find a RWD one. If a forum member was willing to let me drive one, that would be cool - but that's probably a long shot.

So the only thing I've been able to do is test drive a 340i and 340i xDrive, and I honestly liked the feel of the 340i xDrive more.

I feel like I'll be doing a lot of driving under 70 mph and the absolute grip of the 4wd getting power to the ground helps under those circumstances as I understand it. I know the RWD is better for "fun", for getting the rear end out and for higher speeds, but I haven't had that experience yet, so I'm reluctant to spend 50k on a car I haven't driven yet when I know I like the xDrive version.

[griz31]

Originally Posted by 3.0L

To the OP:

Since you seem to be unhappy with your car, why not trade it in on something that you can truly love?

What is the point of bitching about your M235i; the car you actually bought and ultimately don't like? Jeepers dude, just about every car enthusiast has ended up with a car they don't like. Frig, get rid of it. Put both you and your car out of your misery and sell it to someone who will enjoy it.

Free yourself!

Haha, why so aggressive? I don't think I ever said I hate the car or that it is in any way a misery to drive. I do really like the car it just left a little to be desired from past experiences. Odviously I'm not the only one and I think overall it sparked some really good discussion. Just sharing my thoughts with you lovely strangers

In any case, I believe I mentioned it in another post but I am leasing the vehicle and would most likely take a huge financial loss trying to trade it in. The car is by no means miserable enough for me to throw money away. It does a lot of things right, and that will do for now.

[bimmerfile]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

Because a car isn't 100% about looks?

If I don't like how it looks but it's a joy to drive with the top down, wouldn't you say that's worth it?

Ummmmm, no!
You stated that you didn't like the looks of a convertible and didn't care for the interior and didn't find it very roomy or didn't like the gas mileage it gets - and that, in general, it's not an attractive car (aka "looker"), then I sure as heck wouldn't have plunked down $65K for my ragtop.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by griz31

I want to start out by saying that I really like this car a lot. It is a great balance between luxury and sport and is really a great looking car. With that being said, I am having a hard time really loving this car.

Background: Previously owned a 2011 335i. Wanted to upgrade. Briefly owned a 2008 M3, which was awesome, but there were just too many issues with it to keep so reluctantly returned it under carmax return policy. Currently leasing 2016 m235i.

I posted my initial thoughts when I first picked up the car and mentioned that at the time I felt it was the perfect car for my situation. I felt it offered better daily driver qualities while still offering 8-9/10's of what the M3 had. After the honeymoon period, I have been able to reflect on it more. In all honesty, if I had never driven the m3 I would have never known. While I think it is a great step up from the 335i in terms of enjoyment, it just leaves something to be desired compared to the m3. Here are my key points:

Handling: The m3 felt like it was on rails. The steering feel and limited body roll gave me an experience I didn't realize was possible in a car. While I don't think the electric steering is as bad as people make it out to be in the 235, it just can't compare to the m3. The body movement in the 235 is a bit disappointing as it doesn't inspire nearly as much confidence going around a corner as the m3.

Engine: N/A vs. FI I know you've heard it all. Nothing can compare to the raw excitement that the N/A V8 noise makes and I don't think anyone really debates that. My biggest issue is the consistency. With a turbo, weather becomes a huge factor. On a really hot day, the car doesn't perform near what its capable of. Getting in a car and not knowing how its going to feel that day is a bit discouraging. While the V8 didn't have the low end torque, it was the same every day.

I know this turned into a bit of a comparison, but wanted to give reasons and explanation as to why I feel this way. While I do think the 235 is a great luxury and sports car, I feel the balance is more on the luxury side than I would have preferred. The m235i has all the creature comforts of a brand new car, plenty fast, decent handling, and a full warranty. On paper the m235i was 100% the right car for me and I really like it, but in terms of heart and emotion (at least compared to the m3) I just can't bring myself to truly love it.

Does anyone feel this way or has anyone had these feelings in the past? Is there anything that you did to make you truly love the car over any other options out there? Am I jaded after the m3, or were my expectations too high from what others were saying about the m235i? Am I just being ridiculous and expecting too much out of a perfectly good car?

My dream is to one day have a car that I can say, wow this is it I don't want anything else. Being a car enthusiast, I am not sure if that is possible. All I can say is that while I really like the m235i, I can't help but spend most of my time looking at what's next.

I totally understand your predicament and I was in the same boat having sold my 1M. When 235 came out the hype was enormous because it was as fast as 1M. But after driving it, I was dissapointed too. Too soft, heavy and quiet. I got blasted then because 235 people were saying it was better value and all-around etc. and it IS great value in low trim pricing but it didn't really wow! We spend a lot of money on these cars because we want to be wowed! Yet so many want to be "good-all-a rounded". If you want that buy a Camry for half the money or civic si or gti. These are 40-50k cars . They should WOW. For those that came from slower less inspiring cars they are happy but if you've driven an inspiring car it's hard to go back. Don't feel bad. I made the same mistake in 2003. I always wanted an e46 but I had a newborn. I felt I had to be semi practical and I read a review in the Acura TSX saying it was a 3 series for less money. I had been driving cool sporty cars before like modified Scirocco S, Sentra SE-R. It was a total dissapointment. Awful car. Piece of non-car-guy garbage. I sold it 10 months later at a huge loss and now all I could afford was used 325i MT Sport. Best thing I ever did.

So now you've taken a hit and not trying to rub salt. Just writing this for others to follow your gut. I remember my gutt telling me TSX was too buzzy and luxury minded. My gutt was right. You spend too much for ho-hum. I hope you can find something inspiring again! I ended up buying another 1M and funny but I also have a 2003 ZHP as daily driver. The car I really wanted in 2003 when I tried to go practical! Best wishes!

[Kolyan2k]

These cars can't be WOW because there are M cars that supposed to do that. It was always like that. So while M235 can perhaps compete with previous generation M, M cars will still feel like a better driver machines

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

These cars can't be WOW because there are M cars that supposed to do that. It was always like that.

Fair enough but M235i has more M badges than my 1M Coupe so it can be a little misleading for people.

[Kolyan2k]

Originally Posted by nachob

Fair enough but M235i has more M badges than my 1M Coupe so it can be a little misleading for people.

Mine was stripped. I think it's an "option" to debage in Germany.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

Mine was stripped. I think it's an "option" to debage in Germany.

. Very cool. Funny my ZHP is de-badged in SoCal.

Anyway, I feel for poster. I have been there myself.

[wtfbrah]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

Mine was stripped. I think it's an "option" to debage in Germany.

Hmm, you didn't like the M235i / M240i badge on the back?

I've thought about de-badging when I order, but then what separates it from the 230i M-sport? Well, besides the engine

[Kolyan2k]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

Hmm, you didn't like the M235i / M240i badge on the back?

I've thought about de-badging when I order, but then what separates it from the 230i M-sport? Well, besides the engine

It was done by previous owner, I only have small M badges on plate frames now.

He did it because most cars in Europe are debaged (at least BMWs are)

[BPAC306]

My 2 pennies...

This is the problem with someones personal taste / opinion and trying to have others "convince" them otherwise.

Example, the OP buys a sausage pizza but prefers only cheese.... then asks others about why he is having a had time enjoying sausage.

This just makes me laugh and this post could actually could discourage other people to buy this vehicle.

I bought this car because I want a small fast car that is luxurious, AWD, good on gas, daily driver and lastly a BMW

I came from the Mustang community (owned 4) you wouldn't believe the crap that owners post / have issues about. I was amazed on the minimal number or REAL issues with this type of vehicle. Not to get off topic but you like what you like, if you dont like it get something different and try not to put silly thoughts into other buyers minds

Btw - this clip below puts a smile on my face and makes me very happy with my purchase.

[griz31]

Originally Posted by nachob

They should WOW. For those that came from slower less inspiring cars they are happy but if you've driven an inspiring car it's hard to go back. Don't feel bad....

This is what it comes down to for me it just doesn't quite WOW me. Also - enjoy reading through your posts on 1addicts and hope to get the pleasure of driving a 1M someday!

Originally Posted by BPAC306

My 2 pennies...

This is the problem with someones personal taste / opinion and trying to have others "convince" them otherwise.

Example, the OP buys a sausage pizza but prefers only cheese.... then asks others about why he is having a had time enjoying sausage.

This just makes me laugh and this post could actually could discourage other people to buy this vehicle.

I bought this car because I want a small fast car that is luxurious, AWD, good on gas, daily driver and lastly a BMW

I came from the Mustang community (owned 4) you wouldn't believe the crap that owners post / have issues about. I was amazed on the minimal number or REAL issues with this type of vehicle. Not to get off topic but you like what you like, if you dont like it get something different and try not to put silly thoughts into other buyers minds

Hey man, I get it - we all have our own tastes! Multiple times I have stated that this is a really great car and don't intend to sway anyone away from trying it themselves. I think this thread has done the exact opposite actually in providing GREAT insight for those researching vehicles in this segment. Lots of discussion on ways to improve, other cars to consider, and reasons why some feel it's the best damn car ever!

Look I'll be the first to admit that I'm indecisive and have a lot of years of driving ahead. I think it really comes down to not knowing exactly what I wanted, or having enough time to see if it was what I truly wanted. I still get giddy test driving new cars and can be completely impulsive in my emotions with any new car.

Anyways, Not trying to take anything away from the 235 as it is a great machine. I think my intention of this post came through to the majority of people. A lot of great discussion.

[Dylan86]

BMW obviously branded this car with an M first for some reason, as it's focused to a performance oriented market that doesn't want a balls out M car to drive to work every day or to pay the premium for that M car. It's not built like an older 540iM (for example) which was mostly cosmetic branding and didn't really have anything significant that brought it close to the M5, and they were spread apart in actual performance/power. The adaptive M suspension, brembo brakes 3.0L Turbo engine with a 300+hp/tq starting point, factory supplied Michelin PSS's on the 2 series all point in the direction of performance. Sure the M2 gets you more HP, larger brakes, wider track, swole body work, but to me that's about all I can think that's really setting the car apart. The hp, brakes, and body work, blue stitching on the seats aren't convincing enough for me to feel like the M2 is that "far superior" so the M235/240. An M2 owner may feel this way though, obviously.. Each person will have their views/opinions on this of course, and this is my thought on the branding side of the car versus what you actually get in real world performance AND what you are ACTUALLY going to do with the car when you own it. I think the gap between these cars is so small, it's beneficial to look at the model that was built for the every day driver, so we are not unsatisfied with every day driving (most of us drive this car daily) since that's the primary intent. Secondly is performance, which if you want more than what BMW gave you it's as simple as a couple grand (or less) in bolt on mods that are very safe and "reliable" to some degree.

The 235/240 with a JB4, DP, IC along with some M2/3/4 suspension mods and some proper brake pads can totally transform ones thought of performance limiting factors of the current model. So much room to grow, but so little are willing to do so these days, it seems. So that said, if you want it all and never want to upgrade or individualize your car, a full M model is the way to go and may cost less initially.

I could beat this to death, but it's what I preach when people ask "why didn't you go for an M2/3" etc. Nothing to do with price point or all out factory performance, more so long term ownership, low dollar power adders, and the potential to modify and make it to the next level when time permits itself. I bet there's quite a few guys on these boards that will be faster than the M2's on the same track with the bolt ons and suspension mods they have done so far, which shows the tuning potential of the car. Yes, the M2 will be tunable too, and that's another topic of discussion as to how you'll get more power down at that level...

I love debates like this, especially as I'm still learning a lot about the brand and 2 series itself, and of course the possibilities.

D

[kdog26372]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

Yeah...

I've heard as much. Only thing is, I've only driven the xDrive M235i. Here in Cinci it's difficult to find a RWD one. If a forum member was willing to let me drive one, that would be cool - but that's probably a long shot.

So the only thing I've been able to do is test drive a 340i and 340i xDrive, and I honestly liked the feel of the 340i xDrive more.

I feel like I'll be doing a lot of driving under 70 mph and the absolute grip of the 4wd getting power to the ground helps under those circumstances as I understand it. I know the RWD is better for "fun", for getting the rear end out and for higher speeds, but I haven't had that experience yet, so I'm reluctant to spend 50k on a car I haven't driven yet when I know I like the xDrive version.

Whether you get AWD or RWD you should have summer tires for 9 months of year and winter tires for 3 months if you are in the upper midwest. I've had the RWD 135i and now AWD m235i; I greatly prefer the AWD car and don't find that I'm missing anything in the fun department from the RWD and that car I added an LSD and tune. What I do like is regardless or dry, rain, or snow I've got a car that does excellent in all those conditions. Also, if you plan to tune your car, you will get much better acceleration from a stop vs. spinning tires in the AWD version, this is amplified even more so in just light drizzle conditions and around corners.

The M235i is the only car/non-SUV in BMW's lineup that has the same suspension as the RWD counterpart when choosing AWD. The 335 and 535 are both mushy and raised suspensions vs. the RWD versions. So, if you preferred AWD in the 340 it will be that much better in the 240.

RWD with snows vs AWD with snows on a steep his is no comparison during a snow storm. Also, where I live in Chicago they don't plow the alley's and you have to go back and forth over ruts to get out of parking spots, this is a non issue with AWD and snows, but was an adventure in the 135i w/snows.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by wtfbrah

Thanks, that's really helpful input.

Although I am looking at the xDrive M240 (I live at the very tip top of a fairly long and steep hill and it can slow a good amount in southern Ohio, and it will be my only car), so I'm not sure how much that affects the superiority of the driving dynamics.

There's the weight but similar to the MB the AWD itself is rear biased, unlike an S3 or that CLA nonsense. Look at it this way - you're not Lewis Hamilton. And even if you were, 240 xDrive will have better driving dynamics than a 240 RWD when both are starting to slide down your hill in February. I've got a 235 RWD now and will be getting an xDrive next time. And going down to 17" rims w 40 rubber year round. There's track day ideal then real world ideal, based on where you are and what the roads are like.

[Viffermike]

Almost all -- emphasis on 'almost' -- of this discussion is not constructive at all for anyone, which is why I said what I said here.

To rephrase: Each person has a different set of standards, with different priorities, by which to judge what's best for them no matter what that 'what' is: car, musical instrument, spouse, college, cemetery to be buried in (and who to be buried next to), whatever. No one else can help sort those out better than that person.

Sure, you can share your points of view, criteria, past experiences, etc. with other people -- what the OP has done -- but in the end those other people aren't going to come close to giving you constructive feedback about your predilections unless they know you much better than any of us know the OP.

It really is that simple. Most of the posts here are simply re-hashes of individual philosophies on what car is best for themself and no one else. Not even wisdom about each individual experience can really be transferred in the context of this discussion. It can be empathized with, yes, but it's really not constructive.

OP: It's your decision based on your experience (i.e., you've had an M3) and your philosophy. Nothing is a bit wrong with how you feel. If it doesn't move you, move on.

[nachob]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

BMW obviously branded this car with an M first for some reason, as it's focused to a performance oriented market that doesn't want a balls out M car to drive to work every day or to pay the premium for that M car. It's not built like an older 540iM (for example) which was mostly cosmetic branding and didn't really have anything significant that brought it close to the M5, and they were spread apart in actual performance/power. The adaptive M suspension, brembo brakes 3.0L Turbo engine with a 300+hp/tq starting point, factory supplied Michelin PSS's on the 2 series all point in the direction of performance. Sure the M2 gets you more HP, larger brakes, wider track, swole body work, but to me that's about all I can think that's really setting the car apart. The hp, brakes, and body work, blue stitching on the seats aren't convincing enough for me to feel like the M2 is that "far superior" so the M235/240. An M2 owner may feel this way though, obviously.. Each person will have their views/opinions on this of course, and this is my thought on the branding side of the car versus what you actually get in real world performance AND what you are ACTUALLY going to do with the car when you own it. I think the gap between these cars is so small, it's beneficial to look at the model that was built for the every day driver, so we are not unsatisfied with every day driving (most of us drive this car daily) since that's the primary intent. Secondly is performance, which if you want more than what BMW gave you it's as simple as a couple grand (or less) in bolt on mods that are very safe and "reliable" to some degree.

The 235/240 with a JB4, DP, IC along with some M2/3/4 suspension mods and some proper brake pads can totally transform ones thought of performance limiting factors of the current model. So much room to grow, but so little are willing to do so these days, it seems. So that said, if you want it all and never want to upgrade or individualize your car, a full M model is the way to go and may cost less initially.

I could beat this to death, but it's what I preach when people ask "why didn't you go for an M2/3" etc. Nothing to do with price point or all out factory performance, more so long term ownership, low dollar power adders, and the potential to modify and make it to the next level when time permits itself. I bet there's quite a few guys on these boards that will be faster than the M2's on the same track with the bolt ons and suspension mods they have done so far, which shows the tuning potential of the car. Yes, the M2 will be tunable too, and that's another topic of discussion as to how you'll get more power down at that level...

I love debates like this, especially as I'm still learning a lot about the brand and 2 series itself, and of course the possibilities.

D

This debate for some reason keeps coming up. With the 1M it was the same thing. If you put a JB tune on 135i it's as fast as a 1M therefore makes no sense to buy one. same thing with M2 applies but that is only on its surface and really misses real differences. For example the 1M had aluminum suspension bits and even the strut housings were aluminum. The steering rack was much quicker than 135i rack which is necessary to catch the tail often. It has a full lock M diff and large M3 composite brakes that M decided we're more robust for track than the pretty 135i units. The body is not a bolt on body kit but actual rear fenders with more room for the huge tires. The result was that with added diff, bigger brakes, bigger tires it still weighed less than 135i. This is another point were the uninformed use. They say 1M only weighs 80lbs less than 135i so doesn't make sense. Yes but that is 80lbs huge diff and bigger brakes and other components. The same applies to the M2. It has things you can't see and it sounds great from outside. Also most people get them loaded further weakening the value argument. The one real pisser is that in USA you don't get the option for taking off the luxury stuff which adds weight. This is bad and lame of BMWNA. But on 1M you did have the choice for no power seats, no power folding mirrors, no parking sensors and idrive and other stuff that dilutes the actual driving experience with weight and distraction . So I respectfully disagree with the tune makes car equivalent to M car. It's like saying Canadians and Americans are the same because they both like hamburgers. There is more to it.

Finally, the point of this thread was to empathize with the poster because I have been where he is. I used to love Papa Johns pizza then I went to study in Paris where I had pizza in this little joint for six months. I still get Papa Johns and it's good pizza especially for the price and my kids love it but for me, after having that thin pizza in Paris it has never been as enjoyable. Nothing wrong with it, but hard to enjoy it after you've had amazing pizza.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by nachob

Finally, the point of this thread was to empathize with the poster because I have been where he is. I used to love Papa Johns pizza then I went to study in Paris where I had pizza in this little joint for six months. I still get Papa Johns and it's good pizza especially for the price and my kids love it but for me, after having that thin pizza in Paris it has never been as enjoyable. Nothing wrong with it, but hard to enjoy it after you've had amazing pizza.

Look no further than DelMar, Sheepshead Bay, Brooklyn.