[Red Bread]

Does the weight listed include a driver, or is it just fluids but no driver?

In other words, is it possible that a low option 228i could be under 3100 pounds without a driver? It's listed as 3,260 on BMWUSA.

[xl5]

Isn't dry weight without fluids and curb weight with? At any rate, no driver.

[ska///235i]

lol not including driver weight

[Red Bread]

Thanks, back to ignoring the 2er.

[ska///235i]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Thanks, back to ignoring the 2er.

The S3 sedan is only 3100 lbs...just saying

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by ska325xi

The S3 sedan is only 3100 lbs...just saying

Yep, and the Golf R may be under 3k and has a bigger back seat than the S3.

Now if only Audi/VW would stop using a stupid timing belt on that motor.

[ska///235i]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Yep, and the Golf R may be under 3k and has a bigger back seat than the S3.

Now if only Audi/VW would stop using a stupid timing belt on that motor.

Whats the issues with their T-belts?

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by ska325xi

Whats the issues with their T-belts?

Just that it's a belt instead of a chain and requires replacement at or before 60k miles. The lower power 2.0T has been using a chain since 2010 or so, but the higher output 2.0T is based on older architecture and still uses a belt. Not a huge issue, but I still prefer a chain.

Edit - I may be incorrect on this, official info is that this motor is based on the new EA888 and while it lists a new head as a difference from the GTI motor, it does appear it's retained the timing chain. Very interesting, the list of negatives for the R are getting very short if this is true.

No timing belt, fully defeatable DSC, available manual, five door only for US, around 3,000 pounds.

[rca06Mcoupe]

I am glad to see this discussion on the merits / demerits of Golf-R and S3 as I am leaning toward 4 doors and Very little has been said lately about the supposidly fast tracked BMW 2 series grand coupe

[ska///235i]

As much as i hate the idea of GCs...i would love to see a M235GC

[bimmer4life24]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Just that it's a belt instead of a chain and requires replacement at or before 60k miles. The lower power 2.0T has been using a chain since 2010 or so, but the higher output 2.0T is based on older architecture and still uses a belt. Not a huge issue, but I still prefer a chain.

Edit - I may be incorrect on this, official info is that this motor is based on the new EA888 and while it lists a new head as a difference from the GTI motor, it does appear it's retained the timing chain. Very interesting, the list of negatives for the R are getting very short if this is true.

No timing belt, fully defeatable DSC, available manual, five door only for US, around 3,000 pounds.

+1

Can't wait till I get a hold of the R and S3 later this year. One of those should be my next car...

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by bimmer4life24

+1

Can't wait till I get a hold of the R and S3 later this year. One of those should be my next car...

Current rumors are that the R will be available from the start with a manual and the S3 may or may not offer one. That plus the added rear seat room of the Golf over the A3 swing me heavily toward the VW. Conveniently, both dealers are within a mile of my house.

[bimmer4life24]

Originally Posted by Red Bread

Current rumors are that the R will be available from the start with a manual and the S3 may or may not offer one. That plus the added rear seat room of the Golf over the A3 swing me heavily toward the VW. Conveniently, both dealers are within a mile of my house.

S3 will come DSG only to the states. And the reviews of the rear seat room on the S3 have been surprisingly good thus far. It's been voted better than the CLA.

But the R is going to be one hell of a car. If manual is the way you wanna go, that must be your next car.

[IEDEI]

the M235i = 3505 lbs (according to BMW USA)

massive, massive fail. 130+lbs heavier than the 135is.....probably all due to electronic crap!

[Red Bread]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

the M235i = 3505 lbs (according to BMW USA)

massive, massive fail. 130+lbs heavier than the 135is.....probably all due to electronic crap!

Agreed, we had a 135i that combined with the lack of an LSD and the crap suspension was not a car I've missed for one second. Adding even more weight ruled that out. I was hoping the 228i would be lighter than the E82 128i, but that was not to be.

I'd still say that for me rwd > full time awd > Haldex > fwd, but with no sight of a BRZ STI, the VW/Audi twins are really leading this for me. The S3 is coming in at 10.7 lb/hp, while a 228i is 13.6 and the M235i is 11.0, considering the sizable price advantage the Golf R and S3 will have over the BMW and the fact that the Golf R should have an even better power to weight ratio along with a proper number of doors, I just can't get excited about the BMWs.

But enough dogging the car that this forum is about, off to deal with the humorless world of the Vortex...

[Vervain]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

the M235i = 3505 lbs (according to BMW USA)

massive, massive fail. 130+lbs heavier than the 135is.....probably all due to electronic crap!

It's probably why they had to boost the power on the M235i to compete.

The detuned new S3 (206 kW from 221 kW - It's sad) in SA is pushing the same 0-100 numbers as the M235i with much less power less power and torque. It's really impressive. But quattro helps a lot with that.

[nefilim]

Originally Posted by Anodite10

It's probably why they had to boost the power on the M235i to compete.

The detuned new S3 (206 kW from 221 kW - It's sad) in SA is pushing the same 0-100 numbers as the M235i with much less power less power and torque. It's really impressive. But quattro helps a lot with that.

so does the substantial weight difference meneer

[Wakka]

am i the only one that thinks the 2 is ugly? like... really ugly.

[ska///235i]

Originally Posted by Wakka

am i the only one that thinks the 2 is ugly? like... really ugly.

Yes, you're alone

[xl5]

Ugly? No, but it doesn't jump out as particularly remarkable. I'm hopeful it looks better in the flesh. The 4 sure does.

I have to say, it's hard not to cross-shop the new Mustang, despite its size.

[Fume]

Originally Posted by Wakka

am i the only one that thinks the 2 is ugly? like... really ugly.

Not sure if I would call it ugly but I'm definitely not a fan of the styling of the F series BMW in general. Something about the shape of the hood and the front grill really bothers me. Not that the 1er is a really pretty car either. Personally, I really liked the look of the e92 and e46 and wish they made the styling more on those lines but whatever. I'm sure this will grow on me eventually.

[Greenkirby21]

The BMW website says it has knee airbags.. do we believe this? :P