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      03-14-2014, 01:04 PM   #1
hector
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8-speed manual mode

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don't want to reignite the manual vs auto debate; just have a specific question about the 8-speed: although i generally prefer manual, i am considering the ZF for the 228; i did enjoy my wife's 6-speed steptronic in her 2003 330ci but am just wondering, not having driven the 8-speed, is 8 just too many gears to manually shift?; between choosing the proper gear and double or triple shifting i't seems that it would be a bit cumbersome. any thoughts? thx.
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      03-14-2014, 01:08 PM   #2
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I have the ZF8 in my 335 and you don't need to shift up past 6th gear for normal driving. 7th at 80+ probably and 8th is really just a high efficiency gear. When the car is in sport or sport+ in automatic mode it doesn't ever shift into 8th that I have found.
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      03-14-2014, 01:08 PM   #3
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Sounds cumbersome to me if you're going to paddle shift it all the time.
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      03-14-2014, 01:21 PM   #4
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Can you get 8 speed manual mode in the 228 then? Thought it was just 235 that had sports auto
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      03-14-2014, 02:05 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by M.barnes View Post
Can you get 8 speed manual mode in the 228 then? Thought it was just 235 that had sports auto
Sports Auto with Paddles is standard on the 228.
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      03-14-2014, 02:05 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hector View Post
is 8 just too many gears to manually shift?; between choosing the proper gear and double or triple shifting i't seems that it would be a bit cumbersome. any thoughts? thx.
I have the ZF 8 speed on my 535i. Yes, 8 is too many gears, too close together. Most owners will play with the paddles a few times and then leave it in auto til the lease is up.

The ZF if a wonderful automatic but I wouldn't get anything but the 6 speed on a 235.
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      03-14-2014, 02:13 PM   #7
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My wife's 335 has the 8 speed with paddles and I use it every few times I'm driving. It's nice to have when you need to pass someone in a short passing zone, or if you want to just have a more spirited drive. I wouldn't say it's useless or cumbersome.
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      03-14-2014, 03:20 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by webdither View Post
Sports Auto with Paddles is standard on the 228.
Not true. I drove one with no options. No paddles.
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      03-14-2014, 03:25 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by darkerosxx
Quote:
Originally Posted by webdither View Post
Sports Auto with Paddles is standard on the 228.
Not true. I drove one with no options. No paddles.
Strange. The online configurator says it's standard and shows paddles on the no line 228.
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      03-14-2014, 03:37 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by darkerosxx View Post
Not true. I drove one with no options. No paddles.
The sports auto with paddles is standard even on the 228i. Some dealerships accidentally ticked the "steptronic" option which reverts you back to the regular (non-sport auto) 8spd transmission without the paddle shifters. I'm not sure why BMW even lets dealers have this option- no need for it and only causes confusion. Check the window sticker and see if it says "steptronic" automatic transmission on there and you will have your answer.
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      03-14-2014, 03:47 PM   #11
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I'm a die hard manual person when it comes to my fun car. My 135i was a manual, despite the option of the DCT in the 135i. We have the ZF8 (non sport) in our X3, and I've driven a handful of ZF8 sport equipped BMWs. Most recently, I tried out the M235i with the ZF8, because they didn't have a manual. It's definitely the most impressive torque converter automatic I've ever driven. It's very, very close to the DCT. I don't know if they've updated the programming in the M235i variant, but I didn't find the input lag nearly as bad as it was in the F30 I tried it in.

I think you've really put your finger on the thing that discourages me from buying the auto though. Flipping through 8 gears is a lot of tapping. I like to drive our X3 in manual mode, because the auto program does a poor job of anticipating my needs. In that car, I go from manual flapping to straight D very quickly, because the shifts are so slow and there are no paddles. In my 135i, I could easily skip shift. I could accelerate quickly through 1st and 2nd, then skip shift straight to 6th. You can't skip gears with the ZF.

Having said that, in the M235i, the extra responsiveness of the transmission made manual shifting much more enjoyable. Also keep in mind what others have posted. You won't use 7th gear below 40 MPH, and 8th isn't useful until you're at highway speeds. I would say that the transmission feels like the first 7 gears are equivalent to the range you'd get with a 6-speed manual, so there's only one extra gear. The 8th gear feels really long.

Don't hesitate to get some seat time in a ZF equipped car. Head down to the dealer and make it clear that you're uncertain. If they give you a hard time, find another dealer.
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      03-14-2014, 03:50 PM   #12
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No paddles here:

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      03-14-2014, 05:33 PM   #13
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I have the 8 speed sport auto with paddles in my '14 X1 and do enjoy using them. But I certainly don't use them all the time. When I'm not using them I always drive in DS mode...D just up shifts too early for my taste.

Like someone else said here, if you are paddling through the gears you can ignore 7 and 8. Just use 1-6. The X1 can hit 60 in 2nd gear so there is tremendous flexibility in the transmission and the turbo 4 to have lots of fun in just the first 3 gears. I would get the manual in the M235i if I could...but my wife needs to be able to drive the car on occasion and I can't for the life of me get her interested in learning to drive a manual. So it's a good thing the sport auto is a fantastic tranny.
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      03-15-2014, 11:10 AM   #14
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I'm a manual transmission guy but we have the 8sped sport auto in my wife's 328 sport line. Whenever I'm driving it I always drive it in manual mode, otherwise I just get bored driving it. I don't like the car doing the shifting for me - and I certainly don't find it cumbersome flicking up and down the gears.

I usually drive in a higher gear and just flip down 2 or 3 gears when I need that rush of torque to pass someone or just feel like a spirited drive. It is a really good transmission with fairly quick shifts in manual mode.
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      03-15-2014, 01:32 PM   #15
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I haven't had a chance to try it in a sport automatic eight speed, but when I had my M3 with DCT if you stumped the gas all the way down and pull and hold the paddle it would drop down as many gears as possible without over revving. Sometimes as many as four gears. Someone should try and see if the eight speed in the M235 will do that.
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      03-15-2014, 01:57 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by numbersguy View Post
I have the ZF 8 speed on my 535i. Yes, 8 is too many gears, too close together. Most owners will play with the paddles a few times and then leave it in auto til the lease is up.

The ZF if a wonderful automatic but I wouldn't get anything but the 6 speed on a 235.
I was drinking the 8AT sport paddle flavored Kool Aid for about 6 months. Now I feel exactly like this. Exactly. Too many gears. Too close together. Too boring.
Cant wait to get back into a manual. I will say that "cumbersome" is not the right word to describe driving it in manual mode. "Artificial" is a better description IMO.
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      03-17-2014, 07:37 AM   #17
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appreciate the responses; lots of good insight! still leaning manual, lol, but will probably test-drive the zf sport.
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      03-17-2014, 09:01 AM   #18
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Coming from an Audi S4, the reason why this car won out over the competition (Audi S3 and MB CLA45 AMG) was because of the manual.
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      03-17-2014, 09:38 AM   #19
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Drove the 8 speed, impressive for sure, but still feels heavy to me. I am a purist though and would always choose a MT in a sports coupe or sportscar when available.
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      03-17-2014, 09:44 AM   #20
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If you're manually shifting, you wont ever go near 7th or 8th, and probably not even sixth either, which negates any argument that there are "too many gears". It's certainly an issue if you're driving in eco or normal mode and cruising around in 8th, because if you need to get a large amount of acceleration the transmission has to drop 4 or 5 gears. But you can drive in sport mode for that. If it's done similarly to the ZF8 in my IS350, sport/sport+ in auto mode will not shift past 6th gear, which means less gears to drop when you step on it which means faster shifting.
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      03-17-2014, 11:17 AM   #21
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Can you also use the Eco Mode with the manual transmission?
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      03-17-2014, 11:29 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WWM View Post
If you're manually shifting, you wont ever go near 7th or 8th, and probably not even sixth either, which negates any argument that there are "too many gears". It's certainly an issue if you're driving in eco or normal mode and cruising around in 8th, because if you need to get a large amount of acceleration the transmission has to drop 4 or 5 gears. But you can drive in sport mode for that. If it's done similarly to the ZF8 in my IS350, sport/sport+ in auto mode will not shift past 6th gear, which means less gears to drop when you step on it which means faster shifting.
interesting; you did address one of my main concerns, specifically, the multiple gears downshift!
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