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      04-12-2015, 02:29 PM   #1
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(Solved)Manual transmission issue - Can't downshift to 2nd gear

Hi guys. I am happy to join the 2 Series family. My previous car was an old 2000 BMW 323ci 5MT and I loved that car for the 3 years that I owned it.

Now after having my new 228i 6-Speed for a bit over one month. I noticed a rather serious problem right away.

The car has 2000 km on the odometer, and within the past 50 km or so. It started to develop problems downshifting to 2nd and only the 2nd gear 70% of the time. Upshifting from 1st to 2nd is perfect.

For example:
I am at 3th gear at 3000 rpm, clutch in, blip the throttle to about 4500, push the shifter into 2nd gear position, and it won't go in! The shifter would refuse to shift into 2nd gear until the engine has dropped down to idle and then it would finally open up the 2nd gear gate.

I have also tried double clutching. Which still did not help.

Is this an issue with the synchro? Or simply gearbox is not worn in yet.
This only happened in the past 50 km or so. Never had this problem on my old e46 BMW 5-speed with over 280,000 km

Thanks everyone and I hope this isn't a common problem.

Last edited by Merc for hire; 08-06-2015 at 12:30 PM..
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      04-12-2015, 02:43 PM   #2
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Hard to say long distance, but if it was purely a synchro issue, you should be able to downshift into second with double-clutching, if you blipped the throttle enough and had come off the clutch pedal enough to match while passing through neutral.

How's the upshift from 1-2?

Approaching 4k miles, no similar issue here.
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      04-12-2015, 02:48 PM   #3
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just warranty it. Have had it happen on other cars.
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      04-12-2015, 02:49 PM   #4
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It sounds like a syncro issue. If you try to force the shifter do you get any kind of grinding sensation?
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      04-12-2015, 02:50 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportstick View Post
Hard to say long distance, but if it was purely a synchro issue, you should be able to downshift into second with double-clutching, if you blipped the throttle enough and had come off the clutch pedal enough to match while passing through neutral.

How's the upshift from 1-2?

Approaching 4k miles, no similar issue here.
Thanks for quick reply.

Upshift from 1st to 2nd never had problem.

The problem I think is the shifter mechanism itself. It won't go into the 2nd gear gate from a downshift, no matter how much muscle I use.
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      04-12-2015, 02:58 PM   #6
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This Is Not A Permanent Solution By Any Means But Just Give It A Try When Driving.
When In 3rd Gear Try Downshift To 2nd (Try Replicate Your Issue) While Still Holding The Gear Leaver Against The 2nd Gear Gate Slowly Release The Clutch & See If The 2nd Gear Gate Opens Up And Slips Into Gear. If You Can't Do This At All I Would Recommend Taking Your BM To Your Dealer Immediately. Rather Have The Issue Resolved Sooner Than Later. (Less Risk Of Damage To Other Parts).
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      04-12-2015, 03:33 PM   #7
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Never a issue with my 2014 228 MSport manual. I think I'd be taking it to the dealer. Hopefully something minor.
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      04-12-2015, 03:50 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
Thanks for quick reply.

Upshift from 1st to 2nd never had problem.

The problem I think is the shifter mechanism itself. It won't go into the 2nd gear gate from a downshift, no matter how much muscle I use.
It seems unlikely it's the actual shifter itself if you can get it in at low RPM and on up shifts. It sounds like you have a bad syncro that will need to be replaced. It's fairly common for some transmissions to have this issue. My old Acura TL had a 3rd gear syncro that was notoriously problematic and had to be replaced on a lot of cars. Switching to a more viscous transmission fluid actually ended up being a workaround in that case but many people who wouldn't have that work had to have the syncro replaced.
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      04-12-2015, 04:20 PM   #9
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I think there is another recent thread that was started by a forum member who was also having trouble with second gear with the manual trans. You should be able to find it using the search feature on this forum...pretty sure it was in the last week or two.
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      04-12-2015, 05:41 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avian View Post
This Is Not A Permanent Solution By Any Means But Just Give It A Try When Driving.
When In 3rd Gear Try Downshift To 2nd (Try Replicate Your Issue) While Still Holding The Gear Leaver Against The 2nd Gear Gate Slowly Release The Clutch & See If The 2nd Gear Gate Opens Up And Slips Into Gear. If You Can't Do This At All I Would Recommend Taking Your BM To Your Dealer Immediately. Rather Have The Issue Resolved Sooner Than Later. (Less Risk Of Damage To Other Parts).
Thanks for the tip
I have tried your suggesting and it seems that the gate would only open after the RPM drops to ~1000 rpm.

Looks like I will be making a call to the dealer next week
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      04-13-2015, 01:54 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
Thanks for the tip
I have tried your suggesting and it seems that the gate would only open after the RPM drops to ~1000 rpm.

Looks like I will be making a call to the dealer next week
Definitely take it in, let us know how it all goes and what the issue is
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      04-13-2015, 10:03 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
Thanks for quick reply.

Upshift from 1st to 2nd never had problem.

The problem I think is the shifter mechanism itself. It won't go into the 2nd gear gate from a downshift, no matter how much muscle I use.
Have you tried double clutching on your downshift? My shifter gets super notchy in the cold weather, but usually if I double clutch it'll clear itself up. Definitely sounds like an issue that should get checked out though if you literally cannot force the shifter into the gear.
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      04-13-2015, 02:55 PM   #13
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I may have an idea of what is going on as I noticed its something I've done on occasion downshifting into second.

I've noticed that when downshifting I sometimes push the shift lever too far to the left where reverse is forward. I'm not a fan of how with BMW's reverse lockout you just push a little bit harder past where the gates for 1st and 2nd are. I much prefer how Audi does it for 6 speed shift patterns where you need to push down vertically on the shifter when its pushed leftwards.


It doesn't make any grinding noises or anything and it wont go into gear. You are probably wiggling it just enough to get it to pop back out past the lockout by the time the revs drop and then are able to get it in.
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      04-13-2015, 03:18 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MrBucket View Post
I may have an idea of what is going on as I noticed its something I've done on occasion downshifting into second.

I've noticed that when downshifting I sometimes push the shift lever too far to the left where reverse is forward. I'm not a fan of how with BMW's reverse lockout you just push a little bit harder past where the gates for 1st and 2nd are. I much prefer how Audi does it for 6 speed shift patterns where you need to push down vertically on the shifter when its pushed leftwards.


It doesn't make any grinding noises or anything and it wont go into gear. You are probably wiggling it just enough to get it to pop back out past the lockout by the time the revs drop and then are able to get it in.
Man, on mine you have to give it a bit of muscle to get it past 1/2 into the reverse notch, even when parked. There is no way I'd ever do that accidentally.
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      04-13-2015, 03:21 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mazerrackham View Post
Man, on mine you have to give it a bit of muscle to get it past 1/2 into the reverse notch, even when parked. There is no way I'd ever do that accidentally.
I believe the manual trans in the M235i is a different unit than in a 228i. There was a post elsewhere on this, but I don't recall the details. (ZF vs Getrag, perhaps?) I would expect there to be subtle differences, even though they likely had similar design objectives.
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      04-13-2015, 03:22 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mazerrackham View Post
Man, on mine you have to give it a bit of muscle to get it past 1/2 into the reverse notch, even when parked. There is no way I'd ever do that accidentally.
It can be way easier to do than you would think. If you do it one swift motion sometimes you don't feel the notch there even.
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      04-13-2015, 03:39 PM   #17
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Thanks MrBucket for the above suggestion.
Unfortunately in my case, there was definitely no mistake in shifting.

Last night I was able to reproduce the problem 100% of the time:
Driving normally in 3rd or 4th gear, attempting to downshift and rev match the engine to any speed above 3500 rpm while clutch is in and stick in neutral, the lever refuses to go into 2nd gear.

However, I can do the downshift to 2nd successfully under 3500 rpm.

I have contacted the service department and will update on this thread of any new updates.
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      04-19-2015, 12:13 AM   #18
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I have solved the issue I was having.
At the dealer, the mechanic there was unable to reproduce the problem. It was mainly a waste of time as they said they need to wait until they can get their hands on another manual 2 series to try it out.

I discovered the problem was that I was shifting too fast. Instead of pushing the lever from a higher gear to 2nd gear in one fast motion. I had to wait half a second or so at the neutral position, and then it was able to go into 2nd gear.
I have no idea why this is the case. My e46 BMW didn't have this limitation.
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      04-19-2015, 01:30 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
I have solved the issue I was having.
At the dealer, the mechanic there was unable to reproduce the problem. It was mainly a waste of time as they said they need to wait until they can get their hands on another manual 2 series to try it out.

I discovered the problem was that I was shifting too fast. Instead of pushing the lever from a higher gear to 2nd gear in one fast motion. I had to wait half a second or so at the neutral position, and then it was able to go into 2nd gear.
I have no idea why this is the case. My e46 BMW didn't have this limitation.
So basically you are saying that you are unable to "power shift". That seems weird...have not seen this as an issue on any other manual car in many years.
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      04-19-2015, 05:04 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
I have solved the issue I was having.
At the dealer, the mechanic there was unable to reproduce the problem. It was mainly a waste of time as they said they need to wait until they can get their hands on another manual 2 series to try it out.
You can't put the mechanic in the passenger's seat and take him for a ride?

"OK, you sit there and watch the shift lever. See, it didn't go into 2nd!" would seem to solve the replication issue. The only reason to wait for another manual 2-series to show up would be if they insist it's normal.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire View Post
I discovered the problem was that I was shifting too fast. Instead of pushing the lever from a higher gear to 2nd gear in one fast motion. I had to wait half a second or so at the neutral position, and then it was able to go into 2nd gear.
That doesn't sound like a fix, it sounds like an accommodation.
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      04-19-2015, 06:22 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merc for hire
I have solved the issue I was having.
At the dealer, the mechanic there was unable to reproduce the problem. It was mainly a waste of time as they said they need to wait until they can get their hands on another manual 2 series to try it out.

I discovered the problem was that I was shifting too fast. Instead of pushing the lever from a higher gear to 2nd gear in one fast motion. I had to wait half a second or so at the neutral position, and then it was able to go into 2nd gear.
I have no idea why this is the case. My e46 BMW didn't have this limitation.
Sorry but somethings not right. I have a 228 manual and I can downshift into second with no problem at all and I absolutely do not have to pause In neutral. Take it back to the dealer.
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      04-19-2015, 09:48 AM   #22
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Yeah, there's no way there's not something wrong. Sounds like something is amiss with the linkage or the synchros.
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