[Quicksilver_M235]

I'm curious to know who currently holds the crown for the lightest 2-series on this forum?

Is sub-3,000 pounds possible?

[omera60]

Mine was 1,347kg’s when we weighted it with full tank but nothing else inside which roughly converts to 2,970 pounds

[Dylan86]

Curious on this. I'm actively modding to reduce weight, problem is I didn't get to build this car so I'm stuck with the sunroof weight, full power options etc, so there's probably about 100-200lbs I'll never be able to shed off.

Rotating mass is sometimes more noticeable, performance wise, than overall weight. Things like lightweight wheels/brakes can save a ton of weight in regard to rotating mass, in turn making the car more agile and nimble. But I think a big opportunity off the hop would be the ditching the OEM battery for a lightweight Braille or similar battery, and switching to the "track edition" manual seats, if you can get your hands on them, reasonably cheap. If you have coilovers, you've saved some weight as well, and you can then corner balance the car, to avoid interrupting the close-to 50/50 balance these cars have from the factory, especially if take 40lbs out of the ass end. Last thing you want to do is upset the balance, just to save a few lbs. Best to try and shave weight from front to back..

Bad news is every time you try to take weight off, and add more capable components, you sometimes end up at sq.1, again, lol. ex: I am installing lighter suspension components, wheels and brakes, but have previously installed a massive FMIC that weighs a lot more than the OE unit, and IC charge piping made of aluminum instead of plastic also adding weight (incremental but everything adds up), WMI system also adds weight. So basically you don't always get to drop weight down, unless you otherwise keep the car close to stock, and only focus on weight savings, etc.. If I can have 100lbs saved at the end of the day, I'd be a very happy camper, but I'm not expecting it, at all..

[Quicksilver_M235]

Originally Posted by omera60

Mine was 1,347kg’s when we weighted it with full tank but nothing else inside which roughly converts to 2,970 pounds

Sounds VERY intriguing, do you mind sharing some of the details on how you got there?

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Curious on this. I'm actively modding to reduce weight, problem is I didn't get to build this car so I'm stuck with the sunroof weight, full power options etc, so there's probably about 100-200lbs I'll never be able to shed off.

I'd take this particular train of thought with a grain of salt. If you wanted a fully stripped out car that was aching for the track, you'd've got a Miata or an Ariel Atom. Its nice to have a trackable car, but its also nice to have some basic conveniences.

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Rotating mass is sometimes more noticeable, performance wise, than overall weight. Things like lightweight wheels/brakes can save a ton of weight in regard to rotating mass, in turn making the car more agile and nimble. But I think a big opportunity off the hop would be the ditching the OEM battery for a lightweight Braille or similar battery, and switching to the "track edition" manual seats, if you can get your hands on them, reasonably cheap. If you have coilovers, you've saved some weight as well, and you can then corner balance the car, to avoid interrupting the close-to 50/50 balance these cars have from the factory, especially if take 40lbs out of the ass end. Last thing you want to do is upset the balance, just to save a few lbs. Best to try and shave weight from front to back..

I agree. If someone was to start doing mods on their car, the first mods I'd recommend would be wheels, tires and suspension. Lightweight rotors and hats are also an option, but as you said, this should only be done on the front, if you decide to remove a heavy lead acid battery from the back end for a more lightweight unit.

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Bad news is every time you try to take weight off, and add more capable components, you sometimes end up at sq.1, again, lol. ex: I am installing lighter suspension components, wheels and brakes, but have previously installed a massive FMIC that weighs a lot more than the OE unit, and IC charge piping made of aluminum instead of plastic also adding weight (incremental but everything adds up), WMI system also adds weight. So basically you don't always get to drop weight down, unless you otherwise keep the car close to stock, and only focus on weight savings, etc.. If I can have 100lbs saved at the end of the day, I'd be a very happy camper, but I'm not expecting it, at all..

Some other items to offset your FMIC might be things like a lightweight alternator or carbon fiber hood. But if you're tracking the car, that intercooler is a must to save your motor.

If you're aiming for the 100 pound mark, a set of good aftermarket race seats, plus a 'rear seat/seatbelt' delete, all by themselves, should nab you close to 100 lbs right there.. the trick is that weight distribution thing.

[aerobod]

Originally Posted by Erebus

If you wanted a fully stripped out car that was aching for the track, you'd've got a Miata or an Ariel Atom. Its nice to have a trackable car, but its also nice to have some basic conveniences.

Weight is a massive differentiator in track performance, but I doubt that there is anything that can be done to a 2-series that will allow a weight that changes the characteristics significantly while still allowing it to be tolerable as a daily driver.

Our Caterham R400 drives as differently on the track compared with the M240i as the M240i does to a pickup. It also makes you 10 times more tired after driving it, requires hearing protection and tries to kill you on a frequent basis. It is very light though, here are the corner weights for it with 80kg of driver, a full tank of fuel and 25kg of ballast (needed to be above minimum weight for the class to meet autoslalom championship rules, after fuel burn and a lighter driver swap). Basically a 1200 pound car with a full tank of fuel, 1431 pounds in class weight with driver and ballast.

From the perspective of going to a lightweight car that is still road legal, in the case of the Caterham vs the M240i with decent track prep it is worth about 10 seconds a lap on tight road courses if slicks are used, 5 seconds in a one minute auto-slalom course. I don’t think an M240i would shave more than a second off lap times if removing enough weight while still making it civilized on the road.

[omera60]

Originally Posted by Erebus

Sounds VERY intriguing, do you mind sharing some of the details on how you got there?

I actually did nothing, it’s in stock configuration. Now bear in mind that EU and NA Verdi ins might be different. My biggest weight saving is coming from the B38 unit up front. It’s a tiny 3 cylinder made from basically cutting the 6 cylinder to half so once you rev it up it will make a 6 banger sound and at the same time its economical with only a consumption of 6.9lt. It has the power to overtake anyone in daily traffic with ease (and to piss them off ) at least in Istanbul...

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Curious on this. I'm actively modding to reduce weight, problem is I didn't get to build this car so I'm stuck with the sunroof weight, full power options etc, so there's probably about 100-200lbs I'll never be able to shed off.

Psssh never be able to? Just take the sunfoor and all it's mechanical components out and replace with a cf square.

You could always try shaving some weight off the engine.... Nevously chuckles.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Psssh never be able to? Just take the sunfoor and all it's mechanical components out and replace with a cf square.

You could always try shaving some weight off the engine.... Nevously chuckles.

Yea it's something that's definitely a possibility once the car hits older age, wayy down the line. I eventually see it as a dedicated track car, but not when it's still pristine, lol.

There is already a couple of CF roof replacements for the M2, I'd imagine it would work on the F22 as well? I'd do something like that, and the m235iR bodywork, cage, two bucket seats, rear seat delete, etc. At that point, should be close to 3000-3100 with the MT..

[jmwilson125]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Yea it's something that's definitely a possibility once the car hits older age, wayy down the line. I eventually see it as a dedicated track car, but not when it's still pristine, lol.

There is already a couple of CF roof replacements for the M2, I'd imagine it would work on the F22 as well? I'd do something like that, and the m235iR bodywork, cage, two bucket seats, rear seat delete, etc. At that point, should be close to 3000-3100 with the MT..

Yeah that's what I'm am thinking to. Short term I'm not worried about weight. Long term I'd like to make this a track car. Assuming it's still running. You didn't catch my joke related to my other post?


Also I threw mine on the scales at one point. I forget what the mods were at the time. I want to say half tank of gas, with high flow dp, cp, tune, and maybe upgraded wheels. (not sure if lighter) I was 2480.

I got the moonroof and cold weather package and that's it.

I think it was 53f/47r weight distribution.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Yeah that's what I'm am thinking to. Short term I'm not worried about weight. Long term I'd like to make this a track car. Assuming it's still running. You didn't catch my joke related to my other post?


Also I threw mine on the scales at one point. I forget what the mods were at the time. I want to say half tank of gas, with high flow dp, cp, tune, and maybe upgraded wheels. (not sure if lighter) I was 2480.

I got the moonroof and cold weather package and that's it.

I think it was 53f/47r weight distribution.

Didn't catch that the first time, LOL (still praying for ya)

Weight dist. looks about right. I'll have the car corner balanced before it hits the track, hoping we can get it close.

[Quicksilver_M235]

Originally Posted by jmwilson125

Psssh never be able to? Just take the sunfoor and all it's mechanical components out and replace with a cf square.

You could always try shaving some weight off the engine.... Nevously chuckles.

Huh... never thought about replacing the sunroof with a CF square... both simple and quite impressive from a logic standpoint.. almost goes to say, you SHOULD get the sunroof to begin with, just for that mod

Weight engine shaving, guess that essentially boils down to determination.. Titanium bolt replacements, lighter alternator - ac compressor, fluid reduction in all reservoirs prior to races... and per the nervous chuckles, some 'unique' drilling and chamfering of supporting sheetmetal

[Maynard]

Front license delete saves me at least a pound The rest of my lightening is going to happen at the gym for now.

Did just see an article on Porsche weight savings, with a VERY cool looking ultralight battery - but about $1700, IIRC. - I'm using this as my inspiration, just in case I actually manage to drop 20-30 from my chassis.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by Maynard

Front license delete saves me at least a pound The rest of my lightening is going to happen at the gym for now.

Did just see an article on Porsche weight savings, with a VERY cool looking ultralight battery - but about $1700, IIRC. - I'm using this as my inspiration, just in case I actually manage to drop 20-30 from my chassis.

Braille makes a light battery, they're about $5-600 and you could also run a Li-Ion conversion, but also about $1k. You actually don't want to lighten the rear any more than it is, especially on the 6cyl, the 4cyl might have some more wiggle room..

I would have done this already but it was highly advisable no to, until we get it on scales, first. Just my $.02

[morphomeman]

Ditto on last post. The balance is more important than the weight. Lightening the battery, which is pretty far back, will throw the balance off, unless you remove a component of equal weight from the front.
Spend your money elsewhere.

[morphomeman]

To clarify my last post: the 240x coupe weight distribution is 53% front, the 230i coupe 50% (ideal), the other configurations in between. None are heavier in the rear. So it never makes sense to lighten the rear on these cars.

[Quicksilver_M235]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

Braille makes a light battery, they're about $5-600 and you could also run a Li-Ion conversion, but also about $1k. You actually don't want to lighten the rear any more than it is, especially on the 6cyl, the 4cyl might have some more wiggle room..

I would have done this already but it was highly advisable no to, until we get it on scales, first. Just my $.02

If you want to save $.02 or more, you might look at a Deltran - Battery Tender Lithium Iron Phosphate battery. The MX-5/Miata crowd have been using them for autocross. Less than 4 pounds (plus bracket to hold it) it's a 12v/480 amps battery with 35 amp hour capacity.. for about $200-225ish. (Reference Link)

Originally Posted by morphomeman

To clarify my last post: the 240x coupe weight distribution is 53% front, the 230i coupe 50% (ideal), the other configurations in between. None are heavier in the rear. So it never makes sense to lighten the rear on these cars.

I agree. Surprisingly, from a balance perspective, the 4 cylinder motor helps equal out the weight distribution better.

For a test car on the 2014 228i (auto), the weight was 3,344lbs with a 51.3/48.7 (1,692.9 lbs front - 1,607.1 lbs rear) - (85.8 lbs bias to the FRONT) stock. (Reference Link)

For a test car on the 2014 M235i (auto), the weight was 3,494lbs with a 53/47 (1,851.8 lbs front - 1,642.2 lbs rear) - (209.6 lbs bias to the FRONT) stock. (Reference Link)

[Dylan86]

^^ Yeah I've heard of many guys using those 12v utility batteries, like those, and having no issues. If and when I put racing buckets in the car, this could coincide with the weight loss and balance, as a combo deal. Well over 150lb saving between the two power seats and a lightweight battery..

[Quicksilver_M235]

Originally Posted by Dylan86

^^ Yeah I've heard of many guys using those 12v utility batteries, like those, and having no issues. If and when I put racing buckets in the car, this could coincide with the weight loss and balance, as a combo deal. Well over 150lb saving between the two power seats and a lightweight battery..

You can throw in a rear seat delete for roughly another 60 lbs, and it won't cost a thing

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by Erebus

You can throw in a rear seat delete for roughly another 60 lbs, and it won't cost a thing

Yes, good point, I'd definitely do that with the front seat delete weight savings

[cxp213]

I'm gonna say that this guy probably has one of the lightest 2-series:
http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho....php?t=1452618

Pretty much everything you guys mentioned, he's already done, including the roof.

[BarryJI]

Definitely not me.

[amw896]

Just weighed my 235i today. 1630kg with a quarter tank and me inside. Converts to about 3400 lbs empty. I have manual seats, 6mt and sunroof delete.