Deciding btwn 228 vs 235

3.0L · 08-25-2015, 02:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

Even more serious that you think as those are factory rated HP and torque number and are understated.
Dinan has measured the actual HP/torque numbers for the stock 228i at 261 HP and 290 ft/lb torque...

That is very impressive! Do they also have numbers for a stock M235i? Sometimes I think it is under rated as well.

bimmerfile · 08-25-2015, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3.0L

That is very impressive! Do they also have numbers for a stock M235i? Sometimes I think it is under rated as well.

Ja, shure..

Dinan measured the actual HP/torque numbers for the stock M235i at 326 HP and 379 ft/lb torque..

ralawren · 08-25-2015, 05:18 PM

I get 4.5" at the 12 position on my M-Sport wheel.

Sportstick · 08-25-2015, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Merc for hire

228i fans refuse to accept inferiority.

Exactly! We prefer the superior handling of a lighter front end!

Pinghacker · 08-25-2015, 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G8rGrl

Did you drive back home non-stop? I'm concerned about driving a new car for 10 hours straight before engine break-in. What did BMW say about your drive home?

We didn't wrap up until 3:00 in the afternoon so we weren't interested in trying to drive through straight.

We were going to take US 276 up to the Blue Ridge Parkway then over to Asheville, NC for dinner. We were running behind after a stop in Greenville and took a cut-off from 276 to Asheville. US 276 was beautiful over the mountain though,

After dinner in Asheville, we made it to Johnson City, TN before stopping for the evening.

MikeT · 08-25-2015, 08:40 PM

Looking at Dinan's graphs, one of the most pronounced differences is the low-end torque (275 vs. 379 @ 2500 rpm). That 104 lb-ft difference is a big part of the reason that the m235i feels so much more powerful off the line.

I drove them both and at one point was seriously considering the 228i, as it does offer an exceptionally good value for the price. At the end, though, it came down to a choice between adequate vs wow, and I chose the latter. I partly justified the m235i by doing ED. I figured that a lightly-optioned, ED m235i was maybe only $3500 more than an off-the-lot 228i optioned the way I'd want to option it. And then once the decision was made to do ED, I reasoned, well, if I'm driving on the autobahn, I pretty much have to go all in and get the m235i. Circular reasoning, I know, but so be it.

SteveInfante · 08-26-2015, 08:59 AM

The Dinan tune is looking very tempting. I like the power that it has stock. I'm pretty sure that with that tune I would need to upgrade the tires to something more sticky to keep traction.

scottyn · 08-26-2015, 09:27 AM

So I'm a 228 owner, and I absolutely love it. The way I spec'd it, it's essentially an M228i - the only important difference from the M235i is the smaller engine.

Now, I won't try to argue that the 228 is the better car. I test drove a 235 and would have bought one if I could. But equipping a 235 the way I wanted would have been about $4k more, which would come closer to $5k when factoring in the extra fuel over a 5-year period. That may be an insignificant amount of money for some people, but it's not for me.

So mostly I made this decision because I was already stretching my budget for the 228i and could not stomach paying an extra $5k for the engine. But it also comes down to how much power I actually need, and IMO the N20 gives exactly the right amount. Sure, the N55 would be more fun, but I would very rarely use all of it. The final consideration was that if I am disappointed (or get bored) with the 228i, I can just add on a stage 1 tune for something like $500-700...Racechip seems pretty reliable and makes the output over 300hp and 320 lb-ft

moldcad · 08-26-2015, 09:46 AM

... on paper.

Been there, seen that - in my 528xi I was fighting for every single PS and Nm, trying several piggy backs (including RC Ultimate) - nothing gave. Only after I traded the F10 towards my current M235i did I feel I have enough power, and could put my mind at ease (my RCU is collecting dust)...

3.0L · 08-26-2015, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

Ja, shure..

Dinan measured the actual HP/torque numbers for the stock M235i at 326 HP and 379 ft/lb torque..

Wow, that's frigging amazing!

Another question. My Sports Display gauges indicate a max of about 320 HP and 330 lb/ft of torque when I have the pedal to the metal. In light of the Dinan numbers, are these perhaps factory "pre-programmed" numbers?

2msport · 08-26-2015, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by moldcad

... on paper.

Been there, seen that - in my 528xi I was fighting for every single PS and Nm, trying several piggy backs (including RC Ultimate) - nothing gave. Only after I traded the F10 towards my current M235i did I feel I have enough power, and could put my mind at ease (my RCU is collecting dust)...

You came from one of the heaviest cars bmw makes. I can see how a tune wouldn't make the difference you wanted.

On the flip side putting a tune in the 228, one of the lightest cars bmw makes, a tune goes a lot further. I can attest. Piggyback and ECU tune. Especially with an ECU tune it's quite different than a stock 228.

moldcad · 08-26-2015, 12:50 PM

Agreed. But with M235i, I don't need ANY of them, and I finally am not frustrated - to the contrary, I cannot wait each morning to get into either the M235i or my R

raleedy@gmail.com · 08-26-2015, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G8rGrl

Did you drive back home non-stop? I'm concerned about driving a new car for 10 hours straight before engine break-in. What did BMW say about your drive home?

I never heard anyone suggest that an engine "OFF" state was part of an engine break-in program.

FlyingScot1050 · 08-26-2015, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raleedy@gmail.com

I never heard anyone suggest that an engine "OFF" state was part of an engine break-in program.

My understanding is that steady-state RPMs (such as you would experience on a 10 hour road trip) are to be avoided if possible when breaking in an engine

2msport · 08-26-2015, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FlyingScot1050

My understanding is that steady-state RPMs (such as you would experience on a 10 hour road trip) are to be avoided if possible when breaking in an engine

however a simple change of speed every 5 minutes or so would correct for that

Luftwaffe1O1 · 08-26-2015, 02:24 PM

Ah all this bickering....

Look the 228 is a great car, and as someone else mentioned, if you are so close in price, within 5k, I Would say go for the 235. If it was 38k vs 50k, then obviously it is a much bigger difference.

But as far as the 2l 4 vs the 3 liter 6, I personally do not like the 4 banger, and the way it delivers power. It may be close in performance, and true, on the street it is not a very big difference when you are going balls to the wall. But there is a very big difference in HOW that power is delivered, every 28 car I have driven so far, seems to have very spotty power deliver, IE, it is much slower to get going, and I noticed quite a bit of lag after shifts etc.

Compared with the 235s power deliver which is smooth all around. You are talking about mods already, and trying to get the 228 faster etc, why bother though? You are going to be risking warranty, and will probably spend a few thousand already, to get the 228 to be as quick as the 235, but it will never have that feel. And it will never make the kind of power the 235 has the potential for.

In the end go for the car you prefer the feel of, I didn't like the feel of the 28, but that doesn't mean everyone has the same issue with it that I do honestly. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, the 228 is a great little car, and if I didn't get the 235, I would have definitely gone for it as well, but when I was getting my car, I didn't order it, it was one they had there, and it was an early car. The 228 offerings were pretty terrible and price was close enough. Plus I got almost 4k off of a fully loaded 235 in april of 2014, which I figured was not too bad.

OpenAir · 08-26-2015, 03:53 PM

Thankfully we are all lucky enough to drive either one of these fabulous cars!

My 2cents is it's not a cab!

midwest 340xi 6sp · 08-26-2015, 04:36 PM

So reminiscent of the E60 535 vs 550 "dialogue"

Ramsen · 08-26-2015, 04:45 PM

A 235i would've cost me 7k more at least, that plus insurance and gas will add up. If I spend bigger money for power I don't need, I'd want an M for the best handling as well.

3.0L · 08-26-2015, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

Ja, shure..

Dinan measured the actual HP/torque numbers for the stock M235i at 326 HP and 379 ft/lb torque..

And I assume that's at the flywheel?

FlyingScot1050 · 08-27-2015, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2msport

however a simple change of speed every 5 minutes or so would correct for that

That doesn't sound frustratingly miserable to do for ten hours at all

aerostar · 08-27-2015, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 3.0L

And I assume that's at the flywheel?

I'd assume so.

If a dinan tune was making 400+ torque at the wheels then the engine is clearly way underrated.

08-25-2015, 05:18 PM	#91
ralawren First Lieutenant 78 Rep 310 Posts Drives: 2015 228i MSport w/Trk Pkg Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Wake Forest, NC iTrader: (0)	MSport Wheel 4.5" I get 4.5" at the 12 position on my M-Sport wheel.
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08-25-2015, 08:40 PM	#94
MikeT Lieutenant 170 Rep 533 Posts Drives: 2015 m235i Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: California iTrader: (0)	Looking at Dinan's graphs, one of the most pronounced differences is the low-end torque (275 vs. 379 @ 2500 rpm). That 104 lb-ft difference is a big part of the reason that the m235i feels so much more powerful off the line. I drove them both and at one point was seriously considering the 228i, as it does offer an exceptionally good value for the price. At the end, though, it came down to a choice between adequate vs wow, and I chose the latter. I partly justified the m235i by doing ED. I figured that a lightly-optioned, ED m235i was maybe only $3500 more than an off-the-lot 228i optioned the way I'd want to option it. And then once the decision was made to do ED, I reasoned, well, if I'm driving on the autobahn, I pretty much have to go all in and get the m235i. Circular reasoning, I know, but so be it.
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08-26-2015, 08:59 AM	#95
SteveInfante NewFinishColumbia/detailer 604 Rep 2,096 Posts Drives: 2015 F31 xDrive Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Columbia, SC iTrader: (0)	The Dinan tune is looking very tempting. I like the power that it has stock. I'm pretty sure that with that tune I would need to upgrade the tires to something more sticky to keep traction. __________________ 328 F31 xDrive/OSM/Venetian Luxury Line/Cold Weather/Premium/Driving Assist/Nav/Tech "Golden Goose" 78' Honda CB400A project http://www.instagram.com/steve_inf31
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08-26-2015, 09:27 AM	#96
scottyn Private First Class 35 Rep 128 Posts Drives: 228i M-sport THP Join Date: May 2015 Location: Chicago, IL iTrader: (0)	So I'm a 228 owner, and I absolutely love it. The way I spec'd it, it's essentially an M228i - the only important difference from the M235i is the smaller engine. Now, I won't try to argue that the 228 is the better car. I test drove a 235 and would have bought one if I could. But equipping a 235 the way I wanted would have been about $4k more, which would come closer to $5k when factoring in the extra fuel over a 5-year period. That may be an insignificant amount of money for some people, but it's not for me. So mostly I made this decision because I was already stretching my budget for the 228i and could not stomach paying an extra $5k for the engine. But it also comes down to how much power I actually need, and IMO the N20 gives exactly the right amount. Sure, the N55 would be more fun, but I would very rarely use all of it. The final consideration was that if I am disappointed (or get bored) with the 228i, I can just add on a stage 1 tune for something like $500-700...Racechip seems pretty reliable and makes the output over 300hp and 320 lb-ft
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08-26-2015, 09:46 AM	#97
moldcad Major 262 Rep 1,091 Posts Drives: M235i Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Poland iTrader: (0)	... on paper. Been there, seen that - in my 528xi I was fighting for every single PS and Nm, trying several piggy backs (including RC Ultimate) - nothing gave. Only after I traded the F10 towards my current M235i did I feel I have enough power, and could put my mind at ease (my RCU is collecting dust)... __________________ previous: 2003 E46 330i SMG just sold: 2013 F10 528i xDrive my AWD beater: 2015 Golf R mk7 DSG my RWD pirate & long-distance cruiser: 2015 M235i AT8, LSD
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08-26-2015, 12:50 PM	#100
moldcad Major 262 Rep 1,091 Posts Drives: M235i Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Poland iTrader: (0)	Agreed. But with M235i, I don't need ANY of them, and I finally am not frustrated - to the contrary, I cannot wait each morning to get into either the M235i or my R __________________ previous: 2003 E46 330i SMG just sold: 2013 F10 528i xDrive my AWD beater: 2015 Golf R mk7 DSG my RWD pirate & long-distance cruiser: 2015 M235i AT8, LSD
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08-26-2015, 02:24 PM	#104
Luftwaffe1O1 Lieutenant 230 Rep 555 Posts Drives: M235i, 2000 Z3 Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: San Diego, CA iTrader: (0)	Ah all this bickering.... Look the 228 is a great car, and as someone else mentioned, if you are so close in price, within 5k, I Would say go for the 235. If it was 38k vs 50k, then obviously it is a much bigger difference. But as far as the 2l 4 vs the 3 liter 6, I personally do not like the 4 banger, and the way it delivers power. It may be close in performance, and true, on the street it is not a very big difference when you are going balls to the wall. But there is a very big difference in HOW that power is delivered, every 28 car I have driven so far, seems to have very spotty power deliver, IE, it is much slower to get going, and I noticed quite a bit of lag after shifts etc. Compared with the 235s power deliver which is smooth all around. You are talking about mods already, and trying to get the 228 faster etc, why bother though? You are going to be risking warranty, and will probably spend a few thousand already, to get the 228 to be as quick as the 235, but it will never have that feel. And it will never make the kind of power the 235 has the potential for. In the end go for the car you prefer the feel of, I didn't like the feel of the 28, but that doesn't mean everyone has the same issue with it that I do honestly. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that, the 228 is a great little car, and if I didn't get the 235, I would have definitely gone for it as well, but when I was getting my car, I didn't order it, it was one they had there, and it was an early car. The 228 offerings were pretty terrible and price was close enough. Plus I got almost 4k off of a fully loaded 235 in april of 2014, which I figured was not too bad. __________________
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08-26-2015, 03:53 PM	#105
OpenAir Captain 432 Rep 887 Posts Drives: Enzo F23 228i Join Date: May 2015 Location: MD, USA iTrader: (1) Garage List 2015 BMW 228i [0.00]	Thankfully we are all lucky enough to drive either one of these fabulous cars! My 2cents is it's not a cab!
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08-26-2015, 04:36 PM	#106
midwest 340xi 6sp Lieutenant Colonel 360 Rep 1,797 Posts Drives: 2018 340xi Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: The Great Midwest iTrader: (6)	So reminiscent of the E60 535 vs 550 "dialogue" __________________ Previous Rides: 535xi, M235xi, X3, E92 M3, E70 X5 35d, X6 50i, X6 35i, E60 550i, E46 M3 Cabriolet, E39 540i, E36 328i
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08-26-2015, 04:45 PM	#107
Ramsen Enlisted Member 5 Rep 32 Posts Drives: BMW 228i M-Sport 6MT Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: LA iTrader: (0)	A 235i would've cost me 7k more at least, that plus insurance and gas will add up. If I spend bigger money for power I don't need, I'd want an M for the best handling as well. Last edited by Ramsen; 08-26-2015 at 05:01 PM..
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