[ScttRchrdsn]

No regrets. For me it is about the driving experience, flowing with the car, not a couple decimal points.
Besides, this may be last time I may even have a chance to spec a MT, the way things are going.

[Tpeterson]

Originally Posted by 9t2hoo

The feel is great (as good as the manual in a miata), although there is more noise because you replace plastic parts with metal parts.

This is good to know. The throw is long with the BMW linkage. Not all short shift kits improve the feel while shortening the throw.

[m981addicts]

Originally Posted by 3.0L

That's about it in a nutshell. I'm 70 and have owned more manuals than I can remember. All were enjoyable.

I had the misfortune to twist my left knee at work about 9 years ago and it's never been the same. So, auto it is. Enjoy while you can. Never thought I'd live to see the day when an auto could beat a manual, though. Not that it matters - I don't street race.

Twisted my left knee this summer mowing the lawn. Thought I'd have to reconsider keeping my two manual cars. Took a month to heal. Glad I can clutch again. Good to drive DCT/auto at times but can't beat rowing the gears.

[jt8307]

Originally Posted by WolfGTI

The actual travel between gears is the 'throw' the only thing the shift knob has changed is the feel and effort - the actual throw has not changed. It cannot change without actually changing the linkage.

Actually Xutvjet is correct. By reducing the height of the shift lever (by a shorter handle in this case), you reduce the throw off the shifter lever, while at the same time increasing the effort to shift gears which may also change the feel.

This is done without changing the linkages because of the mechanics of the shift lever. Since the lever is fixed at one location, you are actually rotating the lever as you change gears. Changing the length of the lever changes the moment arm length which changes both the travel and force required, but you still rotate the lever the same number of degrees.

A shorter throw shifter requires more force, more precision, but enables faster shifts with more feedback. Most enthusiasts prefer a shorter throw as it is more performance oriented. I think the longer throw off BMW's is intentional, as it makes it easier to drive the car and desirable to a larger target group. I really wish that BMW would offer a short throw option for their M Performance models, as many of the Asian suppliers do this for their performance models. I always loved the feel of my Celica GT-S transmission with the factory short shift kit.

One should also note that while you can improve many transmissions with a shorter throw, it won't make a bad transmission good. It's only part of the overall transmission feel and performance.

[mecodoug]

No regrets on choosing the MT but I do wish 6th was taller, closer to 8th on the AT. I think this would help with highway MPG and also significantly reduce total engine revolutions, which could make a difference if I keep my car for a long time. If they keep the MT (which I hope they do) maybe we can dream of a 7th gear that brings RPM's to around 2000 at 75 mph......Just like the 6th gear on my 335d AT.

[WolfGTI]

I am not going to argue here - the throw itself has not changed - the feel, and effort have changed - changing the shift knob does not alter the actual shift lever length. Think what you wish. Further evidenced by actual short shift kits - which are not simply shift knobs.

Originally Posted by jt8307

Actually Xutvjet is correct. By reducing the height of the shift lever (by a shorter handle in this case), you reduce the throw off the shifter lever, while at the same time increasing the effort to shift gears which may also change the feel.

This is done without changing the linkages because of the mechanics of the shift lever. Since the lever is fixed at one location, you are actually rotating the lever as you change gears. Changing the length of the lever changes the moment arm length which changes both the travel and force required, but you still rotate the lever the same number of degrees.

A shorter throw shifter requires more force, more precision, but enables faster shifts with more feedback. Most enthusiasts prefer a shorter throw as it is more performance oriented. I think the longer throw off BMW's is intentional, as it makes it easier to drive the car and desirable to a larger target group. I really wish that BMW would offer a short throw option for their M Performance models, as many of the Asian suppliers do this for their performance models. I always loved the feel of my Celica GT-S transmission with the factory short shift kit.

One should also note that while you can improve many transmissions with a shorter throw, it won't make a bad transmission good. It's only part of the overall transmission feel and performance.

[XutvJet]

Originally Posted by WolfGTI

I am not going to argue here - the throw itself has not changed - the feel, and effort have changed - changing the shift knob does not alter the actual shift lever length. Think what you wish. Further evidenced by actual short shift kits - which are not simply shift knobs.

Do the math. Do you really think that if the shift knob was 1 foot long, the distance from 1st to 2nd would be the same as with the stock shift knob? LOL

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by WolfGTI

I am not going to argue here - the throw itself has not changed - the feel, and effort have changed - changing the shift knob does not alter the actual shift lever length. Think what you wish. Further evidenced by actual short shift kits - which are not simply shift knobs.

Have you ever played on a see-saw...sitting closer versus further away from the center pivot? The kid at the end travels a longer arc up and down than the kid closer to the pivot. Translate that to horizontal motion and imagine a taller versus shorter shift knob and the distance your hand on the top (end point) of the lever travels does change, obviously to a lesser degree than in my example...but it does and can be felt. Perhaps the confusion is that some shift knobs are actually taller/shorter than others. I swapped out my original one for a shorter one...less material height over the threaded post.

[3.0L]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Perhaps the confusion is that some shift knobs are actually taller/shorter than others. I swapped out my original one for a shorter one...

I have a feeling this discussion has been going on for thousands of years.

[Sportstick]

Originally Posted by 3.0L

I have a feeling this discussion has been going on for thousands of years.

Since the ancient Roman Emperor, Sticktus Shiftus?

[9t2hoo]

[QUOTE=jt8307;22155904]
A shorter throw shifter requires more force, more precision, but enables faster shifts with more feedback.

For reasons that I cannot necessarily explain, the UUC kit does not appear to increase the shifting effort (at least to any degree that I can notice). I also got a clutch stop yesterday and now shifting the car is ridiculously quick.

[Xiaoxi]

Absolutely no regrets. I wouldn't have this car any other way.

[pz619]

If it helps, I regret getting the auto. Sure it's faster and better mileage but I'll trade the few 10ths of a second for the additional engagement. My next car will go back to a manual. Either the M2 or a Cayman.

[rightrudder]

No regrets. I only wish I could set the default to Sport+, DSC off. Traction control is far too intrusive for "sporty" around-town driving, and I really detest the auto rev-match. Configuring Sport+, DSC off takes care of both problems. For a long freeway trip, though, I'm good with Comfort.

[J_J_B]

The only transmission regrets I've ever had in my life were the two times I was talked into getting an automatic. My sole regret with this car is that I didn't opt for the track handling package.

[Thalia949]

No regrets - I test drove the auto and felt that it didn't offer the same driving experience for me.

Not crazy about the length of the throw but not to the point to make any changes ...yet.

Plus, having a stick provides a filter to who drives the car in my house....

[aaaaah]

Never.

I've only ever owned one automatic car and I don't want to increase that number for a long time if possible.

It doesn't matter how good an auto or dual clutch gets, it's still not as viscerally satisfying. Easiest visual is imagine having a really shitty day at work and you just want to get some therapeutic driving in. Then picture yourself angrily clicking a paddle and actually getting the same sense of satisfaction from it.

[lateapex'er]

40 mile daily commute one way, with stop and go traffic. No regrets.

[sausagemcmuffin]

Definitely no regrets - 34 mile round trip commute, enjoying every shift

[Kolyan2k]

No regrets, all the loaners I dove with ZF8 felt pretty boring, more like cruiser cars. I dont mind it, but those cars lost the "sports" character for me

[BillD1953]

Originally Posted by Kolyan2k

No regrets, all the loaners I dove with ZF8 felt pretty boring, more like cruiser cars. I dont mind it, but those cars lost the "sports" character for me

I know what you mean.....................

Today I dropped of my base 228i 6MT coupe off @ the dealer for a 30,000 service.

I requested a 328i sedan for a loaner...I got 3,300 mile 330i loaner xdrive.

I have the loaner overnight and put about 60 miles on it today.

The 330i feels big/heavy on the road compared to my 228i.

I think it is the xdrive in the 330i compared to the to the RWD 228i.

The 330i is quick, nice auto trans....but I kept looking for the clutch with my L leg most of the day !

I'll stay with a 6MT transmission. I wouldn't mind having the two back doors of the sedan !

[jgunnz]

In a word, no.