GSR Technik 228i N20 ECU Flash Tune Now Available 50whp/90wtq

GSR Technik · 05-20-2015, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpenAir

With the group by option, I noticed that you are recommending 228i AT owners to use the Stage 1 kit. Can you explain the difference between Stage 1 and 2 outside of the obvious Downpipe.

At a fairly high level how the tune works is we can ask the ECU for more torque and if it can't give it based on the other safeguards built into the code it won't do it. That's one of the big differences between a good flash tune and a piggyback system which is forcing the ECU to do something (e.g. increase boost) even if the safeguards are trying to kick in to control what is going on.

So in our stage 2 tune we are asking the ECU for more torque than in the stage 1 because we can expect to get it with a freer flowing exhaust side. If we get too greedy on stage 1 and ask for too much the ECU does adjust but we do get some surging (or over boosting) at the low end which manifests itself as a bumpy curve on the dyno graph or a feeling of non-linear power delivery in your butt dyno. This is also why you are seeing people blow stock charge pipes on crappy tunes and over aggressive piggyback systems. We've tried to get as much as we can with the Stage 1 given the flow constraints so going to Stage 2 tune without freer flowing exhaust side would not be ideal.

Specifically for 228i AT customers there is a torque limit variable that is kicking in at or about 350 wtq. We've just verified that it is cutting throttle which to people feels like misfires but we haven't figured out yet how the limit is implemented within the ECU so we are saying to customers that run Stage 2 on 93 that they will probably be exceeding the 350 wtq limit. We are making progress and have a 228 AT running a new beta version of the tune with some changes that might address the torque limit but it's still early days.

Nick...

GSR Technik · 05-20-2015, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caycep

I'm actually interested in this from the Computer Science/Engineering perspective. It would be interesting to get this running in say some sort of virtual machine environment to poke and prod at it and explore the software that makes this car tick.

Do you decompile the ECU code and make changes at the high level or is it just old school poking through the binary/machine code and making changes to the hex values?

Manufacturers don't make it easy so we are left poking through hex values and mapping out the binary structure as we learn what different values do. That's the R&D effort that creates our competitive advantage - knowing what binary does what. As you can imagine there is a lot of binary so it's a constant exercise to figure out what does what. It is really black box reverse engineering because all we can do is change hex values and then test to see what the embedded systems do with the variable change. Pain in the ass really bit it's what we do.

There are some variable/table labels that we recognize from previous versions but a lot of those are in technical German engineering speak which makes it that much more fun.

Nick...

OpenAir · 05-20-2015, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSR Autosport

...We are making progress and have a 228 AT running a new beta version of the tune with some changes that might address the torque limit but it's still early days...

Nick...

Nick,

Just sent you an email for additional data. Thanks. Can I make a deposit at the club price and wait for you to finish the stage 2 tune?

GSR Technik · 05-20-2015, 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpenAir

Nick,

Just sent you an email for additional data. Thanks. Can I make a deposit at the club price and wait for you to finish the stage 2 tune?

Yes, no problem. Will check out email.

boomboom22 · 05-20-2015, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSR Autosport

We would like to do another M235i on our dyno with the latest revision so if there is anyone willing to come to us we will do 50% off. PM us if anyone is interested.

Are you guys still looking for an M235i? I can provide mine.

GSR Technik · 05-20-2015, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by faultfracture

Are you guys still looking for an M235i? I can provide mine.

Really appreciate the offer but we have wrapped up testing for the time being on the M235i.

Thanks,
Nick...

GSR Technik · 05-20-2015, 11:30 PM

We are going to be testing a development tune for our 228 MT Stage 2 specific for race fuel - this Friday. Going to be interesting to see what type of numbers she puts up. Then on to the Bimmerfest track event Saturday. Our baby is not going to be put in a corner - she's no booth queen - we're there to be on track!

See you all there. We'll be in the garages.

Nick...

caycep · 05-20-2015, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSR Autosport

Manufacturers don't make it easy so we are left poking through hex values and mapping out the binary structure as we learn what different values do. That's the R&D effort that creates our competitive advantage - knowing what binary does what. As you can imagine there is a lot of binary so it's a constant exercise to figure out what does what. It is really black box reverse engineering because all we can do is change hex values and then test to see what the embedded systems do with the variable change. Pain in the ass really bit it's what we do.

There are some variable/table labels that we recognize from previous versions but a lot of those are in technical German engineering speak which makes it that much more fun.

Nick...

hm, interesting, that is very old school. Do you have it hooked up somewhere in the lab? I can't imagine you doing it in the car for fear of breaking something lol.

Compiler technology being where it is, I'm sure there is a way to use something like LLVM to write a cross compiler that outputs the machine language binary into a higher level code like C or Rust or Go or something. That usually takes a graduate student at least 6 months, though lol

GSR Technik · 05-21-2015, 12:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caycep

hm, interesting, that is very old school. Do you have it hooked up somewhere in the lab? I can't imagine you doing it in the car for fear of breaking something lol.

Compiler technology being where it is, I'm sure there is a way to use something like LLVM to write a cross compiler that outputs the machine language binary into a higher level code like C or Rust or Go or something. That usually takes a graduate student at least 6 months, though lol

We do it out of the car because we have to open up the ECU to put it into boot mode to get around the security and then connect to pins on the board itself.

I'm going to PM you.

Nick...

chaddy74 · 05-21-2015, 01:57 AM

Always several ways to skin a cat !! At least on face value there are some important parameters that can be manipulated

Hopefully in time additional coding branches within the code structure can be identified and tweaked.

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSR Autosport

We do it out of the car because we have to open up the ECU to put it into boot mode to get around the security and then connect to pins on the board itself.

I'm going to PM you.

Nick...

FSociety · 06-09-2015, 09:42 AM

bump

isthar · 06-17-2015, 12:49 PM

M235 tune - does that apply to xdrive models? to auto models?

GSR Technik · 06-17-2015, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by isthar

M235 tune - does that apply to xdrive models? to auto models?

Yes and yes.

OpenAir · 06-19-2015, 10:50 AM

Money Sent...Stage I engaged! Now how about that axle back muffler delete!

Bobby or Nick, I forgot to ask but will the Stage I remove the speed limit and does it change the rpm limit, i.e. run WOT to 7K vice the ecu causing a shift point at 6800?

CalCarNut · 06-22-2015, 07:05 PM

Hey Nick..with all your experience in racing and modifying, do you think there is a real need for an oil catch can for the 2.0L? Picking your brain a little and giving the thread a bit of a 'bump'

FSociety · 06-22-2015, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OpenAir

Money Sent...Stage I engaged! Now how about that axle back muffler delete!

Bobby or Nick, I forgot to ask but will the Stage I remove the speed limit and does it change the rpm limit, i.e. run WOT to 7K vice the ecu causing a shift point at 6800?

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalDave

Hey Nick..with all your experience in racing and modifying, do you think there is a real need for an oil catch can for the 2.0L? Picking your brain a little and giving the thread a bit of a 'bump'

Great 2 questions!

2msport · 06-28-2015, 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GSR Autosport

Yes and yes.

Hey not sure if you saw this question but I'm quite curious so I reposted it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SoCalDave

Hey Nick..with all your experience in racing and modifying, do you think there is a real need for an oil catch can for the 2.0L? Picking your brain a little and giving the thread a bit of a 'bump'

OpenAir · 06-29-2015, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2msport

Hey not sure if you saw this question but I'm quite curious so I reposted it.

I've got one in my car, and I plan on looking at it this weekend...will let you know if it "catches" anything. I will say that when I installed it, there was oil in the tubes...

FSociety · 07-02-2015, 12:42 PM

GSR Autosport has the 350wtq limiter been revised if it only affects Automatics and not Manual cars?

For us with 93 octane otherwise stock wanting to get the ECU Flash stage1 what will happen? Is the issue happening with 91 octane or 93 as well ?

goon Stubok what do you guys think

Stubok · 07-02-2015, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBNYC

GSR Autosport has the 350wtq limiter been revised if it only affects Automatics and not Manual cars?

For us with 93 octane otherwise stock wanting to get the ECU Flash stage1 what will happen? Is the issue happening with 91 octane or 93 as well ?

goon Stubok what do you guys think

I'm on stage 1 with CEL delete for DP.

Only put 93 in.

It seems like there is something funky going on with the DP and 93 combo.

That said I may not be a good example, as suspect a boost leak.

OpenAir · 07-02-2015, 07:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ROBNYC

GSR Autosport has the 350wtq limiter been revised if it only affects Automatics and not Manual cars?

For us with 93 octane otherwise stock wanting to get the ECU Flash stage1 what will happen? Is the issue happening with 91 octane or 93 as well ?

goon Stubok what do you guys think

This issue is with the Stage II tunes only. I have discussed this in depth with GSR Autosport and the Stage 1 tune is well below this limit. Not sure when and if the 350wtq limit will be found and addressed for auto's.

This is what the new Stage 1 tune looks like on a stock ride with 91:

Stubok · 07-02-2015, 08:15 PM

Thanks for the input!

Those are some low dyno numbers. I baselined 238hp and 260lbft on a dynojet on a 80deg day here in TX.

Based on those delta's I would be about 280hp and 310 lbft at the wheel.

In any case I know of at least 3 other guys plus me having some anomalies with stage 1. So there is something else at play with stage 1 and either coils, MAF, boost leak, stock DV or something else.

05-20-2015, 11:30 PM	#117
GSR Technik First Lieutenant 463 Rep 383 Posts Drives: F13 M6 \| E92 M3 \| '15 Mustang Join Date: Jul 2014 Location: Anaheim, California iTrader: (0)	We are going to be testing a development tune for our 228 MT Stage 2 specific for race fuel - this Friday. Going to be interesting to see what type of numbers she puts up. Then on to the Bimmerfest track event Saturday. Our baby is not going to be put in a corner - she's no booth queen - we're there to be on track! See you all there. We'll be in the garages. Nick...
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06-09-2015, 09:42 AM	#121
FSociety IG @bmwF9xG80 3812 Rep 7,593 Posts Drives: G80 M3, X4M, G07 X7m50 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: NYC to NJ to Orlando FL iTrader: (3) Garage List 2023 BMW G80 M3 [0.00] 2020 BMW X4MC [0.00] 16' BMW X4 M40i [10.00] 06 Cadillac STS [0.00]	bump __________________ 60-130mph 6.5s X4M #HCP 60-130mph 5.0s G80 M3 #OrlandoAutowerks Sauce IG: @bmwF9XG80
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06-17-2015, 12:49 PM	#122
isthar Second Lieutenant 60 Rep 273 Posts Drives: M235i xDrive Join Date: May 2015 Location: Boston, USA iTrader: (0)	M235 tune - does that apply to xdrive models? to auto models? __________________ //M235ix Alpine White
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06-19-2015, 10:50 AM	#124
OpenAir Captain 432 Rep 887 Posts Drives: Enzo F23 228i Join Date: May 2015 Location: MD, USA iTrader: (1) Garage List 2015 BMW 228i [0.00]	Money Sent...Stage I engaged! Now how about that axle back muffler delete! Bobby or Nick, I forgot to ask but will the Stage I remove the speed limit and does it change the rpm limit, i.e. run WOT to 7K vice the ecu causing a shift point at 6800? Last edited by OpenAir; 06-19-2015 at 11:02 AM..
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06-22-2015, 07:05 PM	#125
CalCarNut Brigadier General 1061 Rep 3,258 Posts Drives: 2015 F36 Jet Black Sport Line Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Blue Skies iTrader: (0) Garage List 2012 BMW X3 [0.00] 2015 BMW 428i Gran ... [10.00] 1996 Chevrolet Impa ... [8.00]	Hey Nick..with all your experience in racing and modifying, do you think there is a real need for an oil catch can for the 2.0L? Picking your brain a little and giving the thread a bit of a 'bump' __________________ 2015 BMW F36 428i JetBlack. Sport Line Edition 25% 3M Tint\|
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07-02-2015, 12:42 PM	#129
FSociety IG @bmwF9xG80 3812 Rep 7,593 Posts Drives: G80 M3, X4M, G07 X7m50 Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: NYC to NJ to Orlando FL iTrader: (3) Garage List 2023 BMW G80 M3 [0.00] 2020 BMW X4MC [0.00] 16' BMW X4 M40i [10.00] 06 Cadillac STS [0.00]	GSR Autosport has the 350wtq limiter been revised if it only affects Automatics and not Manual cars? For us with 93 octane otherwise stock wanting to get the ECU Flash stage1 what will happen? Is the issue happening with 91 octane or 93 as well ? goon Stubok what do you guys think __________________ 60-130mph 6.5s X4M #HCP 60-130mph 5.0s G80 M3 #OrlandoAutowerks Sauce IG: @bmwF9XG80
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07-02-2015, 08:15 PM	#132
Stubok Lieutenant 472 Rep 577 Posts Drives: Melbourne Red F30 328i M Sport Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Austin TX iTrader: (0)	Thanks for the input! Those are some low dyno numbers. I baselined 238hp and 260lbft on a dynojet on a 80deg day here in TX. Based on those delta's I would be about 280hp and 310 lbft at the wheel. In any case I know of at least 3 other guys plus me having some anomalies with stage 1. So there is something else at play with stage 1 and either coils, MAF, boost leak, stock DV or something else.
	Appreciate 1 Quote