[chattanooga240]

Originally Posted by Maynard

Gotta say I think this is a hella bad idea for anybody else considering it. I'll admit I'm biased, because of years working in a setting where you see the bad outcomes, not the good ones. Every parent I ever met was in denial, to some degree - once they hit the ICU, they were all great kids that caught a tragic bad break that mom and dad didn't really think about. Even the best and most level-headed of teenagers are susceptible to the kinds of quick bad decisions that can forever alter the course of a life; and not just theirs, but their friends and acquaintances too. I hope you get your son into that drivers school pronto, and also share a few 'quality moments' with him reviewing crash videos, and what happens to a car going 100 when the bonehead taking the speedo-selfie does something a bit off script (but no bragging and showing off on social media for junior, no sirree). Best wishes to stay safe.

What a silly post.

A 92 Honda Accord will cause the same type of death and dismemberment and could just as easily land a kid in the ICU.

If you think it is a hella bad idea for parents to put their kids in a bimmer, you better be just as much against them driving a grand caravan.

[Luv2]

That's a great story. congrats to your son and on being a cool Dad.
With the 2 Series, you picked a great car to learn how to feel a balanced car. You Have ruined him for future cars, now that he knows how they should be.... LOL

Hope you guys have safe and good times with the 2er !

[Rayscott]

Originally Posted by Le frog

Congrats! By any means, your son deserved it, and I am sure he will return you the favor by making you proud later in life. I hope that me too, one day I will get my daughter a fun car, IF she deserves it (I have time, she's only 7). And also, she WILL have a to drive a stick shift

I taught both of my daughters how to drive a stick. Got them used Honda Preludes and they loved them. Safe car and fun to drive.

[Maynard]

Sorry you think me silly, but you are quite wrong. You are correct that even the most disreputable cars today can easily achieve lethal speed, and in truth, when the crash happens, the kid would be better off in a BMW than an old beater (but was a 92 Honda really the second choice?). IF things go wrong, they go wrong faster and harder. And in teen world they are miles apart - and unfortunately I'm speaking from my own real world experience hearing the afterstories of far too many teen driving wrecks. Chickies won't urge you to give them a ride and do stupid shit in a Honda (or not as often). The other studly scions of wealth parents won't bet they can outrun you in a street drag. You won't be tempted to show off acceleration or g-loads to a car full of friends. And you won't be able to hit triple digits with the same ease and speed. Nobody wants to even think about this stuff, especially about their kids - they want "congrats on being a cool Dad". I'm not saying I didn't do lots of stupid shit in my day, and my parents certainly bought into this denial, but for parents considering this, it is a bad move. There are other IIHS #1 cars out there that are not so prone to these issues, not sports cars, and they would make a far safer first car.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Maynard

Sorry you think me silly, but you are quite wrong. You are correct that even the most disreputable cars today can easily achieve lethal speed, and in truth, when the crash happens, the kid would be better off in a BMW than an old beater (but was a 92 Honda really the second choice?). IF things go wrong, they go wrong faster and harder. And in teen world they are miles apart - and unfortunately I'm speaking from my own real world experience hearing the afterstories of far too many teen driving wrecks. Chickies won't urge you to give them a ride and do stupid shit in a Honda (or not as often). The other studly scions of wealth parents won't bet they can outrun you in a street drag. You won't be tempted to show off acceleration or g-loads to a car full of friends. And you won't be able to hit triple digits with the same ease and speed. Nobody wants to even think about this stuff, especially about their kids - they want "congrats on being a cool Dad". I'm not saying I didn't do lots of stupid shit in my day, and my parents certainly bought into this denial, but for parents considering this, it is a bad move. There are other IIHS #1 cars out there that are not so prone to these issues, not sports cars, and they would make a far safer first car.

You're correct of course in general, but you are speaking in broad generalities (which are statistically valid of course) about children that age. OP's geeky straight A student, his description, may not fall into your typical mold.

Hell I got a ticket for doing 90 in a 45 in my mother's 1.8 Passat once. My father's response when I came home was "nice work didn't know her car could do that." Point being if kids are going to do stupid shit they can do it in any car.

I grew up in an area where kids drove M3s, Porsches etc. In the land of ridiculous "cool dads" who buy their kids crazy cars, OP getting a reasonably priced and safe modern BMW with a quick buy not crazy fast engine is a solid choice. He knows his kid better than anyone here obviously and seems like he has a general concern for the kid's well being.

All that said I don't have children and am loathe to comment on anyone's parenting choices.

[chattanooga240]

Maynard you must be 80 and out of touch (see what I did there? consider yourself generalized).

The 92 accord and Grand Caravan were my first cars. (You can bet your ass no one drove them faster or harder than I did either, even though my parents hopes and instructions were to be extremely careful)

Either way, you are flat out wrong and there are plenty of statistics out there to back it up. Your real world experiences mean less than nothing, numbers are numbers and they do not lie. (Do some Google searching on teen accidents and what type of cars were involved, 80%+ are in cars worth under 25 grand)

The simple fact is, if you drive a Honda Civic like a moron, you are just as likely to die in it as a 228. The fact that one car runs the 1/4 mile 2 seconds faster than the other has very little to do with anything other than proving your out of touch stereotyping. The driver is the discerning factor.

If anything it is way more common to see kids die in cheaper cars because that is the common market of car drivers, not high end BMW's. You may hear about accident's more when the driver involved has a nicer car, but the simple truth is most teen accident victims are in lower model, cheaper cars.

I really don't know why I am bothering arguing common sense, but there you have it.

[chattanooga240]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

In the land of ridiculous "cool dads" who buy their kids crazy cars, OP getting a reasonably priced and safe modern BMW with a quick buy not crazy fast engine is a solid choice.

One could easily make the argument that this particular model 228 with newer and advanced safety features and handling characteristics, could be even more safe than a early 2000's Impala. (Driver withstanding)

[wjjkoevoets]

Awesome story! Hope your son gets to drive many safe miles.

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by nvmaddog

One could easily make the argument that this particular model 228 with newer and advanced safety features and handling characteristics, could be even more safe than a early 2000's Impala. (Driver withstanding)

My main point was that as long as you can trust your kid not to drive like an asshole the 228 is a very safe car. Personally I do not feel safe in a slow car - accident avoidance is often times best done quickly. Was told early and often as a child if you're going to do something stupid, be smart about it. In this case want to drive fast, spend a few $ on track time.

i3 not included bc I honestly don't know enough about it, but literally anything BMW sells now is a safe car if driven reasonably.

Forget about kid drivers, but in general you could make a very solid argument that no one needs anything in terms of high performance sports cars is much of the US given road conditions and laws. My brother had a 911 Turbo S for 6 months and sold it bc it was impossible to actually use the thing safely. You could drive it safely sure but it was a total waste didn't get anywhere close to "worth the money" on roads by us.

[Pparana]

Originally Posted by Sportstick

Could not disagaree more. At his age and neuromuscular development, this is NOT about performance. This is about learning and tuning his basic skills and reflexes. This is not what you get at the chapter events. The skills are completely transferable from the teaching car to whatever else he drives. After learning emergency avoidance manuevering in a Mustang GT at the school, my daugher came home and happened to be behind an 18 wheeler in her minivan when the truck tire chassis had a sudden failure and flew directly at her in pieces. She executed a perfect avoidance manuever, and noted right after that it was exactly what she was trained to do at Bondurant and she didn't think she would have reacted so well, without losing control (as many young drivers do with excessive inputs) without the training. If you want your son to learn high performance/racing, yes, local events can help. But, for basic skill elevation for safety, courses such as Bondurant (or Skip Barber, etc.) are in a completely different category.

For example, when was the last chapter event with a specialized skid car on rollers for training? Or, had emergency lane changing in response to multiple sets of traffic signals set up with electric eye triggers as cars approach at increasing speeds?

or with real instructors, not a guy who wants free track time and since he has a few hpdes and a weekend at an instructor class he is good. Last way I would want to teach my kid.

You might luck out w someone who knows what there doing but odds are way low. Real schools cost, but come with professional instructors (paid). Teen-focused ones are usually less expensive and the teens really like them.

Good choice, very safe car, I am not a fan of old cars for new drivers, like it or not they are the highest risk, they need the most modern safety you or they can afford.

[chattanooga240]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

My main point was that as long as you can trust your kid not to drive like an asshole the 228 is a very safe car.

Was mine too, 100%. The driver matters.

[harma24]

Originally Posted by Rayscott

I taught both of my daughters how to drive a stick. Got them used Honda Preludes and they loved them. Safe car and fun to drive.

I had a '01 Prelude for 15 years before my M240. I don't see a lot of them driving around anymore (not that there were ever many to begin with, which is why Honda ceased production). I'm surprised you found two of them! It was a very fun car; nice acceleration (especially when vtec kicked in), cornered well. I figure I spent somewhere around 5,000hrs in that drivers seat (170k miles). Every once in a while I still reach for a button where it was in the Prelude, only to find it's not there...

I'd miss it even more if my new car didn't handle that much better!


(Although I would still prefer cloth seats)

[3.0L]

This topic reminds me of classmate in our senior high school class of 1965. Our senior school year began in 1964; the same year that the awesome Pontiac GTO hit the showrooms. Much to our surprise, one of our classmates showed up with one. You know, 4-speed, three 2-barrel carburetors and all that. With out doubt, he had the coolest car in our entire high school, including the teachers and staff.

So what's the point. Well, this kid was a straight A student. He never got into trouble, before or after he got that absolutely awesome car. Looking back, he was mature beyond his years. I think his folks had him pegged just right. I can't say that about some of the other kids in our class, or their parents. Just the way it was... and is.

Having said that, I can certainly think of a few kids in our senior class that likely would've done OK with such a car, but the most probable reality was that few kids or parents of the day couldn't even begin to afford such car, including the gasoline and insurance.

[Fugly M3]

Congrats, great car! Question for you. Are all the kids now sporting used lift tickets on their jackets?

[Jk356]

season pass lift ticket?

[Fugly M3]

Originally Posted by Jk356

season pass lift ticket?

Really? My bad then...didn't think season passes were still made of paper!

[Jk356]

Originally Posted by E46M54325Ci

Really? My bad then...didn't think season passes were still made of paper!

might be his bmw performance school pass, haha

[bimmerfile]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

Check out the book the millionaire next door. Haven't read it in quite a while but go into detail about a theory they call economic outpatient care. Basically your wine analogy but with statistics behind it. Something like for every $1 you give someone you reduce their lifetime earnings by some multiple of that. Not true for everyone obviously they're aggregating big data, but definitely an interesting read.

Sounds like a good argument for coming up with a plan to get people off the welfare cycle.

[Fugly M3]

Originally Posted by Jk356

might be his bmw performance school pass, haha

from a famous song..."he's got a ticket to ride!"

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

Sounds like a good argument for coming up with a plan to get people off the welfare cycle.

That's a whole different very messy can of worms but yes the logic is perfectly applicable and sound. You've got potential increases in crime, access to education, demographic / racial implications etc. if you really wanted to make changes there you'd be better off with some kind of tiered incentive plan for like no job you get X, get a job we'll match your salary - if you get it right the recipients could end up w more money and cost taxpayers less.

Believe it or not hipsters driving gentrification are a huge problem for the poor from a housing perspective too. Those used to be shady now hip parts of towns with great restaurant and coffee bars manned by guys with handlebar mustaches drive up property values and force indigent folks out.

Unfortunately there are no easy answers to that problem and things are getting more and more socialist - who knows with Herr Trump in charge though he's a total wild card.

[Uptempo80]

Very nice. Congrats. When I was 17 I got my first car, a 1988 BMW 325i sedan Cirrus Blue metallic/ Silver leather with "luxus" pkg. Now in 2017...as June approaches I've had the car for 20 years come June 20th.
I'm 36 now and currently own a 6 month old 228i Convertible luxury pkg and full detailed build specs Mineral White metallic/Oyster with moonlight metallic top.

Unfortunately the 228i is the fastest car I've ever owned. It's plenty quick.
My father is BMW CCA club president for 30+ years in PA region. He has a E28 M5 and a E82 1 series M coupe. My younger Brother has 2 E30 M3's, a prepped E30 318is, and a 8 month old VW Golf R.

I take the backseat in the family...opting for the Elegant look of my cars. Both are concours participants. To each their own. I learned this as a forum addict from 1999-2005. I stopped going on the forums due to childish haters who threatened and attacked me and my car (a 2004 concours best in show winner) because it wasn't some "stance works media protege". My advice for a younger guy is enjoy your car. I wouldn't recommend going crazy with modding your car just to fit in. Focus on college n that's it.

[Fabspeed Motorsport]

This was an awesome write-up and story. Good luck with the car AJ!