[Bimmeration]

will wait.

[Bemo]

Originally Posted by LinkF1

Over 100 lbs difference between an N20 (304 lbs) and S55 (452 lbs).

While that may be the case, the M2 will have a reworked N55 engine. I couldn't dig out the N55 weight but found the following:

"The all-aluminum N20 I-4 is about 22 lbs. (10 kg) lighter than the N52. Overall, the engine weighs 304 lbs. (138 kg)."

So my comment stands in that significant weight savings will not be achieved by deleting 2 cylinders, alone.

[W///]

Originally Posted by Bemo

While that may be the case, the M2 will have a reworked N55 engine. I couldn't dig out the N55 weight but found the following:

"The all-aluminum N20 I-4 is about 22 lbs. (10 kg) lighter than the N52. Overall, the engine weighs 304 lbs. (138 kg)."

So my comment stands in that significant weight savings will not be achieved by deleting 2 cylinders, alone.

That's not a good example. You are comparing an N20 which is a turboed car vs an N52 which was NA and with use of magnesium.

A better example would be S65 V8 vs S85 V10. That's 445 lbs vs 529 lbs. These numbers were pulled from the interwebs, so they could be off (just trying to cover my ass here).

[Bemo]

Originally Posted by W///

That's not a good example. You are comparing an N20 which is a turboed car vs an N52 which was NA and with use of magnesium.

A better example would be S65 V8 vs S85 V10. That's 445 lbs vs 529 lbs. These numbers were pulled from the interwebs, so they could be off (just trying to cover my ass here).

That may well be the case but don't bottle neck the conversation into engine weight-based savings alone. We need a lighter chassis/components for something more significant...

[W///]

Originally Posted by Bemo

That may well be the case but don't bottle neck the conversation into engine weight-based savings alone. We need a lighter chassis/components for something more significant...

When you are talking about 80-100 lbs difference, I don't think that's insignificant, but I do agree that chassis and components is a huge part of it. So you potentially need both to make a difference.

For example, look at the 335i vs an F80. Both in 6MT form, it's 3555 lbs vs 3540 lbs. Again, people just have to be realistic with how much the weight of the M2 will be.

[Bemo]

Originally Posted by W///

When you are talking about 80-100 lbs difference, I don't think that's insignificant, but I do agree that chassis and components is a huge part of it. So you potentially need both to make a difference.

For example, look at the 335i vs an F80. Both in 6MT form, it's 3555 lbs vs 3540 lbs. Again, people just have to be realistic with how much the weight of the M2 will be.

Trust me I get it, we'll never get a "Porsche" weight for BMW money.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

The M2 is standard M. Muscular front and rear with striking and unique aerodynamics.
The Secondary car is a slimmer variant of the Vision GT car more in tune with the width of the M235i Racing Car.

Originally Posted by Jason

BMW head of design, Adrian van Hooydonk, may have just dropped an official hint. Speaking to Autocar, he stated that "The E30 M3 has a really big fan base, and we are going to be taking cues from it for a future product."

At launch, the 1M (6-banger) was marketed as a spiritual follow-up to the E30 M3 (4-banger). So this time BMW is taking it to the next level.

M2: okay, an N55B30T0 6-banger was already confirmed, so that engine layout will likely sport the M2 base model.
Main field of operation: road. Occasional field of operation: race track.

But what about the M2 CSL/GTS engine layout ? The E30 M3 = S14 4-banger (for the record: E30 M3 FAQ). So, may we guess a re-entry of the concept of a reworked N20 4-banger (N20 Technical Training) leightweight sports car featuring especially 'flared' body panels and an agressive aero package ?
Main field of operation: race track. Occassional field of operation: road.

• "Although work has commenced on the "Downsized" M, The M2 or the replacement for the most admired 1er M Coupe.
  It is known as the "Downsized" M because BMW M are investigating the concept of a completely reworked N20 based four cylinder in terms of the successor to the 1M offering the same recipe as before but with lower weight but still offering the entry to M ownership with the key of precision rather than outright power."
  http://www.f30post.com/forums/showpo...9&postcount=23 - July 2012)
• "BMW M2 Coupe - Successor to the BMW 1 Series M Coupe continues the same formula that made the last car be memorable, no huge competitor in the HP race, four cylinder will bring less weight, which matter most as does more enjoyment and overall feel is considered to be more of a priority than who has the biggest numbers. Already confirmed to be coming by BMW CEO.
  BMW M2 Gran Coupe - Baby Coupe inherits a four door brother and RWD, Direct competitor to the Mercedes-Benz CLA45 AMG. Scott26 shares that there are now firm plans for an M2 Gran Coupe."
  (http://www.2addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=818302 - March 2013)
• "Drop two cylinders of the Autoexpress article [i.e. 4-cyl. instead of 6-cyl.].
  BMW want the fastest four cylinder car in its segment. They also want the M2 to be the most progressive and dynamic car in its segment as well as the lightest performance car. They want a car that has a soul, unlike the Mercedes-Benz AMG A45/CLA 45 which are soulless to drive."
  (http://www.2addicts.com/forums/showp...77&postcount=3 - January 2014)

As we recall, two types of M2 test mule bodies were spotted alongside each other during winter testing last January. Might have been two different puppies of the same breed.

Tag line suggestion for the M2 GTS/CSL: "It got flare".

[swagon]

All the people wanting an inline four... WTF. An inline six engine, even turbocharged, sounds way better than a turbocharged four cylinder. Period. 6+ or GTFO.

[///Mobbin]

I would highly prefer the I-6 turbo in either offering.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by swagon

All the people wanting an inline four... WTF. An inline six engine, even turbocharged, sounds way better than a turbocharged four cylinder. Period. 6+ or GTFO.

Yeah pretty much this for me. I6 is what I enjoy about BMW. I think the dev costs would be a bit skewed maybe tuning up 2 differing engines for the same car. M3 and M3 CSL prior have been the same displacement haven't they?

[Bemo]

I-6 fan here.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by swagon

All the people wanting an inline four... WTF. An inline six engine, even turbocharged, sounds way better than a turbocharged four cylinder. Period. 6+ or GTFO.

Let there be no doubt. Personally also favoring the 6-cyl, but a main issue is weight reduction.

Autocar in the M2 article: "With the existing M235i coupé weighing 1535kg, a lightweight M2 should come in at closer to 1400kg." (http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/ne...-new-bmw-m-car).

If 1400 kg (3086 lbs) is the M2 CSL/GTS target weight figure - could be mere speculation though - then dropping 2 cyl might be inevitable to achieve that goal.

There's no doubt that the M2 base model will feature a 6-cyl.

[RingMeister01]

Originally Posted by Bemo

I-6 fan here.

+1000

[dmboone25]

I honestly don't care if it is a 4 or 6, as long as it's a bad mofo.

I had a couple of turbo Jettas that were 4s and really enjoyed them - to me, it's more about what the overall package will deliver.

[auf Deutsch]

The BMW I6 is crazy good.

[m981addicts]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Let there be no doubt. Personally also favoring the 6-cyl, but a main issue is weight reduction.

Autocar in the M2 article: "With the existing M235i coupé weighing 1535kg, a lightweight M2 should come in at closer to 1400kg." (http://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/ne...-new-bmw-m-car).

If 1400 kg (3086 lbs) is the M2 CSL/GTS target weight figure - could be mere speculation though - then dropping 2 cyl might be inevitable to achieve that goal.

There's no doubt that the M2 base model will feature a 6-cyl.

I too love the I6 (currently have an S52,N54, & N55) BUT, I would be very interested and would love to test drive the M2 with an I4 with a much lighter weight...my Mz3 is about 3086. I can't imagine how much fun the M2 would be.

[filet.M2c]

BMW's I6 has been my favorite engine. The e46 and N54 were both a blast. I currently DD a GTI with a tune while I wait for the M2 and the driving experience is utterly uninspiring in comparison. Granted it's FWD, but even my buddy's STI didn't feel nearly as enjoyable as my rev happy M3. Another +1 for I6

[esp42089]

I would be very excited to see how the M division would breath life into a modern 4. The S14 was one heckuva engine for the time period, still is today in fact. Unbelievable amount of power per liter compared to other NA motors. I mean that thing was pushing 240hp in street trim by the end. In race trim, the S14 was pushing 340hp NA! Everyone is all hot and bothered about the Honda S2000's F20c, but BMW was pumping similiar power a decade earlier without even needing to rev it to the moon.

I can only imagine that a S38b20 (or whatever it would be) would end up feeling pretty special. Most people end up really liking bespoke M engines, and I imagine a 4pot wouldn't disappoint any more than the S55 did.

[Artemis]

A certain "Herr26" (hm, very likely "The Sipping One") posted the following interesting comment under the recent Bimmerfile article "Rumor: BMW to build an M2 CSL?" (http://www.bimmerfile.com/2015/03/19...ild-an-m2-csl/):

"The standard M2 is a more realistic version of the Vision GT which when you bring it back into typical M proportions you still get a muscular body and uniquely honed aerodynamic packet. The "sibling" packs on more "visual" bulk so it looks like an M2 but with additional equipment it's slightly wider but this is helped by the add-on wheel arches at the same width of the M235i Race Car [BMW M235i Racing]. Not too big and not too wide but the differences in width between standard and "sibling" are apparent as is the aerodynamics aided with a more race-like splitter, diffuser and spoiler. It's the first BMW "Batmobile" since the E21.
The body is not the only difference between both cars. Crucial performance figures will differ as will weight with the sibling being tuned more for the track."

For the record: max width of the BMW M235i Racing = 1,862mm (without mirrors).

[Adem1534]

Originally Posted by Artemis

A certain "Herr26" (hm, very likely "The Sipping One") posted the following interesting comment under the recent Bimmerfile article "Rumor: BMW to build an M2 CSL?" (http://www.bimmerfile.com/2015/03/19...ild-an-m2-csl/):

"The standard M2 is a more realistic version of the Vision GT which when you bring it back into typical M proportions you still get a muscular body and uniquely honed aerodynamic packet. The "sibling" packs on more "visual" bulk so it looks like an M2 but with additional equipment it's slightly wider but this is helped by the add-on wheel arches at the same width of the M235i Race Car [BMW M235i Racing]. Not too big and not too wide but the differences in width between standard and "sibling" are apparent as is the aerodynamics aided with a more race-like splitter, diffuser and spoiler. It's the first BMW "Batmobile" since the E21.
The body is not the only difference between both cars. Crucial performance figures will differ as will weight with the sibling being tuned more for the track."

For the record: max width of the BMW M235i Racing = 1,862mm (without mirrors).

I wonder if they'll be revealed/released at the same time.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Adem1534

I wonder if they'll be revealed/released at the same time.

The Sipping One referred to the angry pocket rocket version (M2 CSL/GTS) as "under investigation" and that he likes to think of it as a potential GT4 rival. Base M2 is in the advanced development stadium (Spring road testing is on its way).

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

[T]here is more finished prototypes that will be hitting the Ring soon as we are just about in Spring and more finished cars with colour and more production-esque features will begin testing.
The marketing commences soon also.

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

It looks as if they are investigating a more hardcore M2 having seen one at a test track, mixing aerodynamics of the Vision GT and the Racing but identifiable as the M2 but far more muscular and brutal than the standard M2. It could be for racing purpose showcase but I like to Think of it as a potential rival to the Porsche Cayman GT4 and the first modern BMW "Batmobile" since the E9.
Sips Tea...

[JHFW89225]

Hows this? Added headlight vents, hood vent from Vision GT, widen, and lips. Any of course deeper sculpting on front fascia from inputs on the forum.