[WolfGTI]

We've got a late 2015 E81 X1 with the M sport package - it's not the 3L turbo 6, but it's pretty decent. The steering feel is awesome and it's decently capable in turns. No interest in the FWD based replacement that is current now.

[xantdieselx]

Originally Posted by Benandluna

I had fun in my old golf, but holy crap did that car have so many issues. My brothers Passat too. I'd stay clear from vw.

Agree with this statement. Had an 11' GTI before my F30. More issues than any car in recent memory. The day I picked up the car the voice activation was stuck in German. Didn't even have the car for 10 minutes and it was in the service bay.

That was just the start, DSG failed twice, subframe mounts, body creaks, leaking rear window washer, discolored calipers, wheel center caps would launch off...I could go on and on.

Great little car dynamically but piss poor reliability.

[Mr Carrots]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

We looked at the current one it's nice enough for what it is - but you're right it's not the same as the old one. For its target audience it's perfectly fine, but it's no X1 35.

We drove the current X1, 335 GT and 328 sport wagon. GT is garbage, I'd get one for GF realtor since so versatile and great for clients w giant back seat but no fun to drive. X1 was meh, biggest issue was I could not sit in the front seat. I'm 5'6" and fit so I should really be comfortable in most if not all cars, but they just hit me in a really awkward spot and I couldn't feel my legs after a while. Some people love the seats though, go figure.

The 3 and 5 GT's are such a slap in the face from BMW, they're the only way to get an awful, impractical 'wagon' with the N55 - and even when they kill the 330 wagon next year I'm sure they will keep those bloated pieces of junk around.

Living in the Bay area there are a few of their target market driving them around, elderly mainland Chinese who buy them in Gold, but I can't imagine they're big sellers here in the US (I assume that in China they do better as they seem designed for that market's taste in cars with the long wheelbase)

If they gave us the actual wagons with the 6 cylinders I'd have been all over those, but the 4 cylinder is just too expensive for what it is.

We actually considered the VW sportwagen, which again is only offered in the most basic low end package here with the 1.8 TSI - apparently with a APR ecu tune it gets up to GTI performance levels, which is tempting for 21k (massive discounts from the formerly cocky VW this year) - add some 18's and lower it and it would be a nice enough little FWD dog hauler.. but my wife didn't like the look

[SteveAustin]

I appreciate everyone's input - I am not sure what I was thinking -- my 228i has been such a tight and reliable machine. I will wait it out and probably look at the VW R in a couple of years after mine is paid off (given it's still made in the Fatherland). I have to say though, if you haven't test driven one of these Rs, you gotta try one out. It's a tight, planted, and responsive car. It's such a good bang for the buck!

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Mr Carrots

The 3 and 5 GT's are such a slap in the face from BMW, they're the only way to get an awful, impractical 'wagon' with the N55 - and even when they kill the 330 wagon next year I'm sure they will keep those bloated pieces of junk around.

Living in the Bay area there are a few of their target market driving them around, elderly mainland Chinese who buy them in Gold, but I can't imagine they're big sellers here in the US (I assume that in China they do better as they seem designed for that market's taste in cars with the long wheelbase)

If they gave us the actual wagons with the 6 cylinders I'd have been all over those, but the 4 cylinder is just too expensive for what it is.

We actually considered the VW sportwagen, which again is only offered in the most basic low end package here with the 1.8 TSI - apparently with a APR ecu tune it gets up to GTI performance levels, which is tempting for 21k (massive discounts from the formerly cocky VW this year) - add some 18's and lower it and it would be a nice enough little FWD dog hauler.. but my wife didn't like the look

It's really sad. My dad is a wagon guy and I am basically out of cars to get him at this point. Crossovers are too tall for easy entry / egress so I'm down to very few options. Under $100K you've got what the Allroad (had one) the Benz (really big car) and the 328/330? Not going to get him a Volvo or Subaru although they're nice for what they are. That new VW is ok too whatever it's called the mini Allroad.

At this point it's either stay happy with the Stage 1 wagon until the wheels fall off or I've gotta come up with $125k for an E63 or what $175k for that super sexiness Porsche just dropped? For a 5 mile daily commute both seem a little excessive.

[Mr Carrots]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

It's really sad. My dad is a wagon guy and I am basically out of cars to get him at this point. Crossovers are too tall for easy entry / egress so I'm down to very few options. Under $100K you've got what the Allroad (had one) the Benz (really big car) and the 328/330? Not going to get him a Volvo or Subaru although they're nice for what they are. That new VW is ok too whatever it's called the mini Allroad.

At this point it's either stay happy with the Stage 1 wagon until the wheels fall off or I've gotta come up with $125k for an E63 or what $175k for that super sexiness Porsche just dropped? For a 5 mile daily commute both seem a little excessive.

The VW is the alltrak? It's a plastic clad, 'Americanized' version of the sportwagen which costs a few grand more, meanwhile in Europe they get a Golf R wagon to go with their 550 touring and all the other amazing vehicles we'll never see.

We DO get the E400 wagon here, with the TT 6 which in theory should be good for pushing 400+ HP after an ECU tune.. sadly it was out of our price range (one income and a bay area mortgage doesn't leave much for nice second cars!) but it might be worth considering?

[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by Mr Carrots

The VW is the alltrak? It's a plastic clad, 'Americanized' version of the sportwagen which costs a few grand more, meanwhile in Europe they get a Golf R wagon to go with their 550 touring and all the other amazing vehicles we'll never see.

We DO get the E400 wagon here, with the TT 6 which in theory should be good for pushing 400+ HP after an ECU tune.. sadly it was out of our price range (one income and a bay area mortgage doesn't leave much for nice second cars!) but it might be worth considering?

Yeah the E is nice but bigger than we want (mom won't drive it). The 328 with Dinan Stage 1 is no slouch it's actually a very nice car with all the safety doodads dad wanted. Top view camera for instance is excellent.

Perfection, at least for what we need, would have been a 335 or 340 wagon with Dinan Stage 2.

Once you start looking at crossovers the Macan S is a spectacular car and I have very high hopes for the new XC60. Those are too tall for dad though sold the Macan after 6 months. Still miss it absolutely loved it.

Btw sorry for thread jacking!

[KO7]

My 2016 Golf R is now at just under 22,000 kms of use, picked up in November of 2015. First ever new car for me, and second VW (had a 2012 GTI which gave me no problems).

The R is a phenomenal value for the money here in Canada. Got mine for MSRP of ~$43k CAD as sort of an early adopter up here. With a sunroof, which I still miss, it would be the perfect daily driver. It's faster off the line and up to sane speeds than darn near anything I'd encounter on the road, while mostly flying under the radar to anyone except car enthusiasts.

[Portadown95]

Chris Harris has a "golf r versus 235" video from several years ago. He chose the 235.

If you need 4 doors and money is not a concern, I would take the R ( or in Europe, a 140 hatchback).

Need 4 doors and money is an object: gti. I had one and loved it. Best dollar for dollar car around.

Otherwise, I think the 230 and 240 are a better choice.

[B58togo]

Originally Posted by Portadown95

Chris Harris has a "golf r versus 235" video from several years ago. He chose the 235.

If you need 4 doors and money is not a concern, I would take the R ( or in Europe, a 140 hatchback).

Need 4 doors and money is an object: gti. I had one and loved it. Best dollar for dollar car around.

Otherwise, I think the 230 and 240 are a better choice.

He chose the M235i on a personal level, but objectively, he stated the R was the more capable track car: "More composed, more sophisticated chassis/suspension, brakes less prone to fade." And this was actually against an LSD equipped M235i.

[scratchypants]

I have a 2016 GTI Autobahn, leather, tech and I'm getting rid of it because I find it painfully uncomfortable. It took about 3 months to find a seating position that wasn't excruciating, and I haven't been able to find a position that is anything better than bearable. If someone moves my seat (no memory), I'm screwed for the next week trying to get it back.

It did have a problem in the beginning with the rear sensors cutting out - (VW Canada and dealer) fixed by removing foam material from around the sensors which was apparently hanging on to excess moisture. Other than that, no issues.

This experience has taught me that before any long term commitment, it's a very good idea to take the potential vehicle for at least a 24hr test drive. Even if that means renting.

[fbsm]

Originally Posted by scratchypants

I have a 2016 GTI Autobahn, leather, tech and I'm getting rid of it because I find it painfully uncomfortable. It took about 3 months to find a seating position that wasn't excruciating, and I haven't been able to find a position that is anything better than bearable. If someone moves my seat (no memory), I'm screwed for the next week trying to get it back.

It did have a problem in the beginning with the rear sensors cutting out - (VW Canada and dealer) fixed by removing foam material from around the sensors which was apparently hanging on to excess moisture. Other than that, no issues.

This experience has taught me that before any long term commitment, it's a very good idea to take the potential vehicle for at least a 24hr test drive. Even if that means renting.

I have encountered similar issues with other recently produced VW's

I've been unable to find a really good position that doesnt leave my right leg hitting the WRONG place in the center console which over longer drives end up creating a screaming/tearing burning pain in my calf.........I can drive my 2 series for 3-4 hours without this ever being an issue.......45 mins in the VW and I'm wishing for some advil.

I'll need to rent one for a couple days to see if there have been significant enough changes to mitigate this issue for me but otherwise I love the car

My biggest concern about the R is the longevity/cost of the haldex/awd over time.....like 200k

[Portadown95]

Originally Posted by B58togo

He chose the M235i on a personal level, but objectively, he stated the R was the more capable track car: "More composed, more sophisticated chassis/suspension, brakes less prone to fade." And this was actually against an LSD equipped M235i.

He also said the 235 was "perfection" when he closed the article. And that was without the B58! Auto journalists must be diplomatic and his almost cold and mechanical description of the golf r spoke volumes. Hell the term "fast golf" was as much an implied slam as anything. The golf r is a great car but it cannot compare to the driving dynamics of a rear wheel drive car with a near 50-5o weight distribution.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by Portadown95

The golf r is a great car but it cannot compare to the driving dynamics of a rear wheel drive car with a near 50-5o weight distribution.

[krhodes1]

Originally Posted by BEM-S4

$40k is tough especially when you can get a sport GTI for literally half that. There are like 10 listed near me for under $23k down from $29k.

I traded my '16 M235i for a '17 Golf GTI Sport and couldn't be happier about it. In a lot of ways I like the GTI better (it's more "me" than the M235i was). And yep, got it for ~$23K. The R is not remotely worth the added cost to me, I have zero use for AWD in a street car. For that kind of money I would (obviously did) buy a BMW. In an ideal world I would have had the option of an M135i and had the BMW's drivetrain with most of the VW's practicality.

[brennok]

Shopped the M235i vs my 2016 Golf R and ended up with the Golf R with DCC/Nav and DSG.

Much like some can't justify the 40k for the Golf R over the GTI, the M235i was tough to justify for another 8-10k over the Golf R. The Golf R was just under 40K and I was looking at 48k or so even after USAA discounts.

Second after price was the hatch. I love having a hatch and it is my only car. I don't have access to a SUV anymore to haul things so I rely on filling my hatch which I do about every other weekend. I was concerned the M235i would be tough to deal with when I needed to haul stuff. I also wanted to test drive Xdrive vs RWD, but they didn't have any to drive and I prefer AWD these days.

I do wonder sometimes if I made the right choice since my previous car was 2008 R32 so it feels like a minor change going to the Golf R. The M235i would have been a nice change. Then again when I fill my hatch and rear seat or fold down the seats to carry big items I wonder if I could have gotten by with the M235i.

As far as reliability, my previous two VWs were trouble free so it wasn't a concern for me. My local VW dealers are pretty good, but wasn't that impressed with the one BMW dealership close to me which even had negative comments on here.

It would be so much easier and tougher if BMW, Audi, and MB brought their hatches over here. I would love to cross shop the M140i, RS3 sportback, A45 AMG, and Golf R.

I just don't know what I will go to next since the R400 was cancelled.

[msej449]

I'm glad I went for the M235i 'vert against the hardtop as I've found that I have top down much more than I expected. Days like today (bright & sunny, albeit a bit cool) an otherwise mundane drive is transformed into something much more fun. I've had a convertible long ago, and I had to put the top up/down manually, so sub-20 secs is a luxury.

All I'd say about M235i 'vert luggage space is that I found it to be much more capacious than I expected. And that was coming from a 3 Series Touring. We ran it in on a summer road trip and carried three suitcases, a load of hiking equipment, a bag of boots and shoes, two boxes of stuff and a portable refrigerator - all with the top down.

But the Golf R is a serious contender, especially if your geo doesn't have the M140i available. What I'd recommend is you try a 'vert on a nice day with the top down and see what you think. On an earlier post re space, one person took their typical luggage down to the dealer and tried it out on a 'vert and was similarly surprised that it fitted fine. Just make sure you have the folding rear seat.

[krhodes1]

Originally Posted by brennok

Shopped the M235i vs my 2016 Golf R and ended up with the Golf R with DCC/Nav and DSG.

Much like some can't justify the 40k for the Golf R over the GTI, the M235i was tough to justify for another 8-10k over the Golf R. The Golf R was just under 40K and I was looking at 48k or so even after USAA discounts.

Second after price was the hatch. I love having a hatch and it is my only car. I don't have access to a SUV anymore to haul things so I rely on filling my hatch which I do about every other weekend. I was concerned the M235i would be tough to deal with when I needed to haul stuff. I also wanted to test drive Xdrive vs RWD, but they didn't have any to drive and I prefer AWD these days.

I do wonder sometimes if I made the right choice since my previous car was 2008 R32 so it feels like a minor change going to the Golf R. The M235i would have been a nice change. Then again when I fill my hatch and rear seat or fold down the seats to carry big items I wonder if I could have gotten by with the M235i.

As far as reliability, my previous two VWs were trouble free so it wasn't a concern for me. My local VW dealers are pretty good, but wasn't that impressed with the one BMW dealership close to me which even had negative comments on here.

It would be so much easier and tougher if BMW, Audi, and MB brought their hatches over here. I would love to cross shop the M140i, RS3 sportback, A45 AMG, and Golf R.

I just don't know what I will go to next since the R400 was cancelled.

Interesting take, and quite sensible. Obviously, I did think the M235i was worth the money when I was just buying it as a toy. When I bought it, I only lived in Maine and had a Land Rover Disco and a BMW wagon in the garage as well. So the only thing it needed to haul was @ss. But then I bought a second home in Florida, and the M235i became an only car there. And the impracticality of it became a major issue. So I traded down to a GTI. I miss the smoothness of the big six (and iDrive), but the GTI is way more than fast enough on this side of the pond.

Ultimately, these are all fabulous cars and you can't go wrong with any of them. 228i vs. regular GTI or Golf R vs. M235i. The one BIG plus to the BMWs is European Delivery - the month I spent driving 4600 miles around Europe with my Mom are absolutely priceless memories. No regrets at all about the money I spent to have that car for 18 months, worth every penny.

[Beartato]

Originally Posted by fbsm

I have encountered similar issues with other recently produced VW's

I've been unable to find a really good position that doesnt leave my right leg hitting the WRONG place in the center console which over longer drives end up creating a screaming/tearing burning pain in my calf.........I can drive my 2 series for 3-4 hours without this ever being an issue.......45 mins in the VW and I'm wishing for some advil.

I dumped my 2015 Golf because of this exact issue. The car was great otherwise but the leg thing was a deal breaker. After looking at a few cars I sat in a 2 Series and I knew it was the one. Unlike the Golf which took a couple weeks with fine-tuning to get the seat in a good spot, minimal adjustments after a ballpark positioning was needed to find the perfect seating spot. Everything is so perfect, ergonomically, for me in the 2 Series, and I'm 6'3" 170 pounds with proportionally short arms so it's hard to fit in cars without having my knees in the dash or having to lean forward to grab the top of the wheel. With the Golf I'm pretty sure it was the knees in dash thing, I don't have that problem in the 2 Series. I can drive for hours in the 2 Series and feel great afterward.

[DF]

Even though I crossed shopped these cars they shouldn't be cross shopped. Way too many differences. They are really just too different in the real world

[KO7]

I love my Golf R but it really needs to be test-driven before a decision is made. I *need* the hatchback utility, and love the AWD, the standard features, and the unbeatable price in Canada, but it really isn't that exciting of a drive compared to RWD or rwd-bias AWD. It's pretty much the perfect daily driver in a city with tight parking, but it's no substitute for a fun weekend toy.

[Dylan86]

Originally Posted by KO7

I love my Golf R but it really needs to be test-driven before a decision is made. I *need* the hatchback utility, and love the AWD, the standard features, and the unbeatable price in Canada, but it really isn't that exciting of a drive compared to RWD or rwd-bias AWD. It's pretty much the perfect daily driver in a city with tight parking, but it's no substitute for a fun weekend toy.

I can appreciate every ounce of this statement. We kept the GTI for the same reasons mentioned. It just wasn't THAT much of an upgrade from an Autobahn GTI to justify the loss and it's still FWD biased.. Looking at trading the GTI for a Golf Alltrack (believe it or not!) as opposed to the R, at this point. Has way more utility, the DSG/AWD Golf platform is finally available in Canada (FINALLY VW, FFS!!!) and has a proper sunroof and ground clearance for the "go everywhere" vehicle it should be.