[MooMooM2]

Isnt the thing people love about the m2 that its a bit unrully? Its shorter base and bites easy but if you know what you are doing is very easy to control. That was why every journalist liked the car. Suspension is bad on the street for sure, bouncy and way too stiff can’t argue there so I would agree that the new m2 is probably a better put of the box street car. The non bucket seats also look very comfortable. Only thing is looses is back seat if you actually need to carry people which is kind of a big deal on a car that a lot of people buy because has a back seat vs a p car

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by MooMooM2

Isnt the thing people love about the m2 that its a bit unrully? Its shorter base and bites easy but if you know what you are doing is very easy to control. That was why every journalist liked the car. Suspension is bad on the street for sure, bouncy and way too stiff can’t argue there so I would agree that the new m2 is probably a better put of the box street car. The non bucket seats also look very comfortable. Only thing is looses is back seat if you actually need to carry people which is kind of a big deal on a car that a lot of people buy because has a back seat vs a p car

I don't doubt the fact that the F87 M2C is a super fun car... it's the most fun car I've ever owned... unfortunately it has some very serious faults for being an M car that made me question how BMW let this car leave the factory the way it did.... in many ways it felt like my older slightly modified 135i. Fun unfortunately doesn't always translate to a solid performance / sports car... there is definitely a lot of irony in the fact that my X3 M40i with base adaptive suspension feels far more confident on MANY roads and turns than my m2c did... not really sure how that is remotely possible... but it's more stable, less bouncy and doesn't feel like the rear end will slip out if i push it harder.

The thing is tho... these faults were made known when the F87 initially came out... Matt Farah pointed all of this out and how sloppy the handling is in his initial review... he was panned after that review when everyone else said its' the greatest thing since sliced bread... except here is what all of those reviews missed... they were all on a track and no one ever drove the car hard on the street on normal roads. Chris harris loved the m2c... all of his reviews where on the track and he modified his personal M2c only to sell it a year later... so again... i think the car was far overhyped for what it was. From what I am hearing the G87 fixes a ton of this.

[DanG]

Originally Posted by ASAP

I don't doubt the fact that the F87 M2C is a super fun car... it's the most fun car I've ever owned... unfortunately it has some very serious faults for being an M car that made me question how BMW let this car leave the factory the way it did.... in many ways it felt like my older slightly modified 135i. Fun unfortunately doesn't always translate to a solid performance / sports car... there is definitely a lot of irony in the fact that my X3 M40i with base adaptive suspension feels far more confident on MANY roads and turns than my m2c did... not really sure how that is remotely possible... but it's more stable, less bouncy and doesn't feel like the rear end will slip out if i push it harder.

The thing is tho... these faults were made known when the F87 initially came out... Matt Farah pointed all of this out and how sloppy the handling is in his initial review... he was panned after that review when everyone else said its' the greatest thing since sliced bread... except here is what all of those reviews missed... they were all on a track and no one ever drove the car hard on the street on normal roads. Chris harris loved the m2c... all of his reviews where on the track and he modified his personal M2c only to sell it a year later... so again... i think the car was far overhyped for what it was. From what I am hearing the G87 fixes a ton of this.

Six years in on stock suspension, I have no idea what is “bouncy” about the suspension. It is much more planted than my E46 M3 ever was. And no one has ever complained to me that the ride was too stiff. That includes my wife.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by DanG

Six years in on stock suspension, I have no idea what is “bouncy” about the suspension. It is much more planted than my E46 M3 ever was. And no one has ever complained to me that the ride was too stiff. That includes my wife.

i guess you've either A) never driven the car hard on the street or B) only driven it under perfect conditions / roads...

i'll give you an example, i went on some backroads that were curvy w a few friends that owned older C5 / C6 Corvettes... one was a 20 year old C5 on stock suspension... his car felt wildly more planted than mine... i also had a hard time pushing it in the corners with them for fear of the rear end just letting go and because there were areas where the roads weren't even, the car just bobbed up and down like crazy... even in a straightline, someone made a video behind me and as we were going over uneven roads, you could literally see the bobbing from the rear... seems odd... but my 135i had the EXACT same problem until I replaced the rear subframe bushings with solid ones... granted that created other problems

[donkey]

Originally Posted by ASAP

i guess you've either A) never driven the car hard on the street or B) only driven it under perfect conditions / roads...

i'll give you an example, i went on some backroads that were curvy w a few friends that owned older C5 / C6 Corvettes... one was a 20 year old C5 on stock suspension... his car felt wildly more planted than mine... i also had a hard time pushing it in the corners with them for fear of the rear end just letting go and because there were areas where the roads weren't even, the car just bobbed up and down like crazy... even in a straightline, someone made a video behind me and as we were going over uneven roads, you could literally see the bobbing from the rear... seems odd... but my 135i had the EXACT same problem until I replaced the rear subframe bushings with solid ones... granted that created other problems

I had a F30 335i that did what you described... Doesn't happen with my M2 though.

Crazy thought - shipping blocks?
https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=22746060

[MooMooM2]

hmmmm we must be driving a different car here, the car is plenty planted. Every single track day I have done never had the car bob up and down or step out on me just randomly or anything weird at all. Car is very predictable and feels great through the corners but suspension could be better of course

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by MooMooM2

hmmmm we must be driving a different car here, the car is plenty planted. Every single track day I have done never had the car bob up and down or step out on me just randomly or anything weird at all. Car is very predictable and feels great through the corners but suspension could be better of course

Reading is VERY key here...

[MooMooM2]

Originally Posted by ASAP

Reading is VERY key here...

and every time I have driven it on the street as well, just never had that experience but I will admit that I don't push it much on the street.

[MooMooM2]

track spec, now we are talking, looks very aggressive and at home. Same with the g80 which i always thought looked great in track spec the g87 does too. Proper tested aero, this thing is going to rip. Also cool that they are figuring out a way to close the oil cooler entry point

[MSH_]

Originally Posted by MooMooM2

hmmmm we must be driving a different car here, the car is plenty planted. Every single track day I have done never had the car bob up and down or step out on me just randomly or anything weird at all. Car is very predictable and feels great through the corners but suspension could be better of course

Originally Posted by MooMooM2

and every time I have driven it on the street as well, just never had that experience but I will admit that I don't push it much on the street.

I agree and my M2C is primarily a canyon carver/backroads ripper on roads like this 5 minutes from my garage. Also, Colorado roads are far from pristine. I also don't baby this thing on these drives. Although I haven't tracked my M2C yet I come from a road course heavy background in my NorCal days running Advanced/Instructor group in a track sorted M Coupe.

[murderspice]

Smells like revisionism in here.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by murderspice

Smells like revisionism in here.

https://youtu.be/TEKXTzAXIOA?si=eC1yII5KXgj2zjd1

[qnet]

Originally Posted by ASAP

https://youtu.be/TEKXTzAXIOA?si=eC1yII5KXgj2zjd1

He seems to enjoy the OG M2 a little more.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-yOtQJbYFUk

[ThreeStripes]

Originally Posted by ASAP

but in the end, the G87 is just a far better car... BMW knew the shortcomings on the F87 that were obvious to me from day one...

The video of Matt Farah you posted includes way more complaining about weight than it does suspension which wasn’t exactly something they “fixed” in the G87.

So, I disagree with your take. Mortal Kombat is the best video game of all time. Donkey Kong stinks.

[MSH_]

Originally Posted by ASAP

https://youtu.be/TEKXTzAXIOA?si=eC1yII5KXgj2zjd1

And for the one shit review you will find loads of others raving about the M2C(Joe Achilles (bought one and still has it), Throttle House, The Straight Pipes, etc). As far as Chris Harris, yes his vid review was on track but his primary use case for the M2C he bought was as a road car. He also sold it because BMW offered him the CS (he states that in his CS review vid). Just because he sold the his M2C doesn't take away from the fact that he felt it was a great street/road car.

[philth]

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

The video of Matt Farah you posted includes way more complaining about weight

*drives a bunch of mid-engine cars*
*gets in a trashed/cooked front-engine journalist car*

“The nose feels heavy”
“The brakes are big but don’t do anything”

[allinon72]

I remember watching that Matt Farah video early on…there was very clearly something wrong with the brakes on that car. They were probably cooked before the video from previous runs. Of course he probably knew that but carried on anyway because he is a bit of a blow hard and tries hard to be the holier-than-thou contrarian of the journo world.

And he says “big brakes are usually indicative of a lot of weight.” Ugh really? He’s certainly entitled to his opinion of the car but what a stupid statement

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

The video of Matt Farah you posted includes way more complaining about weight than it does suspension which wasn’t exactly something they “fixed” in the G87.

So, I disagree with your take. Mortal Kombat is the best video game of all time. Donkey Kong stinks.

Correct... he say that the suspension is unable to correctly handle this weight... his main complaint in that entire video is sloppy handling as a result of that. If you watch that video, he is all over the place... the car oversteers like crazy and he literally uses the word bouncy. This is a good video because the track he is on is very representative of the real world as there were some undulations there. And yes... the G87 fixes the suspension entirely which correctly matched to the weight of the car... every review mentions this.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

The video of Matt Farah you posted includes way more complaining about weight than it does suspension which wasn’t exactly something they “fixed” in the G87.

So, I disagree with your take. Mortal Kombat is the best video game of all time. Donkey Kong stinks.

Originally Posted by MSH_

And for the one shit review you will find loads of others raving about the M2C(Joe Achilles (bought one and still has it), Throttle House, The Straight Pipes, etc). As far as Chris Harris, yes his vid review was on track but his primary use case for the M2C he bought was as a road car. He also sold it because BMW offered him the CS (he states that in his CS review vid). Just because he sold the his M2C doesn't take away from the fact that he felt it was a great street/road car.

there are definitely some sort of reading comprehension issues or biases at work here... i literally mentioned exactly what you said... that there were very few reviews that were negative because most were done on perfect tracks.

Chris harris got an M2CS and sold that soon after as well... so clearly none of these cars were special enough to keep long term... oddly enough the opposite with his 1M.

Joe Achilees - stop with this jokeseter before you even get there... every BMW that is released to him is perfect, he is a shilll for the brand and gets everything for free. Ironically, he does point out the M2C suspension faults because he is one of the few people that does a true road test... he said his G80 is on another level in terms of how well the car is sorted... and even more interesting is the fact that his M2C which he drives the least of all of his cars is and has been since day 5 on aftermarket suspension.

[ASAP]

Originally Posted by allinon72

I remember watching that Matt Farah video early on…there was very clearly something wrong with the brakes on that car. They were probably cooked before the video from previous runs. Of course he probably knew that but carried on anyway because he is a bit of a blow hard and tries hard to be the holier-than-thou contrarian of the journo world.

And he says “big brakes are usually indicative of a lot of weight.” Ugh really? He’s certainly entitled to his opinion of the car but what a stupid statement

the brakes i 100% disagree with... i think that car was romped on hard and they must have been very worn down... i think the brakes together with the drivetrain are the best parts of the car... everything else however, i agree w 100% based on personal experience w the car

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by ASAP

there are definitely some sort of reading comprehension issues or biases at work here... i literally mentioned exactly what you said... that there were very few reviews that were negative because most were done on perfect tracks.

Chris harris got an M2CS and sold that soon after as well... so clearly none of these cars were special enough to keep long term... oddly enough the opposite with his 1M.

Joe Achilees - stop with this jokeseter before you even get there... every BMW that is released to him is perfect, he is a shilll for the brand and gets everything for free. Ironically, he does point out the M2C suspension faults because he is one of the few people that does a true road test... he said his G80 is on another level in terms of how well the car is sorted... and even more interesting is the fact that his M2C which he drives the least of all of his cars is and has been since day 5 on aftermarket suspension.

To be fair, CH has like 20 cars including his race cars and he makes a living based on long term reviews, so I understand him buying and selling constantly.
He even sold a 997 GT3 RS 4.0 shortly after he got it back in the day, which is now half a million GBP. I wouldn't say M2CS was not special enough for him, rather that it cost too much for him to keep and continue reviewing new cars.

[MSH_]

Originally Posted by ASAP

there are definitely some sort of reading comprehension issues or biases at work here... i literally mentioned exactly what you said... that there were very few reviews that were negative because most were done on perfect tracks.

Chris harris got an M2CS and sold that soon after as well... so clearly none of these cars were special enough to keep long term......

All those vid reviews I mentioned include road time in the review.
Also, maybe you missed the screen shot of the IG post from Chris Harris feed I put in my last post. He states...."It's everything I want in a road car" "Road car" Not "Track car"
I don't understand what him keeping the car long term has anything to do whether or not he feels it is an extremely capable road car? I think the mere fact that he shelled out the $ to buy both the Comp and the CS is proof enough that he thought they were both very good cars.

In his CS review below at the 3:57 mark he states that he probably wouldn't keep the CS as he wants other experiences in cars and that between the Comp and the CS he had chalked up 16-17k miles so maybe it was time to move on.

Look I don't doubt the G87 M2 is going to be the quicker car around the track vs the Comp and the more advanced suspension (stock vs stock) is going to provide a more refined experience on the road vs the M2C, but I do think your being a bit harsh in your assessment. Again, my M2C sees loads and loads of canyon carving on less than ideal Colorado roads that offer up everything from high speed sweepers, tight hairpins, decreasing and increasing radius turns which you can do for hours and not repeat the same stretch and I have no issues pushing it hard every step of the way.
Anyway, at the end of the day I think this is one of those agree to disagree scenarios and that's ok. Each to their own.