[W///]

Originally Posted by sgrinavi

Is there any reason to believe that BMW has any intention to make this any different than the so-called "Luxo Lines"?

I don't see why it wouldn't be a really great true M car. I had a chance to drive an M235i right after I test drove an M4 (an 8 speed automatic at that) and really enjoyed myself. Is it as lively and communicative as my E36 M3 with coilovers and freshly rebuilt suspension bits? No. Is the engine as intoxicating as my S65? No. But I just really liked the car (and so do plenty of journalists)

With that in mind, how is the M2 going to be worse than the M235i? I don't even care about more power over the regular N55 to be honest. But add those awesome brakes and suspension components (especially the rear end) from the M2 and it should be nothing short of epic.

Let's put it this way. I'm not a huge fan of the F30 to be honest, so they really had to make a lot of improvements on the M3/4. I'm a fan of the M235i, so the M2 will be even better. This is one of the few cars I think I'd be able to buy without ever test driving one although choosing the color for it might be a different story.

[SCOTT26]

Originally Posted by ewohar

I agree 100%. Strip it down and focus on raw performance.

You have to remember there is no justification to sell such a BMW as North American customers choosing whether an M3 , M4 or even the M2 will not forgo luxuries in such a car. THEY want Performance with the luxury features.

[Cavpilot2k]

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

You have to remember there is no justification to sell such a BMW as North American customers choosing whether an M3 , M4 or even the M2 will not forgo luxuries in such a car. THEY want Performance with the luxury features.

Of course you are right, but for my two cents, the best M car ever made, past or present, was the 1M, and it was relatively bare-bones and focused on just performance and driving enjoyment.

I don't mind luxury items, but M cars are supposed to be about taking a "regular" BMW model and making a performance edition. With that in mind, there should not be a mindset of adding more luxury stuff to the performance edition, because those items inevitably reduce performance, which defeats the point.

I just hope the luxury items are options. For instance I hate in-car nav because those interfaces are always outdated in 3 years - they never age well.

[Pete_vB]

Originally Posted by Cavpilot2k

No, it shouldn't, especially on the "luxo version" front. The M2 should be no more luxurious than the M235, and in fact should be less so. M cars should absolutely NOT be about luxury. All luxury does is weigh down a car with unnecessary crap and drive the price up unnecessarily.

There is an unfortunate flaw in this logic- it assumes the car's price is based on what it costs to make. Instead it's based largely on its position and performance relative to other cars, BMWs and otherwise. "Value based pricing", it's called. And since BMW M drivers value performance, the M2 can't outperform the M4 unless it costs more... Adding that 'crap' does weigh the car down, but perversely by slowing the car down it drives the price down, so they are paying you to take those options. This low cost/ high performance model you want can't exist in the current BMW lineup as long as BMW customers value cars based on performance. Value based pricing 101, and a catch 22...

Originally Posted by SCOTT26

You have to remember there is no justification to sell such a BMW as North American customers choosing whether an M3 , M4 or even the M2 will not forgo luxuries in such a car. THEY want Performance with the luxury features.

I do not believe that Scott. As a 1M owner who got stuck with a dealer ordered car loaded with every available option, I personally would have much preferred a stripper. If you ask dealers they'll tell you there is no market for strippers, just as they told you there was no market for manual transmissions. But dealers sell autos more easily, and they make more more money on loaded cars. A sizable percentage of customers disagree with them, at least for a fun sports car like the M2. And we're the serious, loyal customers you want, not the ones that are going to go over to Audi when the next S4 comes out. Come over and ask opinions on the 1M board if you don't believe this.

Make sure we can option an M2 without too much crap, or you will lose many of us.

[sgrinavi]

Originally Posted by W///

....

With that in mind, how is the M2 going to be worse than the M235i? I don't even care about more power over the regular N55 to be honest. But add those awesome brakes and suspension components (especially the rear end) from the M2 and it should be nothing short of epic.

Let's put it this way. I'm not a huge fan of the F30 to be honest, so they really had to make a lot of improvements on the M3/4. I'm a fan of the M235i, so the M2 will be even better.....

That sounds like you're managing expectations - sure it will be better than an M235i; there's no doubt in my mind that it will be a fun car, probably the most fun of the M bunch, but I don't have any reason to believe that BMW is going to get away from their current M formula.

I don't think that's horrible, but I don't think it's going to be as cool as the 1M either.

[W///]

Originally Posted by sgrinavi

That sounds like you're managing expectations - sure it will be better than an M235i; there's no doubt in my mind that it will be a fun car, probably the most fun of the M bunch, but I don't have any reason to believe that BMW is going to get away from their current M formula.

I don't think that's horrible, but I don't think it's going to be as cool as the 1M either.

I still don't see how this is NOT going to be as cool as a 1M to be honest. Of course, some will debate N54 vs N55 (although we don't know what part will be modified yet).

So it'll come down to
- Hydraulic vs Electric PS, which has been debated to death. I thought the M235i was decent (certainly way better than F30), and M3/4 was pretty good. Not as good as plain old hydraulic system in the 1M and E92, but I can live with the new ones
- Brakes. M2 (aka M3/4( brakes >>> 1M (E9x M3 brakes)
- Chassis/Stiffness. If it's anything like M3/4, then again, it'll be better than 1M yet again

I don't see how this will not be the second coming of the 1M.

[UpNcOmINg!]

A lot of the 1M's were pre-specced and VERY few came with few options, that being said I don't think it detracts from the car at all.
With THAT being said, I HIGHLY doubt that this will be the case when the ///M2 is launched seeing as this is a specifically developed car, whereas we all know the nature of 'pyrat 1' being a Frankenstein.
If the ///M2 is even getting its own seats, I am pretty sure you can spec it however you damn well please.

Also, PS, BMW is a business, they aren't overly perturbed with who is buying as long as they selling. Different markets cater for different things, some places will get things as optional, others as standard, just the way it goes. Majority rules and the majority aren't on this forum and with that, nor does the majority of the money or BMW's customers. We are just the crazed fans.

[Wilson]

Originally Posted by UpNcOmINg!

A lot of the 1M's were pre-specced and VERY few came with few options, that being said I don't think it detracts from the car at all.
With THAT being said, I HIGHLY doubt that this will be the case when the ///M2 is launched seeing as this is a specifically developed car, whereas we all know the nature of 'pyrat 1' being a Frankenstein.
If the ///M2 is even getting its own seats, I am pretty sure you can spec it however you damn well please.

Also, PS, BMW is a business, they aren't overly perturbed with who is buying as long as they selling. Different markets cater for different things, some places will get things as optional, others as standard, just the way it goes. Majority rules and the majority aren't on this forum and with that, nor does the majority of the money or BMW's customers. We are just the crazed fans.

You are 100% correct, majority of buyers want an optioned up car and most of the cars that will be sitting in dealer showrooms (not for long though) will be spec'd up.

If you want a bare bones you will need to order it and wait the 6 months for it to be built and delivered.

There will of course be some things that will not be able to be deleted, such as AC, power windows, leather (I expect the M2 newly designed performance seats will be leather similar to the M3/4) etc, but they will only make it easier to move on to the second hand market as you will be broadening your base of potential buyers.

[Jason]

Updated renderings as of 11/25/14:

Based on input from Scott26, we've given our BMW M2 some even more accurate touches - including more angular front styling and hips (fenders).

[Colinv6]

Perfect... Just needs the M3/4 wheels now, I almost think CSL/GTS wheels look dated on the newest models.

[W///]

If that's how it's going to be, then it'll almost automatically need an M Performance lip of some kind.

Nice touch on wider rear flares, makes a nice improvement.

[Adem1534]

Originally Posted by W///

If that's how it's going to be, then it'll almost automatically need an M Performance lip of some kind.

Nice touch on wider rear flares, makes a nice improvement.

They look great. I hope they put it on the front page to generate more discussion

[vantagesc]

Looks way better now!

Originally Posted by W///

If that's how it's going to be, then it'll almost automatically need an M Performance lip of some kind.

I actually don't like the lips at all since I doubt they do much aerodynamically (ride height is too high for it to work properly and it's too small anyway).

[sgrinavi]

Originally Posted by Jason

Updated renderings as of 11/25/14:

Based on input from Scott26, we've given our BMW M2 some even more accurate touches - including more angular front styling and hips (fenders).

Awesome, THANKS! Sides look amazing, I'm not a huge fan of the front, but at the end of the day I'm not that picky and it wouldn't stop me from getting one.

[modkrazy]

That bumper has way too much random crap going on with it, like it's trying way too hard (even harder than the bigger brother). I liked the simpler original version.

I do dig that fat ass though.

[Rupes]

Are we confident at this point that it will have a CF roof?

[Vervain]

Originally Posted by modkrazy

That bumper has way too much random crap going on with it, like it's trying way too hard (even harder than the bigger brother). I liked the simpler original version.

I do dig that fat ass though.

+1

[AtlantaDude]

Yep. I want it. Take my money

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Jason

Updated renderings as of 11/25/14:
Based on input from Scott26, we've given our BMW M2 some even more accurate touches - including more angular front styling and hips (fenders).

Sure about the six double slats per kidney (alike the latest M3/M4) ?

The latest prototype (still) features 8 singular slats per kidney (alike the M235i / M235i Racing).

Of course, that body part might be "updated" in forthcoming prototypes (along with the current prototype side mirrors and wheels).

[ORIGIN M.]

Looks better with those hips w/out question.

Can who ever did those photos black out the antenna and the side strips to the CF Roof.

TIA!!!

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Sure about the six double slats per kidney (alike the latest M3/M4) ?

The latest prototype (still) features 8 singular slats...

I sure hope it has the double slats.

It seems to be the new design language, so I see no reason why not.

[S65V8]

Agreed, but the only reason I say 3400lb. as a magic number is because any heavier I'd rather go for the M4 / M3 at 3500+ pounds. For me the M2 is more interesting if it's lighter and only a smidge less powerful than the M4/3. Or else what's the point? (At least for me). Some savings sure, but in reality that's not what's driving me to get the M2.

Originally Posted by twin fed

In general weight within 150-200lbs is not really a major concern of mine. Some people are so hung up on "oh if it's 3400lbs i'm not buying it" I would say that 95% of people could not tell the difference between 3400lbs and 3500lbs anyway.

Originally Posted by W///

Yet you and I are driving 3700 lbs E92 M3's. So how much do we really care about weight really?

I've got both ends of the spectrum, an E36 and an E92. They obviously drive completely different, and while I'd love to see the M2 being 3400 lbs, I'm not making it my absolute requirement.