[DfVgyCjmFQnu]

Originally Posted by Luminous

It might be theoretically possible but highly unlikely considering how many N55 tunes they've sold without any reported issues. I myself have had the tune for over 30k miles, the car is now putting down about 550whp and runs great. To be fair I change oil every 5k at the latest, I use high quality engine oil, high octane fuel and am constantly monitoring afr, timing, IATs, oil temps and boost.

Concerning the sticker or seal, I requested they not put a sticker for this exact reason and it wasn't a problem.

I was not aware Enzo put a sticker on the ECU, I don't see any good reason to do so.

[DfVgyCjmFQnu]

BTW, BMW does not need to look at the ECU case to find tampering. They don't need to find some tamper proof sticker or seal or physical access history to the ECU. They simply plug into the OBD2 port and they will get a message that says "DME protection against tampering: program or data manipulation detected."

[mdputnam]

Big surprise people, the ECU performs a checksum during boot-up as do most critical systems utilizing a microprocessor. Check out this explanation for what a checksum error is. If things don't add up (literally) it registers an error code.

Oh, and if you want to be totally paranoid, in our systems we keep a running tab of the checksums. So, even setting the code back to the original and clearing the error will not eliminate the evidence.

[BentZero]

Originally Posted by mdputnam

Big surprise people, the ECU performs a checksum during boot-up as do most critical systems utilizing a microprocessor. Check out this explanation for what a checksum error is. If things don't add up (literally) it registers an error code.

Oh, and if you want to be totally paranoid, in our systems we keep a running tab of the checksums. So, even setting the code back to the original and clearing the error will not eliminate the evidence.

Can you get around this by flashing back to stock? I'm assuming that the check sum value doesn't change when you have a piggyback? I'm assuming that all of the values are in the ecu bios somewhere.

[mdputnam]

I have no idea how BMWs work.
Systems I am familiar with have a rolling list of lets say the last 100 checksums, when the system boots it preforms another checksum and adds it to the list, then the system checks the whole list. If there is a single discrepancy on the list the system will register an error code.

[Drpoomanchu]

Im sorry to hear about your issue.. you would def think this to be material defect. But... the moral of the story is, flash your ECU/DME to stock before taking to BMW for any kind of issue where they may scan your system. This would have been a better discussion had it been reflashed to stock. Its irrelevant in a sense due to the fact that the proper route was not taken to hide the flash. We dont truly know what would have been found by the tech had it been set to stock parameters. All of this is speculation and assumptions. I would like to see what Enzo has to say in regards to this.

[DfVgyCjmFQnu]

Originally Posted by Drpoomanchu

Im sorry to hear about your issue.. you would def think this to be material defect. But... the moral of the story is, flash your ECU/DME to stock before taking to BMW for any kind of issue where they may scan your system. This would have been a better discussion had it been reflashed to stock. Its irrelevant in a sense due to the fact that the proper route was not taken to hide the flash. We dont truly know what would have been found by the tech had it been set to stock parameters. All of this is speculation and assumptions. I would like to see what Enzo has to say in regards to this.

To be clear, I am not implying the fault is with the ECU tuning house. Simply, there is a crack in my engine block and BMW is not covering the repair under warranty since they found a DME checksum error.

[rich8566]

Originally Posted by qafwfk7pNkou

To be clear, I am not implying the fault is with the ECU tuning house. Simply, there is a crack in my engine block and BMW is not covering the repair under warranty since they found a DME checksum error.

Have you written to BMWNA. I've had success in the past in getting repairs done that were way out of warranty. It's worth writing a polite letter to BMWNA requesting help with this issue.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by BentZero

Can you get around this by flashing back to stock? I'm assuming that the check sum value doesn't change when you have a piggyback? I'm assuming that all of the values are in the ecu bios somewhere.

The flash back to stock would also have to overwrite the checksum values and/or the flash counter. I understand it's not easy to do, but possible.

I've yet to hear anything official from any of the tuners regarding this. Only customers speaking on their behalf.


Piggy back (jb4) should not effect checksum or the flash counter.

[BentZero]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

The flash back to stock would also have to overwrite the checksum values and/or the flash counter. I understand it's not easy to do, but possible.

I've yet to hear anything official from any of the tuners regarding this. Only customers speaking on their behalf.


Piggy back (jb4) should not effect checksum or the flash counter.

Interesting. I had settled on an eventual ecu tune, but with my luck something will probably go wrong. Perhaps a piggyback until I'm out of warranty is the more prudent path.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by BentZero

Interesting. I had settled on an eventual ecu tune, but with my luck something will probably go wrong. Perhaps a piggyback until I'm out of warranty is the more prudent path.

We're in the same boat.

No tuner has officially answered these questions about flash counters logs and checksum logs.

All they will say, "You can flash back to stock", without any further details.

[Richy_Boy]

I would have thought, if you're paying for this repair, a good low mileage engine from a breakers yard would be the best solution?

There must be loads of M235is crashed with less than 20k miles on the clock?

Though, you mention it's a lease, so I guess an engine number change would cause you another problem..!

Richard

[Polo08816]

Originally Posted by pz619

Well, color me interested... What happened.

$15.6k for the engine replacement (getbmwparts.com). That doesn't include labor. Msrp is over 19k.

~$6000 price difference between a brand new M240i and M2.

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by qafwfk7pNkou

Yes there may have been a flash tune on the car when I brought it into the dealer. Yes I understand if somebody has a flash tune it should be refreshed back to stock prior to doing so. The cost and time involved with flashing back to stock is significant, and of course I did not expect an entire engine replacement would be needed. It was a wrong decision on my end. Still, I do not believe this issue is due to the tune, but rather a manufacturing defect given the engine has 15,000 miles on it and has not been raced. An engine block crack between cylinder heads seems to be more likely to a manufacturing defect rather than results of a reasonable tune.

Who flash tuned your Ecu? Not saying that's the issue but you mention time and money to go back to stock, in actuality any tuner would flash back to stock for you if a warranty ISSIE needs addressing.

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I don't think OEM uses a tamper proof sticker.

If I took mine to a tuner I would not want them putting one on either.

Yes, from what I've read about Audi they are the worst. Anytime your car is at the dealer for service the first thing they do is hook it up to some sort of scan tool to check for ECU tampering. It's flagged automatically by the Audi system with no manual input from the tech. Even if you go in for basic scheduled service they do this.

Yes it's does. Your oem dme has a water proof rubber seal that literally needs to be cut through to open the top portion of the Bosch dme to access the board in order to tune.

So anyone thinking a dealer won't know is sorely mistaken. All you have to do is unscrew the t15 screws and the covers falls right open.

Tuners promoting the "undetectable" by dealer need to truthfully inform the community and clients. Yes it's undetectable to the eye as the dme is under the manifold, yes it's undetectable through OBD. But all they have to do is take off your manifold and be able to tell. Especially when boneheads slap a sticker on the inside cover calling it tamper proof

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by ocN55

After opening the ECU, the smarter thing to do would be to not use a label or anything else to close it shut. That leaves a very very clear indication that it was opened and someone tried to fix it. Whereas if you leave it open, you have grounds to say that other party were the first to open it, not you.

Once you open it it's done it's sold...nothing you can do to revert it. The oem seal is cut as I mentioned in the previous comment. Slapping tuner stickers just makes the suspicious very obvious.

Flash tuning is great and I support it but there are a lot of risks. Prepare to suffer the consequences.

Not to make the OP feel like shit and I hope he gets it resolved and covered but WTF were you thinking flashing a god damn lease car?

Slap on a jb4 like the rest...

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by qafwfk7pNkou

BTW, BMW does not need to look at the ECU case to find tampering. They don't need to find some tamper proof sticker or seal or physical access history to the ECU. They simply plug into the OBD2 port and they will get a message that says "DME protection against tampering: program or data manipulation detected."

Not if its a good tuner and they know what the hell they're doing.

We know for a fact that it's not detectable simply by OBD.

But you are partially correct there are cases of certain tuners that have triggered the dme tamper code. RIP to those folks warranties...

[Anthony235]

I've been asking PTF about their BM3 flash that's in beta. They seem to give very straight forward answers to the "is it detectable" question. Unlike some other tuners.

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Assuming warranty is your concern you should believe that your dealer or BMW service department can always find a trace of modifications to the car including a flash tune or a piggyback and its entirely up to them what they'll do, just like when you walk in for service with dowpipes or an intake bootmod3 just as other mods can void your powertrain warranty.

bootmod3 provides for the ability to flash back to stock performance (stock calibration originally read from the car at the time of unlock).

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

As for the flash, you can indeed go back fully to stock/original programming but you'd need to get the DME on the bench. That'd set it back fully 100% back to how it was before software was changed. That isn't to say other modules in the car didn't register something funny to set a flag somewhere or that they wouldn't be able to tell the DME case was opened for flashing Its a risk just like any mod and we'll never beat around the bush on that, end of story.

Originally Posted by tom @ eas

Professional tool such as autologic would flash back to stock without DME removal, we have done this to verify on other flashes.

However, the DME would need to be pulled in order to unlock again.

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Autologic, you mean the crappy version of ISTA?

Many tools can flash the DME back to factory programming including bootmod3 but like all others the devil's in the details

Once again, you can't fully 100% reset the DME back to factory, to exactly how it was originally, without getting the DME on the bench and using the original readout file. Trust us. We've built this bootmod3 flashing from the ground up and tools including Autologic are all at our disposal.

Lastly, bootmod3 will do the exact same level of 'revert to factory with lock back on' as Autologic, ISTA or any other tool out there along with 'revert to stock without reverting unlock'.

Advice, use ISTA

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by dd1981

Once you open it it's done it's sold...nothing you can do to revert it. The oem seal is cut as I mentioned in the previous comment. Slapping tuner stickers just makes the suspicious very obvious.

Flash tuning is great and I support it but there are a lot of risks. Prepare to suffer the consequences.

Not to make the OP feel like shit and I hope he gets it resolved and covered but WTF were you thinking flashing a god damn lease car?

Slap on a jb4 like the rest...

I asked PTF about the seal and if it can be reapplied.

Originally Posted by proTUNING Freaks

Yes of course, always. DME must be sealed off to protect from the elements. Unfortunately some shops, quite a 'big' name in this business, didn't do that for this local beta customer that is converting to bootmod3 with his 435i:

https://www.instagram.com/p/BJD9gi-j...rotuningfreaks

They just cut the silicone seal, lifted the lid and after flashing put it back on it takes literally no time to reapply unless they 'ran out' of silicone LOL unbelievable..

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I asked PTF about the seal and if it can be reapplied.

You mean Enzo lol no they don't seal shit. They seal the shipping box for you tho with some tape

[Jadar]

Originally Posted by Anthony235

I asked PTF about the seal and if it can be reapplied.

Let us know what they say about the seal. I'm sure you can get some sort of new gasket seal its just a matter of making it look original.

[Anthony235]

Originally Posted by dd1981

Let us know what they say about the seal. I'm sure you can get some sort of new gasket seal its just a matter of making it look original.

They said you can replace the seal in my previous post and it's very easy to do. Pretty sure it's a silicon seal. I've seen the OEM silicone for sale on some websites, but I can't seem to find it now.