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      11-20-2014, 12:45 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by fcman
Not surprised, the 2 series is everything the 3 series used to be. The M2 will likely be the best car in BMWs lineup
+ 1

and then bmw decides to go fwd in the 4 door version and next gen. This car will be one of the last great proper drivers car by bmw in a long time
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      11-20-2014, 12:46 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by 335BOY View Post
wake up call? WTF? Its bigger, softer and there is a ton of competition. The marketplace has changed. Hardly any demand for MT and huge demand for softer suspension and AWD. Wake up call?? I don't get that.
It is a wake up call for a 3-series product/project manager.
3 series cars are almost "bread-and-butter" for BMW and they just lost the top spot, I would be surprised.
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      11-20-2014, 12:51 PM   #25
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The 3 series is not what it used to be. I used to love the 3 because it stood for everything I wanted in a car. Nowadays it's no different from other cars in its class and even below on some levels. I really hope for future cars, BMW makes cars that are true to their formulas of the past instead of making sales number driven cars that are soft and have no soul.
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      11-20-2014, 01:23 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by E9TOU
The 3 series is not what it used to be. I used to love the 3 because it stood for everything I wanted in a car. Nowadays it's no different from other cars in its class and even below on some levels. I really hope for future cars, BMW makes cars that are true to their formulas of the past instead of making sales number driven cars that are soft and have no soul.
+lots
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      11-20-2014, 01:23 PM   #27
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Not surprising, better value and more fun to drive than the 3. 3 is still obviously a good car, and nobody in C&D will argue (much) that it's a better "drivers car" than when ranked at the top of their admittedly very strong list and the M235 is.

What I really take from this list is that BMW needs to take a look at the CTS because its on the list and the f30 isn't.
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      11-20-2014, 01:26 PM   #28
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Let's explore the possibilities here:

How many people are going to be put off buying a 3/4 series by this? If they are put off what are they going to buy? A C Class, Audi A4/S4, Lexus IS, ATS? None of these is on the list.

Another option is to say oh wait there is an M235i on the list so let me get that. I surmise that granted some will do that but this will be the exception. The M235i appeals to a smaller target audience than the 3/4er.

I can understand that this may be a disappointment to some but I have to agree with what someone said earlier. The 3/4 series is bigger than this list. Nothing is going to change other than maybe tweaking the narrative of the adverts that sing about this list.
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      11-20-2014, 01:29 PM   #29
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Nah, I think it's more C&D making a 'complaint' than representing what the buyers think. Just look at the sales figures, people are especially in love with these turbos.
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      11-20-2014, 01:29 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Schm
Not surprising, better value and more fun to drive than the 3. 3 is still obviously a good car, and nobody in C&D will argue (much) that it's a better "drivers car" than when ranked at the top of their admittedly very strong list and the M235 is.

What I really take from this list is that BMW needs to take a look at the CTS because its on the list and the f30 isn't.
CTS competes with the 5 series. So the CTS being on this list is more of a problem for the F10 not the F3x. The last time I checked on the E class sells more than the 5er
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      11-20-2014, 01:33 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///mawana
Nah, I think it's more C&D making a 'complaint' than representing what the buyers think. Just look at the sales figures, people are especially in love with these turbos.
Hate to thread jack but this is what I have been saying too. This list is not gong to turn the M235i into a car with as wide an audience as a 3/4er. It's a niche car. It's a win for BMW and the audience that seeks this type of car. A Porsche Cayman at a lower price if you will.
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      11-20-2014, 01:43 PM   #32
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So lame... shame on you BMW

Sooner or later the horrible reviews of almost every modern BMW will trickle down to the masses and BMW will be in a serious mess
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      11-20-2014, 01:46 PM   #33
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Well what do you guys think this leaves for the m3/4 vs the m2. Obviously bmw is not going to cap the numbers (like what less than 400hp I read). But as far as fun, car to drive, performance which do you think will be better?
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      11-20-2014, 01:48 PM   #34
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There's also the realization that this may very well be the first time the M3/4 didn't make the list either, as the M3 was traditionally almost automatically added to the list alongside the 3-series. So this verdict, if you will, is going to have a more lasting effect than only short-term.

We all like to think that magazine reviews don't matter & they don't for the most part in affecting an individual's purchase of a new vehicle. The effect they do have, though, is how we look at cars in retrospect, how we remember them, and their legacy.
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      11-20-2014, 01:50 PM   #35
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I love my M235i Just did a chicago to Sth Fla trip and it was a blast. Coming from a E92 M3, It has not disappointed me in the least.
Cannot wait for the M2 thou
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      11-20-2014, 01:52 PM   #36
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Size does matter. In this case The 2 is the right size. If they made an M2 Sedan; that would be the perfect car for me.
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      11-20-2014, 02:01 PM   #37
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Nice, thanks for sharing!
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      11-20-2014, 02:10 PM   #38
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it's nice that 4 of the cars on the list are american.
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      11-20-2014, 02:24 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MRV99 View Post
When the 3 series grew to the size of the e39(5 series)what do you expect. The 2 series is what 3 series used to be.
I can't wait for 1/2 (half) and 1/4 (quarter) series BMWs come out in the next decade or two. Sigh.. I don't understand why the sizes of cars have to go bigger each redesign. Honda Accord is now the size of an aircraft carrier when it started out smaller than current civics.
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      11-20-2014, 02:35 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davis449 View Post
It won't concern them one bit. The M235i is on there to replace it and I can promise you they're just fine with that.
+1 as no sleep is lost here with the M235i well received. None. None of my contacts in Munich are saying a depression has taken place around Dingolfing.
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      11-20-2014, 02:36 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmaung
Quote:
Originally Posted by MRV99 View Post
When the 3 series grew to the size of the e39(5 series)what do you expect. The 2 series is what 3 series used to be.
I can't wait for 1/2 (half) and 1/4 (quarter) series BMWs come out in the next decade or two. Sigh.. I don't understand why the sizes of cars have to go bigger each redesign. Honda Accord is now the size of an aircraft carrier when it started out smaller than current civics.
I am waiting for the 0 series.

the BMW 010i X Drive M-Sport will have 0.8L 2 banger turbo.
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      11-20-2014, 02:49 PM   #42
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C&D has a total circulation of 1,200,000. This won't hurt anything. My Mother drives a BMW and has never heard of C&D.
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      11-20-2014, 02:52 PM   #43
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Currently driving a f30 335i msport and I don't find this one bit surprising. Don't think it'll affect sales much though.
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      11-20-2014, 03:01 PM   #44
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