[hangover]

Originally Posted by Total madness

I sinceraly hope the M2 is that awesome, but i remember a certain dude called Randy Posbt who said about the M235i : it is the best bmw in the past 10 years.

And Randy POBST is right.

The 2016 Ford Focus RS hasn't even gone on sale yet, but the hot hatch has already received a power bump. Now, the U.S.-spec 2016 Focus RS will make 350 hp and 350 lb-ft of torque. Expect these numbers to stick this time.

A six-speed manual will be the only transmission offered with the Focus RS, and Ford says the hatch will feature a stall recovery system. In the event of a stall, the driver simply pushes in the clutch pedal to restart the engine with no need to rely on the ignition.

Ford is expected to begin production of the 2016 Focus RS by the end of the year and pricing will start at $36,605.

[Total madness]

Originally Posted by hangover

And Randy POBST is right.

The 2016 Ford Focus RS hasn't even gone on sale yet, but the hot hatch has already received a power bump. Now, the U.S.-spec 2016 Focus RS will make 350 hp and 350 lb-ft of torque. Expect these numbers to stick this time.

A six-speed manual will be the only transmission offered with the Focus RS, and Ford says the hatch will feature a stall recovery system. In the event of a stall, the driver simply pushes in the clutch pedal to restart the engine with no need to rely on the ignition.

Ford is expected to begin production of the 2016 Focus RS by the end of the year and pricing will start at $36,605.

at that price point IMO, it is a better sport oriented vehicule than a 228i per se, only matter is that in canada, m235i=focus RS price...
for that, hard case to argue the all around value of the RS against the M235i...

but hey ! every tools as its utility :-)

[BMW335iOn18s]

I don't know how you guys are comparing this car to a focus RS. Numbers on paper don't translate to steering feel, a good manual transmission, or any understanding of driving characteristics....

[hangover]

Originally Posted by BMW335iOn18s

I don't know how you guys are comparing this car to a focus RS. Numbers on paper don't translate to steering feel, a good manual transmission, or any understanding of driving characteristics....

I agree. The Focus RS has superior steering feel (just ask Randy) and a world class 6 speed manual transmission.

BMW can keep their slushboxes.

[tbonez3858]

Your odds of getting an M2 in 2016 are low
Your odds of getting an RS are lower..
Your odds of getting a GT350 even lower...


Or you could get a Camaro SS in general availability and have a fully loaded car that puts up similar performance stats to the GT350 for less than the M2..


I still want the 240/m2 but there are some strong competitors out there if German luxury isn't a requirement...

[BMW335iOn18s]

Originally Posted by hangover

I agree. The Focus RS has superior steering feel (just ask Randy) and a world class 6 speed manual transmission.

BMW can keep their slushboxes.

Link to Randy's commentary?

[bimmerfile]

If you do a quick analysis of BMW's pricing strategy/algorithm in the U.S. and Canada it would suggest that the M2 will come in at approx 54K USD Stateside and approx $61K Cdn in Canada.

[tbonez3858]

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

If you do a quick analysis of BMW's pricing strategy/algorithm in the U.S. and Canada it would suggest that the M2 will come in at approx 54K USD Stateside and approx $61K Cdn in Canada.

I hope not that puts the dct right under 60k...That will end my M2 run.

[abp689]

5 pages and this debate is not yet settled?

Originally Posted by bimmerfile

If you do a quick analysis of BMW's pricing strategy/algorithm in the U.S. and Canada it would suggest that the M2 will come in at approx 54K USD Stateside and approx $61K Cdn in Canada.

Thought I saw $51K USD thrown around?

[MrBimmerM235i]

Originally Posted by tbonez3858

Your odds of getting an M2 in 2016 are low
Your odds of getting an RS are lower..
Your odds of getting a GT350 even lower...


Or you could get a Camaro SS in general availability and have a fully loaded car that puts up similar performance stats to the GT350 for less than the M2..


I still want the 240/m2 but there are some strong competitors out there if German luxury isn't a requirement...

[Face]

Originally Posted by tbonez3858

I hope not that puts the dct right under 60k...That will end my M2 run.

No kidding.

I was interested in the M235i, then went to M-school (highly recommend!) a few weeks ago..decided I wanted a true M-car (For all of the driving on the track I don't do). If the M2 is within $5K of the M3 when optioned the same, I don't know who wouldn't make the leap up to the M3. The M3 comes standard with the Navigation, Heated Seats, Harmon Kardon which are options in the 2 series.

There may also be some opportunities to get a good price on a M235i if the M2 cannibalizes sales.

I think BMW will price it at $51-52k, only standard upgrade from the M235i is the leather (other than the obvious M equipment). Any higher and the M3 becomes a much better value proposition.

[Merc for hire]

Originally Posted by Face

No kidding.

I was interested in the M235i, then went to M-school (highly recommend!) a few weeks ago..decided I wanted a true M-car (For all of the driving on the track I don't do). If the M2 is within $5K of the M3 when optioned the same, I don't know who wouldn't make the leap up to the M3. The M3 comes standard with the Navigation, Heated Seats, Harmon Kardon which are options in the 2 series.

There may also be some opportunities to get a good price on a M235i if the M2 cannibalizes sales.

I think BMW will price it at $51-52k, only standard upgrade from the M235i is the leather (other than the obvious M equipment). Any higher and the M3 becomes a much better value proposition.

M2 is called M2 because it's based on the 2 series. Smaller than 3 series. Some people like myself don't like the 3 series.
M2 is not a lesser M3. They are not comparable.

[Face]

Originally Posted by Merc for hire

M2 is called M2 because it's based on the 2 series. Smaller than 3 series. Some people like myself don't like the 3 series.
M2 is not a lesser M3. They are not comparable.

We share a common interest in the smaller cars - I don't like the 3-series outside of the M3 due to size concerns. I drive a E82 that I love (M-sport, MT) and I dislike driving my wife's E92 (sport package, auto) as it is too large and doesn't feel as nimble. I definitely dislike the fact that the 3-series has grown even larger and I am excited by the size and performance of the 2-series.

Having had the opportunity to drive the M3 (and M4 and M5) on a track, I definitely did not notice the larger size or weight. It is nothing at all like our E92 or the F30's I have had the opportunity to drive.

People on this site are comparing the M2 to a hot-hatch economy car (Ford Focus), American muscle (Mustang, Camaro), Japanese tuner (Civic Type R), and small AWD German sedans (CLA AMG).

However, for a BMW enthusiast like myself who wouldn't consider other manufacturers, I will be comparing the M2 to the M235i and the M3. If the price with the options I listed is north of $60k, I would choose the better performing M3 any day of the week. And this is coming from a guy, like you, who appreciates a smaller vehicle.

[G8rGrl]

Originally Posted by Face

I will be comparing the M2 to the M235i and the M3. If the price with the options I listed is north of $60k, I would choose the better performing M3 any day of the week. And this is coming from a guy, like you, who appreciates a smaller vehicle.

This.

[Transfer]

Wow I haven't seen this many loser posts here in years.

Please stop saying X is better than Y when you have neither seen nor driven either X OR Y. And unless you have owned an M235i and an equivalent performing M car (E46, E92), then you can't really comment on how the 235 will be compared to the M2 even in speculation.

[Pyewacket69]

I find the "my choice of best vehicle is soooo much better than everyone else's choice of vehicle" downright funny. It's nothing more than a measuring contest, with the goal of having the longest... Well, you know...

There's plenty of room for many competitors and numerous models, and they're all excellent vehicles in their own right.

Buy what interest you, the individual. Satisfy yourself with what you like (if you can afford to do so...).

If someone needs confirmation from folks they don't even know (and will probably never meet in person) that their choice of vehicle is the supremely correct choice, they're going to find out that NO. vehicle will be satisfactory for very long.

I have a M235i, and I love it... But, I could just as easily be as happy with numerous other makes and models...

[trey100]

The RS will be a good performer imo but with this interior it is not chasing the 2 series.

[Face]

Originally Posted by Transfer

Wow I haven't seen this many loser posts here in years.

Please stop saying X is better than Y when you have neither seen nor driven either X OR Y. And unless you have owned an M235i and an equivalent performing M car (E46, E92), then you can't really comment on how the 235 will be compared to the M2 even in speculation.

I've been here since 2008 and been a BMW enthusiast for a long time, my apologies for voicing an opinion to which you find disagreement

I was merely saying that if the pricing was close to the M3, I'd likely by the M3. As stated in my post, I don't own a M235i (but I like them and have test driven) and after driving some M-cars I have an interest in the M2/M3.

One downside of the M2 is that given the waiting lists (per these posts) at many dealers I likely wouldn't get the opportunity to test drive them and compare them to a M235i and M3. I can only speculate that it'll be somewhere between the M235i and M3 in the performance spectrum. If the price is in between an M235i and a M3, I'll definitely be interested in the vehicle. I don't want to pay M3 money (due to high MRSP, reduced content, or "market demand premium) for an M2 that i will likely not be able to see or drive before ordering.

That's my only point. If you are spending that kind of money - why not just get the M3 that is a known commodity and that doesn't require jumping through hoops at the dealership. Or get the M235i, with I really enjoyed on the test drive and there may be some deals to be had with everyone salivating over the M2.

It sounds like according to you only people who have owned M235's and M3's can comment on these boards. People like you are the reason I don't come to this site this very often. Enjoy your M235i.

[Face]

Originally Posted by trey100

The RS will be a good performer imo but with this interior it is not chasing the 2 series.

I've driven my fair share of rental Ford Focus vehicles. I prefer those and the Ford Escapes when renting a car. I know the RS will drive nothing like the rentals I am used to, but the interior of the Focus leaves a lot to be desired. I'm always happy to get back into my BMW when returning from trips.

I do not understand the Focus RS vs. M2 comparison.

[MikeT]

Some interesting comments by M division head Frank van Meel regarding the m2 & m235i in "Car" magazine...
http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-new...november-2015/

‘The M235i is a success story. We sold 9000 units last year, which accounts for 30% of the overall volume. So we were not in a hurry to do any M2,’ says van Meel. ‘Especially if you look at comparison tests of M235i against its competition, there really wouldn’t be a need. But we said, okay, we want to do one. So the differentiation to M235i, which is already a winner, must be really big. So more or less we’ve made a supercar out of the 2-series by putting the M3 chassis under the 2-series car.’

etc.