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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum BMW 2 Series (F22) Forum BMW 2 Series Coupe and Cabriolet (F22/F23) General Forum BMW 2 Series Gran Coupe and 2 Series Gran Sport Tourer : Dr Jekyll & Herr Hyde

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      10-03-2012, 11:50 AM   #45
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Can't wait to see these models released
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      10-03-2012, 11:56 AM   #46
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SCOTT, Since you seem to be reading this post, here's a wish from one customer:
- Make a car just like the second picture (GST).
- Summon the M-Fairy
- Have her (or him, as he is probably a Herr Doktor Ingenieur) wave the tune wand at the N54 (up to say 365hp-ish)
- Have her stick on a CFRP roof with "Zagato-style" bumps just like the M6
- Offer a 6MT and a decent dual clutch as an option
- Offer Bucket seats as an option
- Summon my local BMW-dealer
- Have him (I know its a he) show me the dotted line.

And we all lived happily ever after ...

Last edited by M ETT; 10-03-2012 at 12:02 PM.
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      10-03-2012, 11:57 AM   #47
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I miss the days when korean auto manufacturers copied German manufacturers.. Greed always back fires, just sayin'
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Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
BMW have tapped into this by mirroring typical BMW dynamics and steering communication within the new UKL cars.
You mean massive body roll, a steering system that is not connected to the front wheels, and the engine note played through the speaker system?!?!?!?!
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      10-03-2012, 11:58 AM   #48
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235i Gran Coupe might be my next car

E46 size, beautiful shape, and modern engines? Sign me up
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      10-03-2012, 12:03 PM   #49
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BMW "premium feel" in small segment usually means high price, BMW badge and often weird styling.

Audi does "premium feel" much better in small cars segment. It's interiors quality is superb through the range (look at A1) and while they also charge quite a bit, at least you get almost A8 quality cabin in a small city car. Unfortunately when it comes to 1 series the cabin materials are certainly not 7 or even 5 series good. It's just "premium" price.
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      10-03-2012, 01:06 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
But GST is designed to be more sporting and innovative to the customer.
One promise is made no matter if the car is FWD or RWD BMW aim to offer customers the most sporting , dynamic , innovative and exciting propositions in the entry segment.

The 2er Gran Coupe and 2er Gran Sport Tourer are exclusively RWD.

By making the 2er Gran Coupe RWD it sends out a strong message to the FWD competition the 2er will face namely the Mercedes-Benz CLA and Audi A3Sedan.
Finally the BMW direction got their wits back
It's better to make compact cars longer outside and with rear wheel drive than implementing front wheel drive and getting lost in the Audi&Co mess.
Mercedes A class has only a badge that makes it different from VW Golf, Audi A3 and even Hyundai in next 5 years.
Maybe the BMW heads are going to repent the greed and continue to make 1 series and even the 1GT Van with a rear wheel drive.
Perception is everything when you're in a crowded marketplace and want to be different.
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      10-03-2012, 01:48 PM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by research View Post
BMW "premium feel" in small segment usually means high price, BMW badge and often weird styling.

Audi does "premium feel" much better in small cars segment. It's interiors quality is superb through the range (look at A1) and while they also charge quite a bit, at least you get almost A8 quality cabin in a small city car. Unfortunately when it comes to 1 series the cabin materials are certainly not 7 or even 5 series good. It's just "premium" price.
This is true, just because I want a smaller car doesn't mean I don't want leather or features that are just as nice as the 7. Even if I won the lottery I wouldn't buy a 7 just because it's way too big for me, but I would love to have ventilated seats, soft grain leather or the B&O sound system in my M2 and would gladly pay for the option.
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      10-03-2012, 02:10 PM   #52
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I doubt you'll see "as nice as the 7", if the 3 series got a mass market dashboard and central console with cheap looking parts; the 3 series got out this year and is the most important car in the lineup
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      10-03-2012, 02:17 PM   #53
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This is all so very confusing !! Why is BMW doing all this bs?? 2 series 1 ,3?? Are they gonna make a 1/2series ??
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      10-03-2012, 02:27 PM   #54
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Go sit in it with that Helmet on and then go drive it. Not much room and any taller than you and you are completely screwed.

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Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
I think the motor seems very well suited for the purpose. It is a high revving naturally aspirated engine. For me 150 hp would be enough, so 200 hp is more than I need. The important thing is that the power is delivered immediately after stepping on the throttle. In my F20, there seems to be a one second delay, which is a real killjoy.

And some of my friends are rather tall. I am 189 cm myself, and one friend who is 196 cm fits just fine. There is even room for a helmet. He will probably buy a Toyota GT86, having driven only BMWs for 20 years or so.
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      10-03-2012, 02:36 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frosty View Post
"Given BMW's design director Adrian Van Hooydunk's admiration for the Hyundai Veloster . The 2er Gran Sport Tourer aims to enhance that level of individuality but offer customers the exciting profile of a Coupe and sports tourer, "

...I spit out my drink reading this... VH has lost his mind... this is desire by marketing panel not aesthetics...
The Hyundai Veloster is actually a great looking little car with very decent sporting dynamics and far more communication for the driver than an equivalent Audi. I like cars that dare to do something different and stress individuality over the conventional option.

The genes from the Gran Sport Tourer actually manifest themselves within the BMW 2002 and the sporting Coupe like Touring models.
But GST is designed to be more sporting and innovative to the customer.
One promise is made no matter if the car is FWD or RWD BMW aim to offer customers the most sporting , dynamic , innovative and exciting propositions in the entry segment.
Cars are more personal today especially as technology progresses, the car is no longer that tool for A-B. Style , individuality, driveability and innovation is what signifies the expression of the car in this age and especially a BMW.

The 2er Gran Coupe and 2er Gran Sport Tourer are exclusively RWD.
That is brought on by the fact that BMW customers would prefer a small four door sports sedan but only if it is rear wheel drive.
By making the 2er Gran Coupe RWD it sends out a strong message to the FWD competition the 2er will face namely the Mercedes-Benz CLA and Audi A3Sedan that BMW are targeting enthusiasts with what they want from a small sedan.
The Veloster is a car that has been highly criticized for the lack of sporting dynamics. I hate Audi, However I have driven the closest Audi we in the usa have to the Veloster (A3) and I have driven the Veloster. The Audi is the better drive without question. Also, since you work for BMW I would expect a little more professionalism. Low cuts are not what BMW does.

Moving on...... keep the weight low, have an I6 option, have a manual option, and work on the steering some more and it will be an epic car.
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      10-03-2012, 03:18 PM   #56
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"for the customer that likes Coupe looks and performance but needs that extra practicality but finds the current 3er out of range or too large for their needs."

yep - spot on there. this has a home in my garage.

btw - anyone notice the 3er GT in Scott's sig? anyone else hate it as much as me?
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      10-03-2012, 03:25 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by red-sauerkraut View Post
Go sit in it with that Helmet on and then go drive it. Not much room and any taller than you and you are completely screwed.
My local dealer has brought in a demo car with automatic gearbox. I'll wait until they get one with manual gearbox before taking it for a test drive (I'm sure they will be worried if I show up with my helmet). But several people taller than me claimed there was enough space inside, and they struggle in many other cars.

I guess body proportions and seating position can cause a lot of variation here.

But I hope BMW can make a competitior for the GT86, so I don't have to consider the Toyota....
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      10-03-2012, 03:27 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bimmerjph View Post
Moving on...... keep the weight low, have an I6 option, have a manual option, and work on the steering some more and it will be an epic car.
And please bring back the limited slip differential, at least as an option.
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      10-03-2012, 04:29 PM   #59
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I think what is most important is for BMW to keep the upcoming 2 and new 1 the same size forever. They need something small for small families or those who like small cars. Outside of a z4 you have no options with BMW. I know the industry as a whole has made larger cars but there is nothing wrong with a small car. Heck Nissan made the 370 smaller than the 350. If they make a 2 small like an e36-e46 sized car with a nice sleek roof line they can really hit it out of the park in my book. I don't know if that would sell enough to make money but I can hope. I like the size of the 1m but I do think it's a little tall.
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      10-03-2012, 04:54 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by research

BMW "premium feel" in small segment usually means high price, BMW badge and often weird styling.

Audi does "premium feel" much better in small cars segment. It's interiors quality is superb through the range (look at A1) and while they also charge quite a bit, at least you get almost A8 quality cabin in a small city car. Unfortunately when it comes to 1 series the cabin materials are certainly not 7 or even 5 series good. It's just "premium" price.

I would agree with you, if you were referring to the old models
It is obvious you have not sat in a F20 / F21.
It is now 5 series (5 star) interior quality finish and feel.

I think BMW has finally woken up to the fact that they had to lift their game or get left behind.

My F20 125i M Sport is a hands down winner
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      10-03-2012, 05:04 PM   #61
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Fantastic news about the 2-series Gran Coupe and the M2 Gran Coupe. Even the 2-series Gran Coupe Touring sounds interesting (though I doubt we'd get that in the US). This is definitely a market segment I can get behind.

Looking forward to hearing more.
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      10-03-2012, 05:50 PM   #62
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Look, I need the M235i coupe or the 228i M sport coupe or M2 coupe on these shores before we start talking about cars that will get here when I am underground.
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      10-03-2012, 06:52 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpine92m3 View Post
This is all so very confusing !! Why is BMW doing all this bs?? 2 series 1 ,3?? Are they gonna make a 1/2series ??
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      10-03-2012, 07:09 PM   #64
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That's part about showing up to the dealer with a helmet is funny.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ovekvam View Post
...I'm sure they will be worried if I show up with my helmet... But I hope BMW can make a competitior for the GT86, so I don't have to consider the Toyota....
IF they do it will be so many years away you might as well buy the 86 in the mean time. If you don't mind only 200hp.
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      10-03-2012, 07:28 PM   #65
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I would like to think and certainly hope this does not start a precedence, on the back of a probable future success for BMW in the FWD market, where the future 1/2 series in 2018/2019 will all become FWD bar the likes of M1/M2.

This is what I fear and fully expect it to become a reality through clever marketing to the masses in the next couple of years. Time............
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      10-03-2012, 07:30 PM   #66
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