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2Addicts | BMW 2-Series forum BMW 2 Series (F22) Forum BMW 2 Series Coupe and Cabriolet (F22/F23) General Forum Enhancing Desire: The Sporty BMW 2 Series Coupe, Cabrio, M235i, M2, Sedan Gran Coupe

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      04-25-2012, 06:49 AM   #45
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I dont see any problem with all the model designations. Remember, this is all a $ thing. The 2,4,6,x4,x6 will rake in the dough simply on the premise of charging more for people willing to pay for style. True they will have nicer interiors, more std sporting options, but there will be negligible difference in platform or R&D expense on bmw s part. Bmw will make a killing on these models, just like the other poster stated about the audi a5.

For those who place a priority on style, why not gouge them a little bit
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      04-25-2012, 06:57 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
The front of the 1er has not been universally accepted by a minority
:confuse d0068:

Oh my God!! dude.......wake up!!!
....u sound like politician. Sad
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      04-25-2012, 08:09 AM   #47
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Originally Posted by ATX78703 View Post
I dont see any problem with all the model designations. Remember, this is all a $ thing. The 2,4,6,x4,x6 will rake in the dough simply on the premise of charging more for people willing to pay for style. True they will have nicer interiors, more std sporting options, but there will be negligible difference in platform or R&D expense on bmw s part. Bmw will make a killing on these models, just like the other poster stated about the audi a5.

For those who place a priority on style, why not gouge them a little bit
I totally get that. The only difference with the A5 is that is was a completely new model. The 4er will be rebranding the 3er coupe which has so much heritage. Plus 3 sounds much better. I think M4 sounds awful.

I guess the way BMW are looking at it is existing 3er customers won't stop buying the 4er just because of the name change and they can now attract new sales with the image change.
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      04-25-2012, 08:23 AM   #48
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All this talk about the 1 series. After seeing the new A-class in the flesh, I would be all over the 1er. Seriously, while the A-Class looked better to me in photos, in the flesh, it looks like a mini-minivan to me! Nothing sporty about it. A real let down.

Reading between the lines of what Scott26 posted, BMW is going to tone down the front-end of the 1 series. Good move. The current 1 series coupe is a small darling and this car has a lot of promise. I am interested to see if I will go with a 3 series coupe or the new series, er, 4 and 2 series I suppose?
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      04-25-2012, 08:55 AM   #49
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Scary... What's next? The 2.5series?
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      04-25-2012, 08:56 AM   #50
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Originally Posted by Propagator View Post
Also, as far as I'm concerned BMW never really took advantage of the opportunity to (re-)capture the enthusiasts' heart with the 1er, given that they are very much set on turning the 3er into the 5er of two generations ago ... Wouldn't it be only logical to then turn the 1er into something more like the old-school 3er, with more engaging dynamics, less insulation / weight, and more aggressive chassis tuning? ... So if the 2 series really materializes, here is hoping that it would be a purer, more engaging expression of the BMW-ness, sans the stupid headlights.
+1

I was quite intrigued by the new 3 before it arrived (particularly the new 300bhp/40mpg Straight 6), and i was kinda liking the Tron-esque snout. But seeing it in the real world it's MASSIVE (like, visible-from-space huge)! Also the front end is hideous, lights on. But mostly it's just far too big to own in a city.

Basically, my current E46 Compact is an ideal car except for 2 things - not particularly modern performance and efficiency, and no rear doors. The obvious choice would be the M135i 5-door when it arrives, but... well, it just looks wrong. Like a pygmy hippo, almost. And having spent a day with an E82, it doesn't feel as nicely bloted together as the E46.

Now, if BMW could make a 4-door with the build quality and lines of a 3, but with a footprint closer to that of a 1er, then I'd be first in line. I'd even pay 3-series money for it!
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      04-25-2012, 09:32 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by SCOTT26 View Post
A Small RWD sedan is not condsidered by BMW in the long term as they need to protect the 3er and its large fleet market share, something that projections show that the Audi A3 Sedan and Mercedes CLA could eat into the C-Klasse and A4 respectively especially in the highly contested fleet market where the larger cars are more profitable. But the desire of such small sedan-Coupe concepts has not gone unnoticed. Especially for markets like the US and China.
I am pleased to see BMW is acknowledging the need for a sub-3 Series sedan. It may very well be that the upcoming Audi and Mercedes products in this segment will eat into their bread and butter sedan sales as you say, however, in the US at least, I could easily see the lost volume for the A4 and C more than offset by the sales of the smaller cars. The A3 sedan in particular appears to be set for a very successful career. There is so much potential there. When you consider Mini sold almost 60k vehicles in the US last year, there is a clearly huge market for small luxury FWD cars. While Audi's A3 hatchback has not resonated too loudly with consumers in the US, an A3 sedan surely will.

Either of the potential ideas you mention for BMW's approach would seem to be step in the right direction, although as an enthusiast I admit I would really only be interested in a RWD model.
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      04-25-2012, 10:05 AM   #52
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Originally Posted by hks786 View Post
I totally get that. The only difference with the A5 is that is was a completely new model. The 4er will be rebranding the 3er coupe which has so much heritage. Plus 3 sounds much better. I think M4 sounds awful.

I guess the way BMW are looking at it is existing 3er customers won't stop buying the 4er just because of the name change and they can now attract new sales with the image change.
True, Audi didn't have a real coupe for a long time until the A5 arrived. I guess this is more of a rebrand, rebadge deal for BMW.
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      04-25-2012, 10:19 AM   #53
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I reckon this {ed: keeping 1 series front end} will be unavoidable with them borrowing heavily (if not in entirety) from the 1 series. Was the case with previous 1 series + current coupe / vert. Prove me wrong BMW.
It is true that the E82 and E88 1 Series coupe and convertible share most of their styling with the old E81 and E87 1 Series hatchbacks. However, you must keep in mind that this family of vehicles was actually conceived before the E9x family (hence the numbering), which was the first time BMW produced vehicles under the same series designation with vastly diverging styling (i.e. almost nothing aesthetic shared between E90/1 and the E92/3).

So, even if there were to be no name change ahead, I think we could expect the new two door F22/3 models to differ from the three and five door F20/1 siblings. This is just as we fully expect the same for the F32/3 to, like the E9x before them, share nothing with the F30/1.

With the name change coming if rumors hold true, it would virtually guarantee the completely divergent styling direction. I.e, just like the 5 and 6 today and in their last generation, we could fully expect that neither the 1 and 2 nor the 3 and 4 will share any sheetmetal, nor interior layout for that matter, with one another.
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      04-25-2012, 10:23 AM   #54
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every article I see is refering to the Mercedes CLA as a small car, but its dimensions are practically the same as a C Class, except its not as tall! Its actually the same length and wider than a C Class, just a few inches shorter in height. To me the CLA would compete with the upcoming 4 series GC not a 2 series GC. Now the Audi A3 sedan is smaller than the A4 so that is a different segment. Of course the Mercedes is just a concept right now so who knows how it will be branded in the future.
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      04-25-2012, 11:03 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hks786 View Post
+1

I really hate the 2 series and 4 series names. M235i sounds awful. I think M4 is the worst though, simply unforgivable.
Try 235i series Mcoupe Xdrive. Or M235d Xdrive. Or 235i Xdrive Sport-line M Performance package Convertible.
You get the idea.
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      04-25-2012, 11:13 AM   #56
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The M Sport F20/ 21 looks great and aggressive
The future 2 series will have a little better performances but for sure will have a better succes than this current generation
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      04-25-2012, 12:30 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 宝马.e90 View Post
+1.



I can't tell if you're being sarcastic, serious but I strongly disagree. A base 128i here in Canada is already $36,000. Add in the premium package at the least and it prices over $42k (not including costs/taxes). We won't even discuss a 135. $42k for a 1-Series. You could get a base 320/323/328, a "real" BMW with that kind of money.

Your statement is categorizing what BMW should be, not what it is. If anything the 1-Series is becoming, if not already, the car BMW has always been known for - sporty and compact that has that raw driving feel (see: 1M), not like the other BMW models that are getting more and more computer-influenced each generation. I don't know how it is there but people who drive a 1-Series here are labelled many things but not being able to afford a "real" BMW isn't one of them.
Everyone knows the 323/328i auto is the poser car anyways. The lease rates are so low.

If you think about it, why would a 1-series be for people who can't afford a 3-series? The 3-series is only slightly more and offers wayyy more practicality and higher "status". It's much more wise to purchase a 3-series in an economic sense.

If anything, the 1-series is for people who like the design (a minority) and are willing to pay for it.
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      04-25-2012, 01:01 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Raine View Post
Everyone knows the 323/328i auto is the poser car anyways. The lease rates are so low.

If you think about it, why would a 1-series be for people who can't afford a 3-series? The 3-series is only slightly more and offers wayyy more practicality and higher "status". It's much more wise to purchase a 3-series in an economic sense.

If anything, the 1-series is for people who like the design (a minority) and are willing to pay for it.
Or the 1M, which is just fantastic.
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      04-25-2012, 10:49 PM   #59
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Great post, but doesn't the f20 have almost the same interior layout as the f30, correct me if I'm wrong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkoesel View Post
It is true that the E82 and E88 1 Series coupe and convertible share most of their styling with the old E81 and E87 1 Series hatchbacks. However, you must keep in mind that this family of vehicles was actually conceived before the E9x family (hence the numbering), which was the first time BMW produced vehicles under the same series designation with vastly diverging styling (i.e. almost nothing aesthetic shared between E90/1 and the E92/3).

So, even if there were to be no name change ahead, I think we could expect the new two door F22/3 models to differ from the three and five door F20/1 siblings. This is just as we fully expect the same for the F32/3 to, like the E9x before them, share nothing with the F30/1.

With the name change coming if rumors hold true, it would virtually guarantee the completely divergent styling direction. I.e, just like the 5 and 6 today and in their last generation, we could fully expect that neither the 1 and 2 nor the 3 and 4 will share any sheetmetal, nor interior layout for that matter, with one another.
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      04-25-2012, 11:30 PM   #60
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Why did I buy an E82 1 series? Mechanical power steering, better brakes, short shifter, slightly louder exhaust. All standard, for many thousand cheaper than a 335i. If the new 235i (or M235i) follows this same formula to keep the baby turbo Bimmer as the true driver's car in the lineup (not including M cars, of course), BMW can count on me buying another one.
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      04-26-2012, 12:22 AM   #61
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BMW needs to keep 1 series as 1 and 3 series as 3. This is ridiculous and this one looks terrible.
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      04-26-2012, 12:25 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by Mako View Post
every article I see is refering to the Mercedes CLA as a small car, but its dimensions are practically the same as a C Class, except its not as tall! Its actually the same length and wider than a C Class, just a few inches shorter in height. To me the CLA would compete with the upcoming 4 series GC not a 2 series GC. Now the Audi A3 sedan is smaller than the A4 so that is a different segment. Of course the Mercedes is just a concept right now so who knows how it will be branded in the future.
can someone explain to me what the difference in the 3 Series and 4 Series GC will be? Isnt the 4 series a coupe version of the 3 series? So what the heck is the 4 series GC going to be????
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      04-26-2012, 07:22 AM   #63
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Quote:
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Great post, but doesn't the f20 have almost the same interior layout as the f30, correct me if I'm wrong.
Layout was a poor choice of words. What I really meant was the interior aesthetic itself - i.e. the shape or the cockpits, the surfaces and, other interior elements.

Also, I was a bit unclear with the way I phrased the sentence itself . What I meant was, in the same way that the 5 and 6 are completely divergent today (both in interior and exterior), so should we expect a 3 vs. a 4 to be, and similarly a 1 vs. a 2 (should such vehicles come to pass). I.e. I was not trying to draw a comparison between the 1 (F20) to the 3 (F30).
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      04-26-2012, 07:29 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by YOLO89 View Post
BMW needs to keep 1 series as 1 and 3 series as 3. This is ridiculous and this one looks terrible.
To be clear, neither the 1 Series nor 3 Series are going away. Rather, the proposal within BMW is to move all two door vehicles (and four door coupes that are based directly on such two-door vehicles) to even numbered product names. Sedans, wagons, and hatchbacks would remain odd-numbered. In other words, the idea is to take the pattern established with the 5 Series and 6 Series and have that propigate to the rest of the lineup in a consistent manner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by d3UCE818 View Post
can someone explain to me what the difference in the 3 Series and 4 Series GC will be? Isnt the 4 series a coupe version of the 3 series? So what the heck is the 4 series GC going to be????
Have a good look at an F10 5 Series Sedan and an F08 6 Series Gran Coupe. You should be able to spot the differences right away (as there are many more of them than there are similarities). Now, imagine that same strategy applied to the smaller passenger cars in the lineup.
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      04-26-2012, 10:32 AM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kabawi91
Not liking the route of having several different models/series
Seriously, just stick to 1,3,5,6,7,x3,x5,x6 and z
The 2,4 and x1 seem pointless to me.
Wholeheartedly agree!
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      04-27-2012, 10:59 AM   #66
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man i miss the good old days where there was a 3,5 and 7 series. O and the x5 too.
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